Jeffrey Orling Wrote:I call them cartoons... but I could call them sketches. That hardly matters. Like all drawings they are abstract graphics representations. I deal with drawings all the time and they are not reality.... nor are formulas reality... just another form of abstraction. as the core was destroyed column by column, or it was losing strength and lost its load carrying capacity that had to be picked up by the facade columns... the load was not disappearing. The loads were redistributed through the horizontal members including the hat truss. That is to say if you severed the columns several stories below the HT those still attached above the severed columns who have the part of the floor loads and their own weight and this load would then be hanging from the HT ... the columns would switch from compression members to tension ones. If he column splices held then the weight would add a series of concentrated loads to the bottom chord of the HT and these would add load the bearing points of the HT or the truss itself would fail and collapse. My hunch is that there would have been a very rapid increase in load and it would result in some buckling of the facade at some of the bearing locations of the HT.

As we can't see how the damage / weakening progressed we can't know precisely how loads were redistributed.. and I don't believe all the core columns of this region have been recovered and analyzed. That would show if there were explosive devices or if the core columns failed from heat, distortion, warping and connection failures. The pre release movements suggests a failure PROCESS over time not an instantaneous one... but the moment of release was when aggregate capacity dropped below the aggregate service load... and the failure raced through all remaining load bearing columns.

It seems that you allow yourself much more freedom in your explanation than science would allow. Hence, your your convoluted explanation ..... is inappropriate, as that did not happen in real life.

Jeffrey Orling Wrote:Gladio was created after WWII as a check by the right on the leftists who were being supported by the USSR. The left had popular support... and communists were and are a recognized party in Italy for sure. My deceased brother in law was involved in the communist party in Tuscany and was a marxist economist. The right of course fear the left and their fascist pro capitalist view of the world was diametrically opposed to the communists. In the US we had the idiotic red scare of HUAC... the right was on a hunt to get the left. And so intel decided to engage in a series of terrorist attacks blame it on the left to turn the people against the left and demand the state crack down on them. Nasty SOBs. They infiltrated the red brigades and the bider meinhof.

This strategy turned out to be rather effective especially when the truth of who did what was concealed by the right who were in power and it was not in their interest to reveal it. False flags have been used at times to create excuses for militarist adventurism. Terrorism by definition is meant to instill fear in the public. But fear of what or whom? The guys with the mic get to tell the story. In fact, the guys with the mic ALWAYS get to tell the story.

It's hard to deny hive mentality or group think. People identify with a group and share its values and goals and so forth. They don't have to read and rehearse talking points... only talking heads do that. All people inside the MIC partake in the same (more or less) hive behavior and thinking. In fact.. they all know who the enemy is... how could they not? When you are a hammer... every problem looks like a nail and you slam it as the hammer that you are.

Of course Gladio was a fascist series of MIHOPs... they've got the admissions and documents to prove it. And it's likely that the practice continues because intel is engaged in criminality and black ops and ALL CRIMINALS try to pin the blame on someone else... or at least have an alibi... but better to have some one else framed and that settles that. LHO was a patsy wasn't he? Having one was part of closing the book and dead ending the investigation... killing him AND Ruby etc.. made that so much easier. Destroy evidence and it makes solving the crime harder and less certain.

Jeffrey Orling Wrote:Gladio was created after WWII as a check by the right on the leftists who were being supported by the USSR.

Jan Klimkowski Wrote:Jeffrey - I'm following the development of your knowledge and thinking about Gladio closely. You still fail to understand the nature of Gladio "stay behind" structures, and try to define false flag and Gladio in ways which are incorrect in both historical and deep political ways.

Let's start with this statement.

In what sense was Gladio intended as a "check" on left wing political activity?

Also, what do you mean by "the right" and in what sense did "the right" create Gladio?

Jeffrey Orling Wrote:

Jan Klimkowski Wrote:Jeffrey - I'm following the development of your knowledge and thinking about Gladio closely. You still fail to understand the nature of Gladio "stay behind" structures, and try to define false flag and Gladio in ways which are incorrect in both historical and deep political ways.

Let's start with this statement.

In what sense was Gladio intended as a "check" on left wing political activity?

Also, what do you mean by "the right" and in what sense did "the right" create Gladio?

Jan,

I have not extensively studied history post WWII in Europe and my understanding of what Gladio was is based on the material I happened to come across and my own interpretation of it. I was not there, I gathered no evidence and so I make no claims that I or for that matter someone who did not know this up close and personal can claim to know the "truth".

As I stated my understanding is that post WWII in the period of the cold war the right (do I have to define that?) was both trying to dominate and this including suppressing the left... not simply defeating it in fair and square elections in the European "democracies". The far right of course has no use for democracy or care for the people, except to exploit them for labor... The left opposed top down authoritarian structures and is anti capitalist as capitalism represents the struggle between the capitalist (oppressors) and the workers (the oppressed).

There were groups at the far ends of the political spectrum advocating for their vision. The right engaged in what amounts to false flag terrorist activities to shatter the left and turn the population against it and fear violence which they were made to believe was coming from the left. The idea (presumably) was that this false understanding would lead to the people asking for and accepting more authoritarian control to maintain security and tranquility. And more power and an authoritarian model was what the right was after. My sense was these FF terrorist attacks did move people away from support of the left. But perhaps I am wrong.

The so called stay behind structures... such as US troops and bases and so forth were part of the cold war strategy to prevent the USSR from trying to extend their influence to Europe. And the various proxy wars were much the same for SE Asia etc. The do called domino theory was advanced and used as an excuse for these wars which as well all know benefit on the MIC. Fear is the greatest motivator of human behavior and Gladio leveraged this concept.

Jan Klimkowski Wrote:At its most fundamental level, Gladio is not about right-wing or left-wing politics.

Gladio, and its successor operations, are about Power and Control.

Jeffrey Orling Wrote:

Jan Klimkowski Wrote:At its most fundamental level, Gladio is not about right-wing or left-wing politics.

Gladio, and its successor operations, are about Power and Control.

And I will assert that "power and control" are the currency of the right.

Tony Szamboti Wrote:[
The horizontal propagation was extraordinarily rapid across the 98th floor (about 0.7 seconds), where no core columns had been affected by the aircraft and no more than two perimeter columns, as only the very end of the wing hit that floor. Doesn't that give you pause in your arbitrary assignment of severe column load capacity degradation?

Jan Klimkowski Wrote:

Jeffrey Orling Wrote:

Jan Klimkowski Wrote:At its most fundamental level, Gladio is not about right-wing or left-wing politics.

Gladio, and its successor operations, are about Power and Control.

And I will assert that "power and control" are the currency of the right.

What does this mean?

What is "the right"?

In what sense is Power and Control the "currency" of whatever the right is?