Quote:Charlie and Jim and Sirhan

Phil Dragoo Wrote:Anthony

You mention Peter Levenda. I just heard of his Ratline whose Chapter Ten investigates whether Hitler, using a body double, escaped to the Philippines.

The skull in Russian possession presenting female DNA.

Adrian Mack Wrote:Has anyone read Nikolas Schreck's The Manson File?

I haven't, so I'm probably fudging some of this, but broadly I believe Schreck's hypothesis is that the Mob-Hollywood establishment closed ranks to protect its investment with Bugliosi and the LAPD presenting the cover story. These murders would have blown the lid off the sprawling decadence behind the scenes, with all sides known to each other and much cozier than anyone could admit. Watson and Manson were procuring for the likes of Polanski and Tate, Sebring and Frykowski were dealers, as was Rosemary LaBianca. At some point a war broke out. Schreck contends that Watson was actually invited to the Tate residence that night, but he intended to steal their supply. Tex was speeding, he freaked out, and the killings happened. Charlie went back with them to rearrange the scene in an effort to leave a false trail. The LaBiancas (I believe) owed them money, and the idea was to take Rosemary hostage. Things went wrong again.

Schreck spent a lot of time with Charlie (and compiled the book over some 25 years). He allows that Charlie had some native shamanic talent and is a true seeker on some level, but was fated to the life he ended up with. He says Charlie's a bad guy, sure, but Tex was the real deal.

Those Hollywood years were promising for a spell. Dennis Wilson (among others) was far more involved than we've been told, and his sad demise was driven by guilt. Official history tells us that Charlie's music career was a non-starter but it seems that a lot of people got behind the guy, and not just Dennis and Terry Melcher. Charlie's "career" actually had some gas. When the time came to anoint a patsy, Charlie was a natural, what with a personality like that and a basic criminal code of ethics that always prevented him from snitching.

I don't know if Schreck gives much or any credence to the intel-programmed-whatever angle; I think it's all just a big ol' criminal underworld massacre in his view, but it happened under the bright lights of America's entertainment industry, which threw a whole bunch of other weirdness into the picture. That said, there's no question that Charlie bumped up against some very suspect characters in his institutional journey. One other thing to note: Schreck, who is married to the daughter of Anton LaVey, dismisses the occult angle as sensationalism.

But no matter which theory compels the most, and returning to Jim's question... Helter Skelter is a lie.

It's in a bunch of different parts, but you'll find a fascinating three hour interview given by Nikolas Schreck to Tate Labianca Radio (TLB Radio) starting here (and again, apologies if I got some of the details wrong):

[video]https://www.youtube.com/user/TheNikolasSchreck?feature=watch[/video]

Jan Klimkowski Wrote:

Adrian Mack Wrote:.....One other thing to note: Schreck, who is married to the daughter of Anton LaVey, dismisses the occult angle as sensationalism......

....Yes, once again, Helter Skelter is a lie, and Bugliosi's garbage is a limited hangout.

The question is: How Limited was the Official Narrative?.....

Magda Hassan Wrote:

Jan Klimkowski Wrote:

Adrian Mack Wrote:.....One other thing to note: Schreck, who is married to the daughter of Anton LaVey, dismisses the occult angle as sensationalism......

....Yes, once again, Helter Skelter is a lie, and Bugliosi's garbage is a limited hangout.

The question is: How Limited was the Official Narrative?.....

And Anton LaVey's ex Barbara marries Ted Gunderson. Small world.

Quote:See: Naval Intelligence, MKUltra and the Hippie Movement

Quote:Meanwhile, elsewhere in the world in those early months of 1965, a new scene' is just beginning to take shape in the city of Los Angeles. In a geographically and socially isolated community known as Laurel Canyon a heavily wooded, rustic, serene, yet vaguely ominous slice of LA nestled in the hills that separate the Los Angeles basin from the San Fernando Valley musicians, singers and songwriters suddenly begin to gather as though summoned there by some unseen Pied Piper. Within months, the hippie/flower child' movement will be given birth there, along with the new style of music that will provide the soundtrack for the tumultuous second half of the 1960s.

An uncanny number of rock music superstars will emerge from Laurel Canyon beginning in the mid-1960s and carrying through the decade of the 1970s. The first to drop an album will be The Byrds, whose biggest star will prove to be David Crosby. The band's debut effort, "Mr. Tambourine Man," will be released on the Summer Solstice of 1965. It will quickly be followed by releases from the John Phillips-led Mamas and the Papas ("If You Can Believe Your Eyes and Ears," January 1966), Love with Arthur Lee ("Love," May 1966), Frank Zappa and The Mothers of Invention ("Freak Out," June 1966), Buffalo Springfield, featuring Stephen Stills and Neil Young ("Buffalo Springfield," October 1966), and The Doors ("The Doors," January 1967).

Quote:The popular view of Charlie "Helter Skelter" Manson came entirely from Susan Atkins' save-her-own-neck LA Times article which Bugliosi exploited to the max.