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Fred Lee Crisman - Printable Version

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Fred Lee Crisman - Linda Minor - 16-04-2009

by John A. Keel "The Man who invented flying saucers - Raymond A. Palmer". Whole Earth Review. FindArticles.com. 15 Apr, 2009. http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1510/is_vNON4/ai_4436780/

...By the end of 1945, Amazing Stories was selling 250,000 copies per month, an amazing circulation for a science fiction pulp magazine. Palmer sat up late at night, rewriting Shaver's material and writing other short stories about the Deros under pseudonyms. Thousands of letters poured into the office. Many of them offered supporting "evidence" for the Shaver stories, describing strange objects they had seen in the sky and strange encounters they had had with alien beings. It seemed that many thousands of people were aware of the existence of some distinctly nonterrestrial group in our midst. Paranoid fantasies were mixed with tales that had the uncomfortable ring of truth. The "Letters-to-the-Editor" section was the most interesting part of the publication. Here is a typical contribution from the issue for June 1946:
Sirs:
I flew my last combat mission on May 26, [1945] when I was shot up over Bassein and ditched my ship in Ramaree Roads off Chedubs Island. I was missing five days. I requested leave at Kashmere (sic). I and Capt. (deleted by request) left Srinagar and went to Rudok then through the Khese pass to the northern foothills of the Karakoram. We found what we were looking for. We knew what we were searching for.

For heaven's sake, drop the whole thing! You are playing with dynamite. My companion and I fought our way out of a cave with submachine guns. I have two 9" scars on my left arm that came from wounds given me in the cave when I was 50 feet from a moving object of any kind and in perfect silence. The muscles were nearly ripped out. How? I don't know. My friend has a hole the size of a dime in his right bicep. It was seared inside. How we don't know. But we both believe we know more about the Shaver Mystery than any other pair.

You can imagine my fright when I picked up my first copy of Amazing Stories and see you splashing words about on the subject.
The identity of the author of this letter was withheld by request. Later Palmer revealed his name: Fred Lee Crisman. He had inadvertently described the effects of a laser beam -- even though the laser wasn't invented until years later. Apparently Crisman was obsessed with Deros and death rays long before Kenneth Arnold sighted the "first" UFO in June 1947....


Fred Lee Crisman - Linda Minor - 16-04-2009

Linda Minor Wrote:The "Letters-to-the-Editor" section was the most interesting part of the publication. Here is a typical contribution from the issue for June 1946:
Sirs:
I flew my last combat mission on May 26, [1945] when I was shot up over Bassein and ditched my ship in Ramaree Roads off Chedubs Island. I was missing five days. I requested leave at Kashmere (sic). I and Capt. (deleted by request) left Srinagar and went to Rudok then through the Khese pass to the northern foothills of the Karakoram. We found what we were looking for. We knew what we were searching for.

For heaven's sake, drop the whole thing! You are playing with dynamite. My companion and I fought our way out of a cave with submachine guns. I have two 9" scars on my left arm that came from wounds given me in the cave when I was 50 feet from a moving object of any kind and in perfect silence. The muscles were nearly ripped out. How? I don't know. My friend has a hole the size of a dime in his right bicep. It was seared inside. How we don't know. But we both believe we know more about the Shaver Mystery than any other pair.

You can imagine my fright when I picked up my first copy of Amazing Stories and see you splashing words about on the subject.
The identity of the author of this letter was withheld by request. Later Palmer revealed his name: Fred Lee Crisman. ...

http://www.scifi-fantasy-info.com/richard-sharpe-shaver.html

...These Dero still lived in the cave cities, according to Richard Sharpe Shaver, kidnapping surface-dwelling people by the thousands for meat or torture, and using the fantastic "ray" machines that the great ancient races left behind to project tormenting thoughts and voices into our minds. Dero could be blamed for nearly all misfortunes, from minor "accidental" injuries or illnesses to airplane crashes and catastrophic natural disasters. Women especially were singled out for brutal treatment, including rape, and Mike Dash notes that "Sado-masochism was one of the prominent themes of Shaver's writings." Though generally confined to their caves, Richard Sharpe Shaver claimed that the Deros sometimes traveled by spaceships or rockets, and had dealings with equally evil extraterrestrial beings. Shaver claimed first-hand knowledge of the Dero and their caves, insisting he had been their prisoner for several years.

Palmer edited and rewrote the manuscript, increasing the total word count to a novella length 31,000. Palmer insisted that he did nothing to alter the core elements of Richard Sharpe Shaver's story, but that he only added an exciting plot line so the story would not read "like a dull recitation." Retitled "I Remember Lemuria!"; it was published in March, 1945 issue of Amazing. The issue sold out, and generated quite a response: between 1945 and 1949, letters poured in attesting to the truth of Richard Sharpe Shaver's claims (tens of thousands of letters, according to Palmer). The correspondents, too, had heard strange voices or encountered denizens of the hollow Earth.

One of the letters to Amazing was from a woman who claimed to have gone into a deep subbasement of a Paris, France building via a secret elevator. After months of rape and other torture, the woman was freed by a group of Teros. Another letter claiming involvement with Deros came from Fred Crisman, later to gain notoriety for his role in the Maury Island Incident and the John F. Kennedy Assassination....


Fred Lee Crisman - Linda Minor - 16-04-2009

http://efanzines.com/EK/eI41/index.htm

Fred Lee Crisman

One could say that if all it takes is for someone to write about something to make it happen, Buck Rogers can be blamed for flying saucers. He predated The Shaver Mystery. What really turned Rap into the world’s first flying saucer investigator was one Fred L. Crisman of Tacoma, Washington, not Richard S. Shaver.

Nowadays, Crisman is generally deemed a trickster by trade, and a truly shady character. The two things we positively know about him is that he was born in 1919 and died in 1975. Conspiracy buffs and ufologists alike have been trying to unravel his secrets for years. Just Google Crisman’s name and it will spew a bizarre thread that begins with Ray Palmer and the Shaver Mystery.

Crisman is believed by some to have been an OSS and CIA agent, an industrial spy, closely aligned with right-wing extremists, underworld figures, and anti-Castro Cubans who were allegedly involved in the JFK assassination. In 1968 Crisman worked as a right wing “shock jock” hosting a radio talk show in Tacoma. He was subpoenaed by New Orleans District Attorney Jim Garrison during a 1968 investigation into the Kennedy assassination. It has been rumored (even Keel mentioned this) that Crisman was one of the three “tramps” arrested in Dealey Plaza after the murder.

It is also written that during WW II, Crisman came up with a plan to forestall the Nazis’ completion of their atom bomb. He came up with a non-functional “widget,” that was dropped by Allied bombers across Germany as the war ground to its grisly finale. While German scientists wasted valuable time trying to figure out what the widgets were about, we whomped their asses and dropped the A-Bomb on Japan. So the story goes.

Crismanologists all agree that Crisman’s post-war existence was first noted in a published letter in the June 1946 issue of Amazing Stories. At first glance it appeared to be a fantastic corroboration of The Shaver Mystery, detailing the gory details of a dero attack on then Army pilot Crisman and an unnamed captain near Tibet. Wrote Crisman…

“For heaven’s sake, drop the whole thing! [The Shaver Mystery]. My companion and I fought our way out of a cave with sub-machine guns. I have two nine-inch scars on my left arm that came from wounds given me in the cave when I was 50 feet from a moving object of any kind….

“You can imagine my fright when I picked up my first copy of Amazing Stories and see you splashing words about on the subject.”

Anti-Shaverites zeroed in on the letter. Though it appeared to be a validation of Shaver’s claims, critics saw it as one more proof that Rap and his wild-eyed readers were a bunch of nut balls. Years later, Rap said he was actually skeptical of the letter.

“…According to Life magazine, this publisher wanted everybody to believe that the Shaver Mystery was true, and here was some provident proof. But he did nothing, because he didn’t believe a word of Crisman’s letter,” said Rap. 19

There was a follow-up letter from Crisman, too, appearing in the May 1947 issue. Soon after the appearance of the first letter, Harpers magazine published a denunciation of Rap and the Shaver Mystery. The author, S. Baring-Gould, touted Crisman’s letter as an example of the crackpots Rap catered to. Then Crisman himself chimed in!

“I bitterly resent this,” snorted Crisman about the article. “I felt that you too, Mr. Palmer, had more or less given me up for a jerk who was only trying to pull your leg…that maybe all this was only a promotion stunt….”

Whatever Crisman’s motives, one thing is clear; Crisman had already targeted Ray Palmer as part of a grand scheme. What the purpose of this scheme was, not even conspiriologists admit to knowing for sure, though they have their theories. One thing we know for certain is that one month after the appearance of Crisman’s second letter, Ray Palmer got sucked into a black hole that pulled him into an even stranger universe than the Shaver Mystery. This is where his reputation as the world’s first flying saucer investigator really begins.

The Tacoma Incident

We wonder how many of you readers know that at one time Project Blue Book…named your editor as the ‘hoaxer’ who started this whole flying saucer thing? —Rap

Martin Gardner in his book Fads and Fallacies in the Name of Science brushes off the Tacoma Incident, aka the Maury Island Mystery, like it was lint on his collar:

“The entire Maury Island episode later proved to be a hoax elaborately planned by two Tacoma men who hoped to sell the phony yarn to an adventure magazine. Both men eventually made a full confession.” End of story. 20

The key word here is “elaborately,” because Crisman was definitely a pro. Elaborately means he reserved a hotel room for his victim before the victim arrived. Crisman also secured an empty house to set up a phony “secretary” who lived there and “worked on the books” for his phony log-salvaging company. This was a lot of work just to sell a penny-a-word pulp yarn to some adventure magazine; but hey, strange things happen. In any case, let the tale begin.

On June 21, 1947, three days before airplane pilot Kenneth Arnold spied a formation of nine bright objects “skipping like rocks” across water, a very strange event was unfolding near Tacoma, Washington. Featuring all the key elements of future flying saucer lore, it had intrigue, a bugged hotel room, inquisitive newspaper reporters, tragic deaths, Military Intelligence officers, potential Cold War spies, weird saucer debris that was somehow “switched” with phony metal slag, unannounced visits by government secret service agents, and an after-hours burglary of saucer evidence, sinister warnings over the phone, and finally the disappearance of the two men who started the whole thing. Again, in the hope of getting to bed before 3 AM, this has to be a Readers Digest version.

One very special day on Puget Sound harbor near a place called Maury Island, a logger, Harold Dahl by name, his teenage son, the family dog, and two crew members were patrolling for salvage logs in a war surplus mine sweeper, when they witnessed six huge doughnut-shaped craft in the sky.

They estimated the objects, which had a bright metallic sheen, to be about 100 feet in diameter. Five of the things circled a sixth one, which acted differently than the rest, as if it was having some kind of mechanical malfunction.

The crew was then spooked by a loud concussion from the distressed ship, which suddenly discharged vast quantities of metallic “stuff” resembling shreds of aluminum foil and newspaper interspersed with heavier “stuff” like lava rock. All this came raining down on the crew, much to their dismay. The dog was killed by a large piece of the falling debris, and Dahl’s son suffered a severe burn to his arm. The boat’s cabin was significantly damaged.

In the midst of all this chaos, one of the hovering doughnuts approached the sickly, spewing doughnut and somehow “rejuvenated” it, at which point all disks quickly rose into the sky and vanished.

Dahl, on returning home, gave a report to his “boss” Fred L. Crisman. Yes, the very same Fred L. Crisman who sent the letters to Rap a year earlier. He was now in charge of a log salvaging operation in Tacoma Washington! Small world. Or was it a large conspiracy?

Back in Chicago, Rap sat at his desk pondering newspaper reports of Kenneth Arnold’s “flying saucer” sighting near Mt. Rainier. It was June 1947, the same month Rap published Amazing’s highly anticipated all-Shaver Mystery issue.

Then, as was the pattern in Rap’s charmed life, “it” happened. He got a phone call from Tacoma, Washington. Fred L. Crisman was calling. He told Rap that he was ready to hand over the greatest story since, well, never.

At this point we can only ponder why Rap would even consider Crisman’s story if he suspected those previous letters were a hoax, though Rap’s son explains it thusly:

“Ray Palmer [was] a skeptic, but he was not the type of skeptic that would laugh at you and then change your story to make you look foolish,” he said. “He would listen and get as much information as he could and then try to find out how your story is true. Sometimes you find out and sometimes you don’t, but either way you learn more.”

We only ask that you suspend disbelief awhile longer, as Rap did; otherwise the rest of this tale would not have happened.

Rap went right to his typewriter and hammered out a letter to Kenneth Arnold, pleading with him to get in his plane and head to Tacoma to investigate Crisman’s story. He offered him $200, but it took a second letter with even more pleas from Rap, before the world’s most celebrated pilot since Charles Lindberg conceded.

Ken Arnold’s first clue that he was not in control of his situation came when he discovered he had a room already reserved at the Winthrop Hotel in Tacoma. Neither he nor Rap made the arrangements. “Ah, yes,” the desk clerk said to Arnold over the phone, “We have Room 502 reserved in your name!” Maybe it was a different Kenneth Arnold, he thought, since no one other than Rap and Arnold’s family knew he was flying to Tacoma. Oh well, whatever. He took the room.

In due time, Arnold contacted Harold Dahl, who arrived at Room 502 to tell the strange tale of saucer debris, a dead dog, danger, and incredulity. Dahl was full of angst, and seemed reticent to tell the story, warning Arnold that he should just forget the whole thing and fly home.

Next day at 9:30 AM, Fred L. Crisman was banging on the door of Room 502. Arnold described him as a “short, stocky fellow, dark complexioned, a happy-go-lucky appearing person…and extremely alert.” 21 After Crisman’s grand entrance, Dahl faded into the woodwork, spending much of the rest of this story at a local movie theater watching episodes of The Crimson Ghost.

Crisman confirmed Dahl’s story to Arnold and added even more. He said he went to retrieve some of the saucer debris at Maury Island. While there, he too saw one of the doughnut-shaped craft circling the area, and there was no doubt about it, he knew what he saw.

“I hold a commercial pilot’s license,” Crisman informed Arnold. “I flew over a hundred missions in fighter aircraft over Burma in the last war and I feel qualified to describe it accurately.” 22

Arnold, feeling overwhelmed by all the details Crisman was firing at him, called an old friend and commercial pilot, Captain E.J. Smith, for backup. Smith arrived the next day, and heard more of the same from the two “loggers.” Nonetheless, Arnold began to feel uneasy about the two men.

“We both had a peculiar feeling that we were being watched or that there was something dangerous about getting involved with Crisman and Dahl,” he later wrote in The Coming of the Saucers. 23

Smith and Arnold suspected a hoax, or even that Russian espionage was at play. Cold War jitters being what they were, everyone believed it was a good bet the saucers were Soviet secret weapons taken from the Nazis.

Arnold’s paranoia edged a notch further when he got a phone call from an United Press reporter named Ted Morello, who informed him that, “Some crackpot has been phoning us here, telling us verbatim what has been going on in your hotel room for the last day.” 23 Naturally, Crisman and Dahl were the prime suspects, but when both men were present in the hotel room when Morello called again, confirming what had just transpired in the room, Arnold and Smith were dumbfounded. Who was it? How was the information getting out, and to what end?

After a thorough search of the room, Rap’s two saucer investigators were unable to locate the bug they knew must reside in Room 502. Finally, with growing concern for his safety, Arnold called in Military Intelligence.

Within hours, Air Force First Lt. Frank M. Brown and Capt. William L. Davidson arrived from Hamilton AFB in California. After interviewing all concerned, Crisman nearly forced a cardboard box full of the so-called saucer debris on the two officers, which was then loaded onto their B-25 bomber.

Talk of sabotage hit the Washington papers next morning when news that the plane’s left engine had caught fire, and the safety extinguisher failed to operate. Brown and Davidson died when they crashed near Kelso, Washington. The saucer debris was never found in the wreckage. Mysteriously, Crisman and Dahl were never prosecuted for promoting what they later confessed (“allegedly” confessed, say conspiriologists) to FBI agents was a complete hoax that indirectly led to the loss of a newly refurbished B-25 bomber. AF officials said they had traced Crisman’s saucer debris to a Tacoma smelter.

Back in Room 502, Arnold was totally freaked and wanted out. He called Rap and briefed him on the situation. Rap told him to get on his plane and bail.

“He told me to keep the money and…not to carry any of the fragments aboard my plane. He advised me to prevent Smith from taking any fragments. He didn’t tell me why, but I felt the advice was good. Mr. Palmer told me not to become too upset and then I gave the phone to Crisman.” 25

Crisman talked briefly with Rap confirming the plane crash. Arnold claimed later that “Raymond Palmer told me that he recognized Crisman’s voice. He was positive that it was the same voice that had called him long distance on other occasions from various parts of the country. Brother, what a mess.” 26

A witness was said to have spotted Crisman boarding an Army Air Corps plane, destination—Alaska. Dahl simply vanished. Back in Chicago, Rap was left holding the bag. He was now being blamed for perpetrating the greatest hoax since the Shaver Mystery. The new round of criticism only made him dig in his heels. He was convinced something very strange was going on. If the whole thing was a hoax, he wondered why his samples of the so-called smelter slag were stolen from his Ziff-Davis office one night after a visit from an intelligence agent? The agent, he said, was asking questions about the Shaver Mystery.

It was pretty clear that Rap was going to take the hit for Maury Island, and when Edward J. Ruppelt, former head the Air Force’s Project Blue Book, published his “Report on Unidentified Flying Objects” in 1956, Rap endured further public humiliation when Ruppelt declared:

“[Crisman and Dahl] admitted that the rock fragments had nothing to do with flying saucers. They had sent in the rock fragments [to Palmer] as a joke…and said the rock came from a flying saucer because that’s what [Ray Palmer] wanted him to say.” 27

Rap was pissed. “If the Maury Island Incident was a hoax, there is basis to lay it at the door of Fred L. Crisman” he sputtered.

But it moved Rap’s name to the top of the government’s list of “people to keep an eye on,” as Palmer’s son explained to this writer.

“There was a joke at the shop that the way to identify a G-man was to look at his shoes; so whenever one would come we would all lean over and look at the shoes. They came to look at our rocket launching base and radar (which we didn’t have); they came to audit his taxes; they came as postal inspectors and spent three days here only to give him back about 38¢ that was overpaid (but they did look at every name on the mailing list). They planted a false story in the news and all the authorities came down on him only to have them mysteriously leave and never explain to the news why they left with nothing being done.”

Yet, Rap continued his investigating, as well as his crusade against injustice. He also came up with a new slant to his beloved science fiction.

The Coming of the Saucers

The cover of the issue of Amazing Stories that was cancelled.

“We are adding a kind of science fiction … that deals with the new kind of space ship. After all, it’s just not modern to talk of spaceships these days, or of Bob Crosby; but of flying saucers and Elvis Presley!” –Rap

Rap revealed years later that prior to the Tacoma Incident, he was about to release new “evidence” concerning the saucers and much more in a special Amazing Stories flying saucers issue, but never got the chance, thanks to a visit from a Federal agent.

“The Tacoma incident intervened,” he grouched. “The owner of the magazine ordered the special issue halted, killed the Shaver Mystery, and tossed aside a bit of business that had netted him a half million dollars in four years—all the day after a man with a gold badge paid him a visit.” 28

Yes, the Tacoma affair did little to endear Rap to Ziff-Davis. So, in 1949, two years after Maury Island, Kenneth Arnold and Room 502, Rap left Amazing Stories to strike out on his own as an independent publisher. In fact, he started his new career on the sly even before he left Amazing. He founded an sf pulp—Other Worlds Science Stories—and he gambled on Fate magazine, a mystical digest that Rap bet would fill a niche in the publishing field. He was right. Fate struck a chord with a new readership, while newsstand sales for science fiction slowly dried up. TV and the newly emerging paperback houses were blamed.


Rap tried valiantly to drum up interest in his science fiction ’zines with a dizzying array of title and format changes. From October 1953 to April ’54, Other Worlds suddenly became Science Stories. Also in ’53, Rap founded Universe Science Fiction, ran it for ten issues, then changed the name to Other Worlds Science Stories, giving it a larger format in the hopes of making it more noticeable on newsstands; all to no avail.


Meanwhile, Rap’s obsession with flying saucers was growing. His magazine cover art blatantly mirrored this preoccupation. His saucer files were growing almost as fast as his personal file at FBI headquarters. After all, the Feds had concluded in 1947 that Palmer and Shaver were indeed behind flying saucer “hysteria.” The Tacoma Incident further expanded Palmer’s burgeoning file.

Then Rap had a brainstorm. He decided to change Other Worlds Science Stories into Flying Saucers from Other Worlds, filling it with a combination of saucer fiction yarns and factual reports. It was the beginning of his transition from science fiction to saucer and “spiritual” publications, what now is termed “New Age.” For a time, he alternated thetwo zines. One month it was Flying Saucers from Other Worlds, the next it was Other Worlds Science Stories. By this time Rap had accumulated several file cabinets full of saucer documentation. Why not put it to good use? As he often did when he came up with a new idea, he hinted that something extraordinary was about to happen … in the next issue, of course.


“Today we are living the science fiction of yesterday, and now something new is being added —we are living tomorrow’s science fiction too…ahead of time! We have that unexplainable feeling we always get when something big is about to break. We were ‘in on’ the flying saucer mystery before it broke.” 29

What with his shabby treatment after Maury Island, this new plan gave him the perfect soapbox from which to harangue Officialdom and pound the media, and other pundits did not take the subject seriously. In the first issue of Flying Saucers from Other Worlds, Rap angrily struck out at so-called journalists in May of 1957.

“When flying saucers first appeared, no writer had the gumption to sit down and state it was a plain news item. No, they had to make a huge joke out of it…Your editor has a word for that kind of writer, and it’s spelled ‘tramp.’ They ride the fourth estate rails free…Laughing jackasses, the whole lot of them.”


Apparently, only Rap acknowledged his vast contribution to ufology. The ghost of Tacoma still haunted him. He was being snubbed even by Flying saucer organizations like NICAP, who refused to acknowledge his work. Rap concluded NICAP was simply a “mouthpiece for the CIA” in one of his many searing editorials:

“…In spite of the fact that this editor is not only the first flying saucer investigator, but the possessor of the largest private file of saucer information in the world, and the publisher of the only newsstand magazine on flying saucers, and has repeatedly offered to help NICAP, this help being refused.” 30

John A. Keel remained unrepentant of his criticism of Rap’s ufological contribution, as revealed in a 1984 letter to Shavertron, a fanzine dedicated to the Shaver Mystery. Keel was bemoaning an apparent lack of interest in flying saucers at that time, making it more difficult to sell saucer-related material.

“Palmer created and sustained the field of ufology, and modeled it after science fiction fandom,” chided Keel. “If Palmer had not existed, it is very likely that widespread interest in flying saucers would have faded away after 1947. After his death in 1977, ufology and the subject of UFOs has slipped into total limbo…


“Because only a few copies of Amazing Stories from the 1940s remain intact, very few advocates of the Shaver Mystery have had a chance to study them. So the Shaver Mystery itself is now founded on hearsay and myth.

“Keep up the bad work,
“John A. Keel.”

And what of the man who, with one crazy episode, turned Rap into the world’s first flying saucer investigator? As conspiracy history tells us, he was arrested on the grassy knoll as one of the three tramps after JFK’s assassination; he wrote a novel titled Murder of a City about Tacoma dirty politics; he partied with rogues and burned down a building or two; got into S&M: and continued to write occasionally to Rap, no doubt to clinch his reputation as master obscurantist.

“Fred Crisman not only didn’t admit [Maury Island] was a hoax,” writes long-time Crisman researcher Ron Halbritter, “but [in a letter] in the January 1950 issue of Fate he called those accusations a ‘bald-faced lie.’” 31

Halbritter, through extensive use of the Freedom of Information Act, studied Crisman’s FBI file, military records, and even job applications. He has a decidedly different opinion about Palmer’s saucer nemesis.


“Fred Lee Crisman would have you, me, and the rest of the world believe he was a secret agent for some three letter classified group. Crisman was the classic yardbird; injured during WW II, he became addicted to painkillers and spent the remainder of his life trying to hustle to support his habit.

“Crisman always sought to be the center of attention. When Ray Palmer described the Shaver Mystery, he claimed to have been in a dero cave in Kashmir. When Harold Dahl saw a UFO at Maury Island, the next day Crisman claimed, ‘Me, too—when nobody else was around, I did see one.’ While Jim Garrison was seeking Kennedy assassins, he suddenly got an anonymous letter implying Crisman was involved. When Roy Thinnes had a hit television show in 1967 called The Invaders, a letter, allegedly from Harold Dahl, was sent saying that the character David Vincent, and in fact the entire show, was based on Crisman’s life. These are examples of Crisman’s need for fame.”


The Tacoma Incident not only strengthened Rap’s distrust of government authority, it also energized his metaphysical side. He began to publish Mystic and then Search magazines, exploring the shadow world of the occult. He continued publishing Shaver’s mystery, as well as the writings of mystical saucer contactees like Orfeo Angelucci. He started a special feature in Mystic called “The Man From Tomorrow,” in which he predicted future events using his “random thought” technique. More than the predictions themselves, Rap liked the title. “The Man from Tomorrow” was Rap. He liked to think he was just one step ahead of the next big trend…the next big blockbuster.


“Without the Tacoma Incident, the Chicago publisher might finally have given up on the flying saucers, uncertain of the evidence of even his own eyes,” Rap said. “But that one fantastic experience told him that here was a tremendous true thing, of unknown, unpredictable importance on the stage of future history.” 32

And everyone knows future history is where the Man from Tomorrow lives.


Footnotes

1. Interview with Ray B. Palmer, The UFO Forum, http://www.theufoforum.org/Content.html
2. Keel, John, “The Man Who Invented Flying Saucers,” Fortean Times 41, p 52-57
3. Mystic Magazine, April 1955, p 14
4. The Secret World, p 29
5. Ibid. p 28
6. Rap, Amazing editorial, February 1941
7. Actifan: a fan who participates in sf publishing, conventions, clubs. Gafiate: “get away from it all” …meaning to quit fandom. Fugghead: a fan who exhibits behavior so far beyond the pale that even the most liberal fen might raise an eyebrow over it. Fen: plural of fan. Fanfeud: feuds that existed between fen, usually over inane subjects.
8. “Fantastic Adventures with Amazing,” Amazing Stories, January 1984
9. Warner, Harry, All Our Yesterdays, p 76
10. Palmer, Ray, The Secret World, 1975, p 8
11. Pobst, Jim, The Rap Packets #1 p 3
12. Palmer, The Secret World, p 26
13. Ibid. p 30
14. Ron Goulart, St.James Encyclopedia of Pop Culture
15. Rap editorial, Amazing Stories, August 1938
16. Ibid., July 1939
17. Rap editorial, Other Worlds Science Stories, November 1955
18. Rap, The Secret World, p 37
19. Rap, Flying Saucers Magazine, 1958
20. Gardner, Martin, Fads and Fallacies in the Name of Science, p 56
21. Arnold/Palmer, The Coming of the Saucers, p 88
22. Ibid. p 39
23. Ibid. p 44
24. Ibid. p 45
25. Ibid. p 58
26. Ibid.
27. Ruppelt, Edward, The Report on Unidentified Flying Objects, 1956, p 26
28. Arnold/Palmer, The Coming of the Saucers, p 9
29. Editorial, Other Worlds Science Stories, May 1957
30. Editorial, Flying Saucers Magazine, June 1960
31. Halbritter, Ron, Beyond Roswell—The Hoax on You, http://n6rpf.com-us.net/mauryisl.html
32. Rap on Maury Island, Flying Saucers, December 1958

[Go to website to see photos.]

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http://www.theufoforum.org/ANINTERVIEWWITH/AnInterviewWith_RayPalmer.html

In the book The Coming Of The Saucer Kenneth Arnold writes that your dad contacted him to investigate the Maury Island incident.
RP - Yes. My dad got these fragments from Fred Crisman and Harold Dahl who claimed that they were from these flying saucers. This was after the Kenneth Arnold sighting. Kenneth Arnold has a sighting, then there's this big hoopla on the news and all, and then after this dad got the fragments. Dad then contacted Kenneth Arnold to go out there and see what they were.
tuf - Did your dad ever publish the findings of Arnold's investigation in either Amazing Stories or Fate magazines?

RP - I'm not sure. Amazing Stories published two editorials, the first one was how Shaver had predicted these objects four years earlier, describing how they flew, because they had to fly in certain pathways. Shaver's underground caverns weren't straight so these objects flew in a zig-zag pattern. Then Kenneth Arnold said that the objects didn't fly in a normal military fashion. They zig-zagged in and out. So here you had these objects flying at a terrific rate of speed and flying the way Shaver said they would. So that's how my dad had his first editorial. He said another part of the Shaver Mystery had been proved. In the second editorial he recited Kenneth Arnold's story the way Kenneth Arnold told it. I believe that is why Kenneth Arnold liked my dad, because dad didn't want to change Kenneth Arnold's story.
tuf - So your dad became good friends with Kenneth Arnold after that?
RP - After that, yes, because dad just wanted to know what he saw. And dad was the only one who would listen to him and not call him a liar. That second editorial in Amazing Stories said 'at least we're not calling Kenneth Arnold a liar' while everyone else was. So dad stuck up for Kenneth Arnold and that probably made a difference.
tuf - In the early 1980's researcher John Keel wrote an article in which he suggested that your father actually invented the whole UFO genre to help boost circulation of his magazines.

...tuf - Lets go back to Fate Magazine.
RP - The first issue came out in 1948, but dad continued to work for Amazing Stories until 1953. Most people thought he was fired in 1949, but he actually continued doing some work till 1953 and getting paid for it.
tuf - He wasn't the editor then.
RP - No, no, he was just a freelancer.
tuf - So basically he left Ziff-Davis on good terms.
RP - That's right. My dad and others left because they didn't want to go to New York. There was a feeling that people in New York didn't think much of the people in Chicago. To them Chicago was just a cow town in the midwest.That's why alot of people who wrote in New York didn't want to be associated with a pulp magazine. Issac Asimov had that attitude. My dad actually bought his first story but Asimov, in an interview with Reader's Digest said no, that a New York publisher did. One of dad's readers called Asimov on that.

...tuf - Why did your dad start Mystic?
RP - They started Mystic because it dealt with the occult. Like my mom said, she had no idea what 'occult' meant to most people. My dad used the Webster Dictionary definition of the word which was 'the unseen'. So Mystic was just the study of the unseen. Spirits are unseen, so is bacteria. Everything that is unseen is occult. Once you find it, it is not the occult anymore. This was the definition of occult that they were writing about. Mystic was sort of like occult. Later they changed the title from Mystic to Search to broaden the area of topics they could write about.
tuf - The Hidden World was another magazine your dad published in the early 1960's. That magazine was basically a continuation of the Shaver Mysteries.
RP - Yes
...
RP - I have another point I'd like to bring up about his editorial style. He would write about both sides of a story. What I mean is that he would write an article about whatever, saying this is the way it is. Then the next month, using a different name, he would blast his previous arguement using a different theory. He would do this just to stimulate controversy, to get people to think for themselves. He just didn't write an editorial and say thats the way it is. He did it to get people to think for themselves.
tuf - Did your dad have points of view which he defended without giving an opposing view?
RP - He didn't have a general editorial stance for his magazines. If you look at all his magazines you can see so many different points of view, viewpoints, in them. You can not say that he denied anyone a say.
tuf - Would you say that your dad would claim that everything he published was true?
RP - Well, he wouldn't know exactly what was true. If someone tells you something, you publish it but you don't know whether its true or not. That's basically how everything is really. He left it up to the interested reader, or skeptic, to follow up and see for themselves. I came across some articles that were proved false after being published. My dad would then write something about that later. I mean, if you're out and come across a flying saucer and told my dad about it he'd write about what you saw.
tuf - Would your dad ever argue over a point?
RP - Well, he and Kenneth Arnold would do that. My mom would call it a 'what-if' session. They would argue what if it (ufo) was a plane, what if it was a planet, what if it came from Shavers' caves. They would try to prove what it was that they saw. But then a lot of things you can't prove because you just don't have enough information.


Fred Lee Crisman - David Guyatt - 21-04-2009

Linda Minor Wrote:
Linda Minor Wrote:The "Letters-to-the-Editor" section was the most interesting part of the publication. Here is a typical contribution from the issue for June 1946:
Sirs:
I flew my last combat mission on May 26, [1945] when I was shot up over Bassein and ditched my ship in Ramaree Roads off Chedubs Island. I was missing five days. I requested leave at Kashmere (sic). I and Capt. (deleted by request) left Srinagar and went to Rudok then through the Khese pass to the northern foothills of the Karakoram. We found what we were looking for. We knew what we were searching for.

For heaven's sake, drop the whole thing! You are playing with dynamite. My companion and I fought our way out of a cave with submachine guns. I have two 9" scars on my left arm that came from wounds given me in the cave when I was 50 feet from a moving object of any kind and in perfect silence. The muscles were nearly ripped out. How? I don't know. My friend has a hole the size of a dime in his right bicep. It was seared inside. How we don't know. But we both believe we know more about the Shaver Mystery than any other pair.

You can imagine my fright when I picked up my first copy of Amazing Stories and see you splashing words about on the subject.
The identity of the author of this letter was withheld by request. Later Palmer revealed his name: Fred Lee Crisman. ...

http://www.scifi-fantasy-info.com/richard-sharpe-shaver.html

...These Dero still lived in the cave cities, according to Richard Sharpe Shaver, kidnapping surface-dwelling people by the thousands for meat or torture, and using the fantastic "ray" machines that the great ancient races left behind to project tormenting thoughts and voices into our minds. Dero could be blamed for nearly all misfortunes, from minor "accidental" injuries or illnesses to airplane crashes and catastrophic natural disasters. Women especially were singled out for brutal treatment, including rape, and Mike Dash notes that "Sado-masochism was one of the prominent themes of Shaver's writings." Though generally confined to their caves, Richard Sharpe Shaver claimed that the Deros sometimes traveled by spaceships or rockets, and had dealings with equally evil extraterrestrial beings. Shaver claimed first-hand knowledge of the Dero and their caves, insisting he had been their prisoner for several years.

Palmer edited and rewrote the manuscript, increasing the total word count to a novella length 31,000. Palmer insisted that he did nothing to alter the core elements of Richard Sharpe Shaver's story, but that he only added an exciting plot line so the story would not read "like a dull recitation." Retitled "I Remember Lemuria!"; it was published in March, 1945 issue of Amazing. The issue sold out, and generated quite a response: between 1945 and 1949, letters poured in attesting to the truth of Richard Sharpe Shaver's claims (tens of thousands of letters, according to Palmer). The correspondents, too, had heard strange voices or encountered denizens of the hollow Earth.

One of the letters to Amazing was from a woman who claimed to have gone into a deep subbasement of a Paris, France building via a secret elevator. After months of rape and other torture, the woman was freed by a group of Teros. Another letter claiming involvement with Deros came from Fred Crisman, later to gain notoriety for his role in the Maury Island Incident and the John F. Kennedy Assassination....

The Deros story is very reminiscent of the Agartha myth and I very much suspect that is actually the true root of it. If that is the case then we are looking at the same general occult grouping that sits around Martinism or splinter groups thereof (for similar connections see HERE)

The reference to "Lemuria" merely lends weight to this conclusion imo.

"Saucers" are very much a part of this whole subject matter as can be demonstrated by, for example, Brinsley Le Poer Trench's classic books "Finding Lost Atlantis inside the Hollow Earth" (Aka "Secret of the Ages" 1974), and "Secret of the Ages - UFO's from Inside the Earth" (published 1974).


Fred Lee Crisman - David Guyatt - 21-04-2009

Ron Williams Wrote:
Magda Hassan Wrote:...Any ideas about the 'gypsies'?...

This is an important question and one very much misunderstood in the bigger Crisman picture.

When Crisman moved back to his home town of Tacoma, Washington, in 1966, another old friend he got in touch with was Miller Stevens who was a Gypsy. What followed is a good case study of how Crisman operated, and I think there is much between the lines that one can speculate on.

According to the way Crisman explains it Miller Stevens asked for his help in getting an Office of Economic Opportunity (OEO) plan approved for the Gypsies. Here are a few quotes from Chapter 3 in Crisman's book Murder of a City:

Miller [Stevens] knew that I had been a school teacher and administrator and he was aware that I knew something about the Federal Aid to Education programs. He had contacted me to tell me that his people needed special help and that he could get no person to listen to his pleas. …I assumed that the Office of Economic Opportunity, in its great wisdom, had arranged to take care of the Gypsy peoples of this nation as well as they categorized the rest of the minority peoples. Negroes, Number 1, Indians, Number 2, Latin-Americans, Number 3…and so on down their ever wise and never wrong ladder! Miller insisted that the Gypsy peoples were being left out completely. I was again amazed… (p. 17)

[and here, I believe is a good example of the access in high places that Crisman had all over the country]

I called Jim Wickwire, in Senator Henry Jackson’s [D-Washington] office and Jim told me that he would check and see if Miller knew what he was talking about. …I soon had some letters from Jim Wickwire and several calls from him that expressed surprise that the all-knowing OEO had little knowledge or information on the Gypsy peoples as they now exist in the U.S. …I wrote a complete research paper on the Gypsy tribes in the U.S. with some notes on their way of life and their problems with public education… I finally wrote a complete education plan for the local Gypsy people and it was given a grudging $6700 to see if it could work. The program was a success, but was not renewed. (pp. 17-18)

Whether Crisman was motivated by altruism or friendship could be questioned, but what does seem clear is that he used this project as just another weapon in the local political war that (it appears) he had instigated and managed.

I walked away from the Gypsy project after having charged Miller not one penny for the long hours and research done for his favor. I was later accused by this same team Lee & Jeffords as having made a lot of money from the Gypsy program. By that time it did not worry me for I had been assured that most of the local politicians knew Lee as a liar and Jeffords as a cheap hippie-in-residence at the [Tacoma News] Tribune. Any knock from them was a boost in most quarters of the city. (p. 20)

For me, one of the most amazing things Micheal Riconosciuto said to Kenn Thomas in the 1996 prison interview was this: "Crisman was a master at emotional contagion. An absolute master at it…" (Maury Island UFO, p. 281)

Ron Williams

On Gypsies it may be of interest that Karl Maria Wiligut, Himmler's tame Satanist and leading figure in the SS Ahnenerbe, claimed to be the "King of the Gypsies".

For more on him see Wiki HERE - although a fairly recent book about him (the title of which I now forget) has far more relevant details.


Fred Lee Crisman - Linda Minor - 22-04-2009

David Guyatt Wrote:The Deros story is very reminiscent of the Agartha myth and I very much suspect that is actually the true root of it. If that is the case then we are looking at the same general occult grouping that sits around Martinism or splinter groups thereof (for similar connections see HERE)

The reference to "Lemuria" merely lends weight to this conclusion imo.

"Saucers" are very much a part of this whole subject matter as can be demonstrated by, for example, Brinsley Le Poer Trench's classic books "Finding Lost Atlantis inside the Hollow Earth" (Aka "Secret of the Ages" 1974), and "Secret of the Ages - UFO's from Inside the Earth" (published 1974).

http://www.byerly.org/thollowt/agartha.htm
http://wapedia.mobi/en/The_Smoky_God

http://www.ourhollowearth.com/SGContents.htm

http://wiki.wyomingauthors.org/Willis+George+Emerson
https://www.alibris.com/search/books/qwork/7448850/used/The%20Smoky%20God

* The Smoky God, or, A Voyage to the Inner World (1908). Mundelein, IL: Palmer Publications.
reprinted by Ray Palmer in 1965


Fred Lee Crisman - Linda Minor - 11-05-2009

When we combine the key names of men and corporations in this thread, it leads to a conclusion that there was back in the mid to late 1970's and later an international financial group interested in weapons sales--connected to Lazards in Britain, France and the U.S.

Quote:August 1984
Issue 5

Ian Macgregor, Lazards, Pearsons, and Amax

PART 1
See also Part 2 in Lobster 6 [next post in this thread]
Summary

This article attempts to show that the present chairman of the National Coal Board, Ian MacGregor, is far more than the "right man for the job" imported from the U.S. by a Government set simply on technical efficiency. Macgregor's appointment in this country epitomises the direction in which the ruling class is pushing the economy. Not only does MacGregor have longstanding connections in the mining industry and within an important banking group, he is also strongly tied up in the armaments industry. While MacGregor is our starting point, the article will range beyond him as an individual and will indicate the circles within which he moves, circles which overlap with, and are integrated into, the British State.
Introduction

When Thatcher was first elected to office in 1979, unemployment was already rising fast and the Labour Party leadership (Callaghan and Healey in particular) had, in practical terms, already been converted to 'monetarism'. (1) It was not long before Ian MacGregor was appointed to run British Steel.(2) The 'rescue plan' which he was responsible for implementing was resisted by the steel workers but they were unable to prevent the implementation of closures and layoffs. This is no place to analyse the reasons for this defeat, but I am convinced that the I.S.T.C. leader, Bill Sirs, played a central role in undermining the strike.(3)

It was not long before it was rumoured that Ian MacGregor was to be moved to take up the chairmanship of the National Coal Board (NCB). From the start the National Union of Mineworkers (NUM) opposed the appointment.

It seems highly unlikely that the people who took the decision to cut coal production, something which had long been sought by the ruling class (4), were ignorant of what, or rather whom, they were taking on. Heath's experience in 1974 should have been enough. But things are more desperate now and those who took the decision set their minds on the rewards which victory would give them, for this victory would open the way to a more total onslaught on the entire working class and the trade unions - the road would, therefore, be opened for a more authoritarian order, an order more suited to the depressed economic climate of the present with worse to come in the future.(5)

MacGregor's butchering of the steel industry was done against a background of world market contraction, a situation which has given rise to increasing antagonism between US and European steel producers. (6) Under MacGregor, Britain has led the way in Europe in making adjustments in its steel production in compliance with American demands. But while the state sector of the steel industry has been forced to contract, the private sector has also been cutting back. In April 1983 a "rationalisation" scheme for the high alloy sector of the steel castings industry (which is privately owned) was agreed to.(7) The scheme is being run by the merchant bank Lazards Brothers and Co., which is based in London. But there are also Lazards in Paris and New York. Ian MacGregor is a partner in the New York Lazards.
Lazards

Lazards in Britain has had links with the steel industry in the past. For example, Lord Kindersley, now a vice chairman of Lazards, was a director of the Steel Company of Wales from 1959 to 1967, and Sir Campbell Adamson, who joined Lazards in 1977, held management positions in Richard Thomas Baldwins Ltd and the Steel Company of Wales Ltd from 1947-1969. Interlocking directorships linked Lazards with Lloyds Bank in the past and Lloyds has close past links with the steel industry.(8)

Although the three Lazards groups have common origins, it is said that they have for a long time drifted apart. Recently, however, they have begun to move together and this has been confirmed by the news that a new holding company is being set up in Delaware called Lazards Partners, which will bind the ownership of the three more closely together.(9)

The David-Weill family seem to dominate the Paris firm - the holding company, Eurafrance, is at the centre of their web. Interlocking directorships link Lazard Freres et Cie in France to some of the largest European concerns, including the electrical engineering and electronics firm Thomson-Brandt (also an armaments producer), the automobile firms Peugot-Citroen and Fiat, and the aluminium and chemicals giant Pechiney. Through Christian Valesi the French Lazards is well connected with the French State and he is also the director of a steel company.(10)

The David-Weill family also appear to exert an influence on the New York and British Lazards, though it seems likely that Lazard Freres and Co. NY, is close to, or part of, the Rockefeller empire.(11) Interlocking directorships link the New York firm with the following: Amerada Hess, General Dynamics, Allis-Fiat, American Motors, Pechiney (see above), Owens-Illinois, Pfizer, Minerals and Resources, Schlumberger, Engelhard Minerals and Chemicals, and many others. However, the New York Lazards is a private concern and it is difficult to find out much about its activities. It seems clear though, that it is close to extractive industries.(12)

As already mentioned, the David-Weill family appear to have some influence in the London Lazards. However, the driving force here appears to be the Pearson family and their allies. The control over Lazards in Britain by the Pearson family (of which Lord Cowdray is the head) is carried out in a complicated way. Through the Cowdray Trust and the Dickinson Trust the family owns about 36% of S. Pearson and Son, a holding company. This, in turn, owns and controls an array of other companies amongst which is the Whitehall Trust, which owns 80% of Lazard Bros. and Co. Ltd. (The remaining 20% is owned by the French Lazards.)

Among the array of Pearson-owned companies are: Pearson Longman (Financial Times, 50% of The Economist, Penguin and Ladybird Books); Goldcrest Films; a string of provincial newspapers; Doulton and Co.; Fairey Engineering (engineering with longstanding armaments business) (14); Madame Tussauds, Chessington Zoo, the London Planetarium, Warwick Castle, the Wookey Hole Caves; various land and farming interests and mineral extraction companies.

But the spread of interests does not end here. Lazards Bros. is seen by many to be the true hub of the Pearson empire. Again, the connections established by this firm are too vast to enumerate here in any detail but some of the more obvious ones will be mentioned. Two big engineering firms which rely heavily on armaments for their survival, Vickers and Rolls Royce, were merged in 1980 when Ian Fraser, the chairman of Lazards, was deputy chairman of Vickers and chairman of Rolls Royce.(15) Lazards has or has had financial links and interlocking directorships with GEC - again, with much of its business in armaments (16) - Babcock International (17), Davy Corporation (18), BOC International (19), Wilkinson Match (20), Dalgety (21). All of these are among the largest British industrial firms. Interlocking directorships also link Lazards with Phoenix Assurance (22), Guardian Royal Exchange Assurance (23) and Sun Alliance and London Insurance (24).

This does not mean that Lazards is the sole link which these companies have with the banking sector, though in a number of cases Lazards is the most important connection. Thus, Lazards in Britain has particularly close links with the British engineering industry, with armaments and with publishing and the mass media.

But the influence of the Pearson-Lazard group extends beyond the realm of industry, finance and the media and into the state itself.

During the 1940s Lord Brand was managing director of Lazards and simultaneously heading the British Food Mission and the British Supply Council in America. He was also a representative of the British Treasury in America at the time. Adam Marris, employed at Lazards from 1929-1939, spent a short time in the Ministry of Economic Warfare in London, joined the British Embassy in Washington in 1949 as 1st Secretary, and later became Counsellor. After the war he returned to Lazards until the 1970s, and was also a director of Barclays Bank, Australia and New Zealand Banking Group and Commercial Union Assurance.

Another board member, Lord Poole, was a Tory MP from 1945-1950 and chairman of the Conservative Party organisation from 1955-57. The 1st Viscount Blakenham married a daughter of the 2nd Viscount Cowdray and held several positions of state, as well as being chairman of the Conservative Party organisation from 1963-65. His son is now chairman of S. Pearson and Son.

Sir Campbell Adamson, as well as his former positions on State steel bodies and Director-General of the CBI from 1969-1976, was a deputy under-secretary at the Department of Economic Affairs from 1967-69; a member of the BBC advisory committee from.1964-67, and from then till 1975; on the Social Science Research Council from 1965-69; and on the National Economic Development Council from 1969-76.

A daughter of the 2nd Viscount Cowdray married the 9th Duke of Atholl (Duke is as high as you can go in the aristocratic hierarchy - there are only 26 of them). Their son, 10th Duke of Atholl, holds a number of directorships of Pearson companies including the Westminster Press and Pearson-Longman. Being a large Scottish landowner, he is a member of the Scottish Landowners Federation, and was convenor of that body from 1976-79. With this connection the Pearson-Lazard group joins the other 'Royal' merchant banking families - the Rothschilds, Barings et al.(25) Lord Cowdray has been described as the richest peer (26) and the largest donator of funds to the Tory party.(27)

It was noted soon after the Falklands War had ended that it had been a great boon to the armaments industry.(28) Amongst those which seem to have benefitted are Fairey and GEC, which, as we have seen, have links with the Pearson-Lazards group. It is also interesting that the former Foreign Secretary, Lord Carrington, who resigned at the start of the conflict, became chairman of GEC when he left the government, while John Nott (knighted for the bravery he displayed in running the war), became a director of Lazards when he left the Government. It should be mentioned here that GEC also has close links with the merchant bank Morgan Grenfell, which used to be directly controlled by the US Morgan group. The Pearsons have longstanding relations with the Morgans of America, going back to the time when the 1st Lord Cowdray, Weetman Pearson, made some millions out of the Mexican oil business in rivalry with the Rockefellers at the beginning of the century.(29). In 1957 Lord Kindersley (see above), then chairman of Lazards, stated that Morgans and Lazards were probably closer than any other two issuing houses.(30)

A more obscure link connects the Pearson-Lazard group into the orbit of Anglo-American politics. This is the so-called "Round Table Groups" which are said to have been set up on lines laid down by Cecil Rhodes in 1908-11. (31) Finance was contributed by the Morgan group and a group of international financiers based in London led by Lazards. At the head of the organisation, whose aim appears to have been to establish a world government centred on the two Anglo-Saxon heartlands, was Lord Milner, a powerful figure in Whitehall and the City of London.(32) Milner died in 1925. Later Robert (who became Lord) Brand, whom we have already met, took over. When he died in 1963, Adam Marris, whom we have also met, took charge.(33) It is not clear whether this organisation still operates or, if it does, how powerful it is. There are, however, plenty of traces of its former existence and plenty of indications that the Anglo-American collaboration which it strove for has had profound effects upon the British economy, polity and military.

E. H.

Part 2, MacGregor and Amax, MacGregor and Armaments will be in Lobster 6.

Notes to Part 1

1. See The Economics of Crisis and the Crisis of Economics, Gunder Frank in Critique No 9, 1978 .
2. MacGregor was appointed deputy chairman (part-time) in May-June 1980, before becoming chairman later in 1980. Sir Charles Villiers was chairman during the steel workers' strike. Sir Charles was executive deputy chairman of Guinness Peat, a merchant bank, and a director of Banque Belge Ltd., Courtaulds and Sun Life Assurance.
3. Bill Sirs seems to have taken a consistently rightist position on nuclear weapons and was a signatory of a recent pro-Nato advertisement in which he reveals a connection with the Royal Institute for International Affairs, a body which has been linked with the Round Table Groups (which we meet later), and which is close to the Rockefeller-led Council on Foreign Relations in the US.
4. See Guardian 5th August 1983 - Power Industry Cuts Contract For Coal. In April 1975, Mary Goldring wrote in Investors' Chronicle (18th April) that coal is the biggest offender by far and stated that "if British miners could average even half the output of the American - which would mean shutting the poorest mines - the £700 million annual wage bill would be halved."
5. In a TV programme last Christmas on the future, John Eatwell, the economist, using sophisticated econometric models, showed Britain's short-run future to be extremely gloomy, even on the most optimistic assumptions. See his book Whatever Happened To Britain? which was shown as a TV series in 1982. Also Bob Beckman, The Downwave (1982), for a pro-capitalist holocaustic view of the future. Note than neither of these authors introduces the problem of world war into the analysis.
6. This has been evident since at least 1982. The following articles from the Guardian show that it continues to be a serious problem: 'US steel firm acts to cut import limits' (18th November 1983); 'Europe and US in steel clash' (8th Feb.1984); 'Transatlantic trade friction growing' (27th Feb. 1984). The last article shows that the trade disputes are general and affect food, textiles and other goods.
7. Guardian 5th April 1983 'Lazard Bros steel cuts proposal is agreed'.
8. Who's Who and Directory of Directors. Adamson was also director of Richard Thomas and Baldwins from 1959-'69 and held important positions on State steel bodies.
9. Guardian (19th May 1984) 'Lazard Bros. together again'. Although it seems likely that the three groups co-operated throughout their existence, this greater pooling of finance suggests a closing of the ranks in the face of world economic collapse, a phenomenon we meet throughout this article.
10. Lazard Freres is "part of the French empire of the holding company Eurafrance, which controls insurance companies, property companies, television rentals, and other banks; but David-Weill now spends most of his time in New York, where the Lazard connection is even more wide-ranging." Anthony Sampson The Money Lenders (1981) p240
11. See Charles Levinson's Vodka-Cola (1978) "Meyer provided the link between the Rockefeller family and the French banks..Lazard Freres was the largest shareholder in the Banque de Paris et des Pays-Bas, which opened a branch in New York called Paris-bas Corporation. Directed by Robert Craft, vice-president of the Chase-Manhattan, it numbered Andre Meyer, David Rockefeller and John McCloy, former president of the World Bank, among its members." Meyer was president of the New York Lazards and Chase-Manhattan is a Rockefeller vehicle. The magazine Lords of the Realm (now defunct) in the 2nd and final issue (1983) numbered Lazards in New York as one of the five major Rockefeller allies.
12. Details from Standard and Poor's Register 1982
13. See Who Owns Whom and Extel
14. Fairey manufactures bridges and trackways. In 1934 the Union of Democratic Control published a booklet The Secret International which described Fairey as "the most important firm manufacturing military aeroplanes", but the document named Vickers as the most important arms firm of the day. Fairey, as we shall see, is connected to the Lazards group, but Vickers is no longer the king pin. The defence industry must change with the times, and British Aerospace is now at the heart of Britain's weapons programme. See War Lords - CIS Report on the UK Arms Industry (1982)
15. The 1979 report of Rolls Royce shows that Lazards' chairman and Rolls chairman Ian Fraser, was the largest shareholder of Rolls' shares of all the directors, by a long chalk. It should also be noted that the chairman and other directors of Vickers have wide-ranging interests and are not necessarily members of the Pearson-Lazards group. Their connections include Lloyds, RTZ, Toronto Dominion Bank, Hill Samuel and Shell. One of them, Sir Alistair Frame, also born in Scotland, chief executive and deputy chairman of RTZ, director of the electronics firm Plessey, Toronto Dominion Bank and Britoil, and a director of the UK Atomic Energy Authority from 1964-68 was actually tipped to become the next chairman of BSC after MacGregor (Guardian 18th February 1983), but the unknown Bob Haslam got the job instead. Compare Frame's connections with those of MacGregor outlined in part 2 of this article.
16. The firms which combined to form GEC have strong Lazards connections. In 1931 Napiers was bought by Lazards and in 1937 Lord Brand of Lazards was a director of the company. In 1929 Lazards (then owned 50% by Pearson and 50% by David-Weill) gained 60% of English Electric's shares and in 1942 took over Napiers. The Morgan group owned 46% of AEI's shares and 34% of GEC's in the 1920s and 30s but in 1935, 400,000 shares in GEC were sold by the Americans to a group headed by Lazards. AEI was merged with GEC in 1967 and English Electric joined the fold in 1968. Lord Kindersley of Lazards was a director of GEC from 1968-1970. See R. Jones and 0. Marriott Anatomy of a Merger (1970)
17. Lord Netherthorpe of Lazards is a director. Lazards arranged the finance for Babcock's building of a power station in Zimbabwe in 1982. Babcock is deeply involved in building nuclear power stations in Britain and elsewhere.
18. lan Frazer, Lazards' chairman, is a director of Davy. Lazards were lead managers in a $1 billion issue for the company in 1982. Davy is an engineering and contracting firm which builds plants for a variety of industrial processes. Both Davy and Babcock hint at the origins of the Pearson empire which was built by Weetman Pearson, the first Lord Cowdray, on the basis of large-scale contract engineering work throughout the world.
19. Ian Fraser is a director of BOC.
20. Kindersley (see above) is a director of Wilkinson, as is S. H. Wright of Lazards.
21. Lord Netherthorpe of Lazards is deputy chairman of Dalgety; Lt. Col. C.P. Dawney and J.A. Turner of Lazards are former directors. Dalgety is a conglomerate mainly involved in foodstuffs.
22. Dawney (see 21) is chairman, and E. W. Phillips of Lazards is a director of Phoenix, which owns 12.98% of Vickers preference stock at time of merger.
23. Kindersley is director and ex-chairman of Guardian Royal which owned 5.5% of preference stock and 5.12% of preference stock of Vickers at time of merger.
24. Kindersley is director of Sun Alliance. Sir Peter Matthews, chairman of Vickers is also a director of Sun Alliance.
25. Who's Who and Carroll Quigley's The Anglo-American Establishment (1981) p304
26. See D. Sutherland The Land Owners (1968)
27. Anthony Sampson Anatomy of Britain Today (1965)
28. Guardian (4th June 1982) "One important aerospace industry supplier, Fairey, admits that it has cleared the decks in some cases to meet urgent demands from the MOD."
29. See Desmond Young, Member for Mexico (1966); R. O'Connor The Oil Barons (1972); P. Calvert The Mexican Revolution (1968)
30. See Sampson (note 27) p437. It seems to be commonly believed that the Morgan group which dominated American politics and economy from the end of the last century was pushed into second place by the Rockefellers in the 1930s and '40s. According to the US Progressive Labor Party they did this by 'placing their man Roosevelt in the White House and used government projects like the Tennessee Valley Authority to attack Morgan interests.' From their pamphlet Who Rules Britain?
31. Carroll Quigley Tragedy and Hope(1966) pp950-951
32. ibid. Milner apparently refused to become a partner in Morgan Grenfell but did become a member of the London Joint Stock Bank, a precursor to the Midland Bank.
33. ibid. His father, Sir William, was apparently a founder member of the Round Table group.



Fred Lee Crisman - Linda Minor - 11-05-2009

What is fascinating to me about the following is that Karl Rove's stepfather, Louis Rove, worked many years for AMAX or Climax Molybdenum and retired in Palm Springs, the setting for some high-powered Republican golfers.
Also, Margaret Thatcher came from Grantham in the UK, which was the town where Sir Denis Kendall had his weapons manufacturing company, BMARC. Kendall's wife grew up in Columbus, Ohio (Prescott Bush's hometown), where she ran a dance school before she met him on an international tour. Her brother was an actor in California, where he knew Ronald Reagan. She and Kendall divorced before he became a U.S. citizen and moved permanently to California.

Quote:Ian MacGregor
Part 2: AMAX and armaments
See also Part 1 in Lobster 5 [previous post]
Ian Macgregor and AMAX

We have followed one of Macgregor's leads into the British Establishment; now we return to the man himself. He was born in 1912 in Kinlochleven and graduated from Glasgow University with a BSc in metallurgical engineering. He was a trainee manager at the British Aluminium Co., worked for William Beardmore Co. in Glasgow, and participated in the Mission of the Ministry of Supply to North America in 1940, where it seems likely that he met Brand and/or Marris. After his wartime service he went on to pursue a business career in the US and became a US citizen. By 1957 he had become Vice President of the Climax Molybdenum Co., which later merged with the American Metal Co. to form AMAX Inc. MacGregor held top positions in AMAX during the 1960s and was Chairman from 1969 to 1977, and honorary chairman from 1977 to 1982.(1)

AMAX (we shall examine its ownership later) is a gigantic mining conglomerate, involved in the extraction and refining of molybdenum, coal (3rd largest producer in the US with a bad reputation for its open-cast mining operations and labour relations), tungsten (2nd largest producer in the US), and copper. It is a major nickel producer in the US and mines/refines lead, silver, cadmium and zinc in Africa (including Botswana, Zambia, Namibia and South Africa), and iron ore in Australia. In the latter the company earned itself a very bad reputation for its involvement in destroying the communal lands occupied by the Aboriginals - this involved a massive police presence to prevent opposition from the Aboriginals and trade unionists. (2)

In its 1982 report AMAX claims to be the western world's largest producer of tungsten and this includes major prospects for future mine developments when needed in the Canadian northwest and Great Britain. It has large silver holdings in Honduras and is getting into gold in a big way. It is the 2nd largest magnesium producer in the US and the 3rd largest in the western world. Also, AMAX owns the only nickel refinery in the US.

AMAX is interlocked with the other big multinational mining companies. For example, in Botswana it jointly owns nickel and copper mines together with Anglo-American Corp. (the South African Oppenheimer monopoly), and Charter Consolidated (a big British mining finance company active in South Africa also). AMAX owns 11% of the French Rothschild mining conglomerate Imetal. which has extensive interests in Africa and elsewhere.

The ownership of AMAX is complex and seems to have changed over the years. During the 1930s American Metal Co. became a large copper miner, refiner and smelter. Although it was an independent group it was linked to Morgan, and Morgan was a powerful influence on the major copper producer Kennecott, which was owned by the Guggenheim family. At that time big copper mines had just opened up in what was then called Rhodesia. Two big interconnected groups dominated there. Morgan was well represented in one and the other was controlled by Rhodesian Selection Trust. Since then things have changed several times (3) During the 1960s Selection Trust (described as a British company) owned 11.5% of American Metal Climax and had 4 representatives on the board.(4) By the end of the 1970s Selection Trust had only 8% of AMAX and Standard Oil of California owned 21.7% of the stock. SOCAL tried to take over AMAX completely (offering $4 billion) but were beaten off. (5) By 1983 SOCAL's share of AMAX had fallen to 19.7% but Selection Trust had been taken over by B.P. for $925 million in 1980 and B.P. now owns 6.5% of AMAX. It is also noteworthy that the B.P.-dominated Standard Oil of Ohio (SOHIO) in America successfully took over the formerly Guggenheim/Morgan preserve, the giant Kennecott Corp. in 1981, so that B.P. now owns what is probably the largest copper producer in the world.

Since SOCAL still owns a major stake in AMAX it is worth looking at the ultimate ownership of SOCAL itself. It is thought by some that no external interests control this company.(6) However, others see a major chunk of this part of the original Rockefeller-Standard Oil empire as being in the hands of the Rockefeller family still (or again). (7) The group is, of course, based in California and has long-standing connections with the banks in that part of America. In particular it has interlocks with the Crocker National Bank. The Crocker family is big in America's largest bank, Bank of America, which is based in San Francisco. (According to SOCAL's 1983 annual report Samuel H. Armacost is a director of SOCAL and president of Bank of America.) But the Crocker National Bank was sold to the Midland Bank group a few years ago. A recent publication lists Midland Bank group, Rockefeller interests and Sarofilm (Fayez) and Co. as the three top shareholders, in that order.(8) Midland, one of Britain's big 4 clearing banks, crops up again, later on.

Ian MacGregor moves in this world of takeover and rivalry and since the end of the 1970s the predatory activities of the giant oil, minerals and financial groups has increased. At the same time as being an inter-industrial reorganisation and rivalry, what has been happening involves both British and American firms. I return to the objectives of this movement that is still going on later, but it undoubtedly involves some kind of rationalisation among the extractive industries. In 1983 it was announced that Charter Consolidated, having divested itself of its interests in Selection Trust, was aiming to take over a loss-making Scottish engineering company, Anderson Strathclyde, which specialises in making long-wall mining equipment for the NCB. The movement also indicates a strong inter-penetration of US and UK capital, as seen with the Midland Bank take-over of Crocker and the BP take-over of Kennecott. American companies have also been moving in on British firms - in 1982 it was announced that Aetna Life and Casualty, the US insurance and pensions giant which has old Morgan connections, was to take over Midland's merchant banking subsidiary, Samuel Montagu.(9)
Ian MacGregor and Armaments

Many of the metals mined and refined by AMAX have military applications. Molybdenum, of which AMAX is the world's leading producer, is used in conjunction with other alloying elements in high-speed cutting tools, propeller shafts, turbine rotors and armour - piercing projectiles etc. Nickel (AMAX is a major producer), which is used to increase steel's toughness, ductility and strength, is used for armour plating and the cycles for its demand follow the fluctuations in demand for armaments - thus demand for nickel rose during World Wars 1 and 2, and during the Korean and Vietnam Wars, falling after these.(10)

International Who's Who lists MacGregor as a director of the Brunswick Corporation which manufactures marine power and recreational equipment (including sports equipment with the 'MacGregor' label), and technical products for various industries, including the defence department of the USA. [This would seemingly connect him to Robert Booth Nichols.] In the latter it is listed as producing aircraft radomes, rocket motor cases, missile and rocket tubes, pressure vessels, transportable shelters, camouflage materials, and other products for defensive systems against chemical/biological warfare etc. I can only speculate here that some of the metals it must use are bought from AMAX. It would be interesting to know if Brunswick Corporation makes parts used in the construction of Cruise missiles. The informed reader will have noted already that Lazards in New York has a directoral interlock with the firm which constructs the Cruise missile, General Dynamics. (11)

MacGregor's connections with the armaments business do not end here. He is listed as having been, among other things, a director of the giant conglomerate LTV which, in 1979, was the 26th largest supplier to the US Dept. of Defence. (12) He is also a director of Atlantic Assets Trust an investment trust which, like many British investment trusts, is based in Scotland and is heavily into US companies. While Atlantic Assets is not big - in 1979 the capital employed totalled £147 million - and most of its holdings are in relatively small companies, and are minority stakes only, it aims at representation on the boards of the companies in which it invests and at some control over their corporate plans for future growth.

About 50% of Atlantic Asset's investments are in the US, 40% in the UK and 5.5% in Canada. (13) In America it has a large share in Shared Medical Systems which is involved in the computer-aided financial management of private hospitals in the US. In the UK it owns about one third of the issued share capital of United Scientific Holdings, an armaments firm manufacturing armoured vehicles, optical and electronic equipment. In August 1981 USH acquired Alvis Ltd., manufacturers of armoured vehicles, from British Leyland. USH is a young company competing with older, larger and more established firms like GKN-Sankey. It seems likely that it is being helped along in some way.

One thing which is interesting here is that MacGregor's career through the British State-owned sector did not begin with his appointment at BSC but with his directorship at British Leyland back in 1975. Under Michael Edwardes, he was Deputy Chairman of BL too, from 1977 till 1980.

BL is, of course, not only a commercial automobile manufacturer but is also involved in the manufacture of military vehicles, though with the loss of Alvis to United Scientific this has probably been reduced a bit. It is also interesting that the chairman of United Scientific, Peter Levene, who has stated that his company is "run like a dictatorship ... I'm the dictator" (14), was appointed in January this year to work as an unpaid adviser to Michael Heseltine, the Defence Secretary, for 6 months to help improve the management of the Defence Ministry.(15) Many of Atlantic Assets' other investments are in high-tech firms (including Cable and Wireless), but it also has shares in Pennzoil, which as well as owning oil and mining interests owns molybdenum mines, and Teck Corporation, based in Canada, which owns a copper-molybdenum mine and mines silver, gold and other minerals, as well as oil and gas. (16)

Before we finish with MacGregor's armaments connections we can note one other interesting fact which further indicates the social milieu in which he moves. We have noted the Midland Bank connection via Socal with AMAX. One of the directors of Midland, Sir John Cuckney, was a director of Lazards from 1964-70. With an impressive set of connections both within business and in the service of the State, Cuckney is currently chairman of the Thomas Cooke group and of Brook Bond, and also of the engineering group John Brown. He has been a director of the Midland Bank since 1978 and of the Royal Insurance since 1979. His most interesting State appointment is as chairman of the International Military Services - the government's undercover arms sales organisation, the sole overseas representative for the weapons manufactured at Royal Ordnance factories - where he has been since 1974. He has also been governor for the Centre for International Briefing at Farnham Castle since 1974. (17)
Ian MacGregor - a man of prudence and principles?

Since Ian MacGregor came to Britain he has made it clear that the giant firms he has been put in control of must be made to "balance their books". The implication, forcefully promoted by the 'monetarist' Thatcher, is that the nationalised industries don't work and privatisation is necessary. But, as we have seen, a massive rationalisation movement has been going throughout the capitalist economies affecting firms whether they be private or State-controlled. Multinational monsters like IT and T have been divided up; indeed, it was Lazards of New York which enabled IT and T to grow big in the 1960s and after - this is an aspect of Lazards in New York we have not covered, though IT and T's involvement in the coup in Chile is well known. (18) Ideological arguments are spouted to justify the large-scale plunder that is taking place, but monetarism is merely a facade behind which the giant firms and the financial empires of which they are a part seize the remaining profitable areas of an economy which is sinking deeper into depression.

The effect of the recession is felt nowhere more deeply among the business community than in the minerals sector. According to one publication produced by Lloyds Bank:

"The full impact of the recession hit the minerals sector in early 1982. The metals sector, being the most sensitive to business cycles, moved into a deep trough. With key industries such as housing, construction and motors depressed, production cutbacks were necessary through temporary and some permanent mine closures." (19)

During the 1960s the metals firms were operating at full tilt. AMAX grew tremendously in the 1970s under MacGregor. He transformed the firm from one that was primarily concerned with copper and molybdenum into the mining conglomerate that it is today. Replying to critics who accused him of over-borrowing, MacGregor is said to have replied:

"I don't care what the balance sheet looks like, I'm going to acquire natural resources and someday they'll be valuable." (20)

MacGregor is, therefore, a man of the times. In the boom he is a big spender, speculating on the possibility that demand will exist in the future; in the depression he calls for cuts and pretends to be a paragon of prudence. At the same time, he and his colleagues search for ways in which to increase the demand for metals. The new technologies involving microprocessors are, however, not big enough to satisfy the enormous capacity set up at great cost by the minerals moguls in the post-war years. It has become increasingly clear to them that their only salvation is an increased demand for armaments. This demand is presently being supplied by Western governments. Civilisation rests of metals, but society's capacity to produce metals has outgrown ordinary consumer needs and they have become inextricably bound up with the production of arms.

AMAX in 1982 was operating the molybdenum end of its empire at less than half capacity. At the beginning of this year it agreed to form a joint venture with Britoil PLC to explore and develop offshore and onshore oil in the US. While this further underlines the close connections which this company has with British business it also shows how badly in the red AMAX is, since it has been argued that the deal was done merely as a means of raising cash to cover its short-term debt. (21)

MacGregor has no qualms about whom he deals with. In April 1983 while chairman of BSC and chairman elect of the NCB, MacGregor flew out to Moscow. His visit to the "evil empire" was "aimed to boost exports of steel and steel products to the Soviet Union." (22) His recent expressions of outrage at the National Union of Mineworkers' contacts with Libya should be viewed in this light.

There is a lot more to say about MacGregor and his connections (23) but it seems clear from all this that he is part of a shadowy network of highly-placed people, allied with other groups (some of which have not been mentioned here) which together dominate the British economy and aim to squeeze the last dregs out of it for themselves. In the process they are intent on building a more authoritarian regime in Britain, a regime which will allow them to push Britain into a more aggressive and war-like stance, one that would secure vast profits for the arms manufacturers and the banks, investment trusts and suppliers which surround them.

E. H.

AMAX personnel

Looking at the board of AMAX (Standard and Poor's 1984 and Who's Who in Finance and Industry) we find that at least 4 of its directorate are Republicans and none of them claim to be Democrats. Of these 4, one is none other than Gerald Ford, ex-President. Ford is also a director of the Twentieth Century Fund (since 1981) and American Express (since 1982) He also sits on the board of Shearson, Loeb, Roades Inc. A former partner of this firm, which is now merged under American Express and called Shearson/American Express, is C.M. Loeb who was on AMAX from 1932 and held several important positions in the firm. C.M. Loeb Jnr. is listed as a director of AMAX.

Pierre Gousseland, currently chairman and president of AMAX, is French by birth and education and arrived in America in 1948, 8 years after MacGregor. He joined AMAX a year later. He is also a director of American International Gp Inc and French American Banking Corporation (in which the Banque International de Paris appears to dominate). He is also a member of the British Iron and Steel Institute.

Another AMAX director, J.D. Bonney, was born in Blackpool in 1930 and joined AMAX in the sixties. Between 1959 and 1960 he worked for Iraq Petroleum Co, owned by Shell, B.P. and other oil companies. More significantly for us he has been vice president of SOCAL since 1972 (SOCAL Europe, that is.) Since SOCAL owns about 20% of AMAX it is not surprising that two other names listed in AMAX reports show interlocks with SOCAL - till 1983, Perrin Fay, V.P. of SOCAL and, till 1984, Sellers Stough, another SOCAL vice president.

NOTES

1. International Who's Who 1983/4
2. Information on AMAX is from Everybody's Business 1980 edited by Moskowitz, Katz and Levering. Information on AMAX in Australia from the magazine Natural Peoples' News, No 5 Spring 1981

AMAX is also involved in gold and silver extraction in Mexico and Central America and in many other mineral resources including phosphates and sulphuric acid.
3. See Anna Rochester Rulers of America pp166 -169. Rhodesian Selection Trust was owned by the American Metal Co.
4. D.M. Kotz Bank Control of Large Corporations in the US (1978)
5. Everybody's Business (above note 2)
6. For example, see Kotz, above.
7. Everybody's Business (above)
8. Berry, Wood and Preusch: Dollars and Dictators: A Guide to Central America Zed Press, 1983
9. Times 19 January 1983 'Take-over battle that rocked the City'
10. McDivitt and Manners Minerals and Men (1974) This work was sponsored by Resources for the Future, of which MacGregor is a director.
11. Details on Brunswick are from Standard and Poor's. Information on Cruise builders from Guardian 12 July 1980, by Michael Getler.
12. Everybody's Business (above)
13. See Hambro Company Guide and Extel Investment Trust Yearbook 1983
14. See Extel and McCarthy cards. Levene quote from Guardian 1 May 1984. Note that as MacGregor came to work in Britain in 1975 he was, like De Lorean, brought over by a Labour government.
15. Financial Times 22 November 1983
16. Penzoil information from Standard and Poor's. Teck information from Rowe and Pitman Qrtly Report, Base Metal and Coal, January 1982
17. Who's Who 1983, also War Lords (CIS Report)
18. On ITT see Sampson's The Sovereign State (1973)
19. Lloyd's Bank Group, Canada Economic Report 1984
20. Everybody's Business (above) p 547
21. Guardian 7 February 1984 and 6 February 1984
22. Guardian 26 April 1983
23. I want to mention only one other here. Who's Who In Finance in Industry lists MacGregor as a director of Resources for the Future. This is a group set up to tackle the problems arising from economic growth - eg pollution, urban expansion and so on. Opposing itself to the 'Limits to Growth' school, it promotes what it calls 'technological optimism' which boils down to finding arguments to justify fast-breeder reactors and so on. The organisation is financed and was set up by the Ford Foundation and the John Simon Guggenheim Memorial Board. It also receives substantial grants from the Rockefeller Foundation.



Fred Lee Crisman - David Guyatt - 12-05-2009

On Lazard's Lord Brand and Steel the following links to a fairly lengthy article. I have not posted it here because it is slightly off topic, although it is mighty interesting. I used to know a very senior Merchant Banker who became part of the Rhodes-Milner Group after joining Lazard's at Brand's urging. Contrary to normal practice he was not an Oxford man but rather Cambridge.

Art one point all non ferrous metals were controlled by the Group. This little gem can be found in Quigley's Anglo-American Establishment where the extensive footnotes yield as much interesting information as the body of the book.

I mention in passing that Lord Selborne, who is mentioned a few times in the article and who succeeded Lord Milner as chief of the "Group" developed a great interest after WWII, in the Priory of Sion...

http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/2807/histmilner.html


Fred Lee Crisman - Helen Reyes - 24-08-2009

David Guyatt Wrote:The Deros story is very reminiscent of the Agartha myth and I very much suspect that is actually the true root of it. If that is the case then we are looking at the same general occult grouping that sits around Martinism or splinter groups thereof.

True, good call, but Crisman was doing something else here. Rene Guenon in Lord of the World (Le Roi du Monde, recently mistranslated/mistitled as King of the World) even supplies the Gypsy connexion: he calls them a people in tribulation who had formerly lived in Agartha. Shaver was more Agarthic, while Crisman was talking about the "mek": the lasers in Burma and those that he said caused the Army Air Corps craft to crash, killing the two airmen near Kelso, Washington.

This was in 1947 and earlier, before lasers were invented.

Crisman seems to have been a veteran of the OSS in China/Indochina. That puts him close company with E Howard Hunt and some other important CIA figures. Hunt also went in for writing thrillers and probably knew or even contributed to the Shaver cycle.

Bannister was somehow involved keeping Paperclip secret. Maury Island is a stone's skip away from old Boeing Field. Dahl went silent and then disappeared because he had a visitation from the first Man in Black the day after Maury who told him everything that happened in detail and warned Dahl to keep silent to save himself and his family.

Ray Palmer is anonymously credited in the internet document Secrets of the Mojave because he advocated for Navajo rights and support. Shaverism is grounded more in the native American cave tradition than in Traditionalism. Fortean Times has done some work documenting this native American tradition from the European American side. Art Bell's Mel's Hole series also belongs in it. If you read Palmer's editorials in Amazing after June, 1947, he begins to hint at a dangerous fifth column taking shape in America, foreign nationals wielding "dero mek". He's hinting at Paperclip Nazis with saucer technology.

I think if you look into it, Garrison and Bannister were both working for the FBI in Washington state in 1947, and both had contact of some kind with Crisman.

Palmer was discredited by some over Maury Island because he "lost" the physical evidence. His special blowout Shaver issue of June, 1947, was plagued by all sorts of dirty tricks, printer devils, imps of the perverse, mysterious disappearances, gremlins, deroes or g-men, Palmer never specifies. truly wyrd stuff. the kind of manifestation john keel should be interested in.