Magda Hassan Wrote:

Quote:I forget who Blavatsky was. Please refresh a fading memory.

Mme Elena Petrovna Blavatsky, born in Russia, was a founder of Theosophy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helena_Blavatsky

David Guyatt Wrote:

Quote:My take on the origin of this term is a lot different than the common, generally accepted one. Based on the contents of the book called "The Russian Fascists" by Prof. John J. Stephan (Little, Brown 1979) Still available at http://www.abebooks.com I determined that Anastase Vonsiatsky had his headquarters in Harbin, Manchuoko, (Manchuria) where many of his like-minded White Russians were living out their diaspora waiting for their "annointed savior" and fearless leader "Annie" to lead them out of their dilemma and retake Mother Russia for them and for the other pro-Czarist White Russians located in Paris, France and other major cities. See Chapter titled: "The Manchurian Mafia".

This is fascinating and I feel sure that there was another reason why these Russian fascists headquartered themselves in Harbin, Manchuko (assuming the date of this “exodus” was post Russian Revolution?).

It is a little known fact these days that circa 1918 the entire Tsar’s treasury was plundered and shipped by train (as I remember it now there were 80 odd cars). This train was under the supervision of a British Army officer (I am told) who was in control of the entire Russian railway network behalf of the Allied Expeditionary Force who had entered Russia at this time to (presumably) safeguard their interests.

Anyway, cutting to the chase ----- the train bearing the Tsar’s gold disappeared from the face of the world.

Back when I was investigating these things there were good and sound reason to conclude that most of this plunder ended up in Manchuoko and, in particular Harbin. And by a strange twist of fate, it was Harbin where the WWII Japanese plunder teams were headquartered. And by an even stranger twist of fate, in the late 1990’s the Russian government was still trying to trace the whereabouts of the Tsar’s gold and had made (or were in the process of making) legal claims against the Japanese government for purloining these treasures. This little and intriguing snippet of stately dispute promptly disappeared from the news pages never to reappear again. Ever.

Of course, the Japanese royal household of those times were closely allied with the British royal household and it just so happens (I am further told) that the unnamed (actually I do know his name) British Army officer who shunted trains for a living grew up on a royal estate in Scotland.

That naughty officer also diverted all the White Russian reinforcement and munitions trains from Moscow thus ensuring that an almost certain victory of the White Russian army over the Reds failed most miserably. History thence saw Russia become communist. And the British Army officer in question thereafter penned a letter to an unnamed superior (not necessarily his senior militarily speaking) saying words to these effect “you will understand why I did this” (i.e., divert the military reinforcement and munitions trains from Moscow).

Thank you John for the kindness of your apology. On Martinism there have been various posts on this forum, principally, I believe, as it relates to the oh so very fake Priory of Sion aspect of the best selling book Holy Blood Holy Grail. But more also including the miserable Protocols, the UFO angle (which you’ve briefly mentioned earlier in your introduction) and JFK and Paedophilia and, oh well, it seems to lead almost everywhere in fact. Just enter the term in the search function and you’ll see the various threads I think.

And I’m all sure we are very happy for you to provide here any research on these fascinating (and for me very important) subjects, so please fire away.

John Bevilaqua Wrote:

David Guyatt Wrote:Btw John, there is much on the internet on the Martinist Order, but if you narrow your search by including "Priory of Sion", "Rennes le Chateau", and/ or "Synarchy" this tends to focus the search into areas that are more responsive to our mutual interest in these matters. The results almost invariably connect to right-wing occult iterests, nazi's, fascism, Templar knights, SMOM etc etc.

Meanwhile, you might want to browse the website of the Societe Perillos (http://www.perillos.com/). You might consider starting HERE simply because it demonstartes connections such as Templar through to the SS Charlemagne Division that was formed of Frenchmen to propagate The Holy Germanic Empire in the post WWII period. It remains a fact that the man who inherited the mantle of leader of the Rhodes-Milner "Group", Lord Selborne (an important member of Churchill's inner Cabinet and the head of the wartime SOE) in the same post war period dedicated the rest of his life (according to his daughter) to the reintroduction of the Germanic royal household of the Holy Roman Empire(so claims my failing memory...) Many of the Rhodes-Milner leading lights donated money to right-wing Nazi leanings groups like the Right Club (sorry for the self serving citation here but if you are interested in this see my old piece HERE.

Another man who found his way to Harpin at the end of WWII was the man who would later become General John Singlaub who, by a strange quirk of fate ( :hello: ), was deeply involved in recovering gold plundered by the Japanese plunder teams (the Golden Lilly) and secreted in the Philippines
throughout WWII.

Coincidences are amazing things eh....

Hmmm... you are right here. Co-inky-dink... NOT! I think that both Ray S. Cline and John Singlaub were in the Mukden, China O.S.S. office together during W.W. II a few hundred kilometers from Harbin, just from memory now. I think it was a miracle that we even won the war considering that people like Angleton, Cline, Singlaub, Willoughby, Fellers, Stratemeyer, Wedemeyer, Gale, Walker and a few others were actually working for the other side. How could we have been so stupid and so short-sighted? Man
oh man alive. Then they all come back to try to start World War III during Korea, during the Cuban Missile Crisis, during the Bay of Pigs and later during Viet Nam.

Remember the old kids trick of walking up to someone with a friend and asking them in jest: "Hey do you want to see a fight between us?" If he says yes, then you stand on opposite sides of him and pretend you are fighting each other, while whacking the monkey in the middle unmercifully.

That is just what these Nazi boys wanted. Only it was going to be Russia vs. the USA in an all out nuclear confrontation with the Nazis on the sidelines cheering for neither side. They preferred mutual annihilation and self-destruction of both sides with the Fourth Reich rising from the ashes.

Helen Reyes Wrote:

John Bevilaqua Wrote:And the roles of Nazi Rocket Scientists at NASA on the Kennedy Space Mission and at Bell Helicopter have been well documented by several others

Paperclip, of course, but it doesn't go all the way to explain the Payne connection.

Quote:Here is another really strange irony which first attracted me to the OSJ about 10-15 years ago:

The official extended title of the organization is:

The Sovereign Military Hospitaller Order of Saint John of Jerusalem, of (The Island of) Rhodes and of (The Island of) Malta,

My name is John and I am now from Rhode Island and I was raised by a father who taught at several military academies. He was the personal Spanish tutor to "Wild Bill" Donovan of the "Georgetown Set" and he had to receive a "Secret" or maybe even "Top Secret" clearance in order to do this. My mother was involved in law enforcement and police intelligence work and she is a devout Roman Catholic and I once worked on a project for the Sovereign Bank of New England. Strange huh?

Thank you for your comments.

Really strange. I noticed something strange too: if you write OSJ in Latin, it would be OSI, wouldn't it? Naval intelligence or something...heheh

Magda Hassan Wrote:Possible sightings of Wandering Bishops: there was that priest, whose name escapes me at the minute, that was on the same Mexico trip as Oswald too and Rev. Gerald Lyman Kenneth Smith.
Edit: I remember now, he was Osborne but he also used another name. Don't they all?

Quote:Lee Harvey Oswald, Albert Osborne

When Lee Harvey Oswald entered Mexico at Laredo, Texas, on Sept. 26, 1963, his companion on the Red Arrow bus was Albert Osborne, alias John Howard Bowen.

Bowen-Osborne had been running a school for highly professional marksmen in Oaxaca, Mexico, since 1934. The cover for the place was his particular mission, and he was the missionary.

The FBI records on Bowen go back to June 4, 1942, in Henderson Springs, Tennessee. He operated a camp for boys known as "Campfire Council." Neighbors complained it was for pro-nazi activities with young fascists. Bowen vehemently opposed the U.S. going to war with nazi Germany. They stomped on the American flag.

Before that, Bowen worked for the Tennessee Valley Authority since 1933.

His dual citizenship between Great Britain and the U.S. took him over the entire globe. So did his use of multiple aliases.

After the Warren Commission published their report in September 1964, several attorneys in the Southwest recognized the name of Osborne.

September 8, 1952, Jake Floyd was murdered. The target was meant to be his father, District Judge Floyd. Two suspects were caught, one got away. Their testimony was about being hired by Osborne and how he ran the school for assassins.

Later investigation revealed Osborne's connections to Division V of the FBI, and to Clay Shaw's Centro Mondiale Commerciale, with funding coming from New Orleans for the CIA, Anti-Castro Cubans, and others.

Lee Harvey Oswald applied for a tourist card to enter Mexico while still in New Orleans on September 17, 1963.

Four other persons, having consecutive tourist numbers, departed nine days later, like Oswald, all to arrive at the same time, entering from several different cities. They were part of the White Russian Solidarists, the Gehlen emigre community that Lee and Marina mingled with.

This assassination team funded Maurice Brooks Gatlin, Guy Bannister, and the Miami office of Double Check Corporation.

J. Edgar Hoover's Division V, Domestic Intelligence, working with the American Council of Christian Churches, had used this group from the Bowen-Osborne academy of assassins.

Volume XXV of the Hearings has many pages of interviews with people who had sent money to Jack Bowen. They never met him, and some like Mrs. Bessie White, Pikesville, Tenn., mailed $35 a month to John Howard Bowen who she believed had been doing missionary work for 18 years in Mexico." Osborne-Bowen had a mission.

Lee Harvey Oswald, agent from U.S. Defense Dept., had a team of doubles impersonating his behavior, leaving trails of anti-American frustration and meetings with various people.

While Oswald was in Mexico just prior to Kennedy's murder, the purposes were concealed. Meanwhile, the CIA and various authorities led Oswald to the Cuban Embassy, the Soviet Embassy. When the face or voices didn't match the authentic Oswald, it didn't matter, given a difference of 40 to 50 pounds and shape. What came from all this was the conclusion that Oswald had really wanted to go to Cuba next. Which Oswald, and why?

This was to finalize with the illusion of an Oswald-Castro admiration just days before Kennedy would be killed.Senator John Tower and Marina Oswald

One of the most consistent conservatives among Buckley's YAF Advisory Board was Senator John Tower, Texas.

If there is anything he wouldn't want in his back yard it was a defector and his allegedly Communist wife from Minsk.

Yet, two years after joining the YAF team in 1960, Tower was passing all waivers in order for Marina Oswald to get to the United States as soon as possible. Without his permission, this trip might never have taken place. Many wives from the USSR are not that lucky.

March 22, 1962, Senator Tower cooperated. "The sanctions imposed on immigration and nationality are hereby waived in behalf of Mrs. Oswald. The file check on Marina by the FBI, CIA, Dept. of Security Office, Division of biographical intelligence and passport office," (Volume XXIV, 298).

George de Mohrenschildt testified in Volume IX, PP·A 228-229, "Marina Oswald's father had been a Czarist officer of some kind. I don't remember whether it was army or navy.@@

Her real father was never identified by name in all of the testimony.

Between 1948 and 1950 over 200 Byelorussian nazis and their families were brought to New Jersey. Both George de Mohrenschildt and Marina had come from Minsk, part of the Byelorussian area.

The Gehlen nazi emigres were useful to every part of the Kennedy assassination cover-up.

John Tower knew Marina was a safe bet. Otherwise, why the hurry? Our CIA and the Defense Department knew all there was to know about both Oswalds. Therefore, Tower signed the immigration papers fast.

Quote:1960 Elections: Richard Nixon vs. John F. Kennedy

Before the election of 1960, a group within the Christian Right plotted to kill John Kennedy in Van Nuys, California while he was still a candidate.The group was a meld of anti-Castro Cubans, Minutemen and home-grown nazis. Some were sought by Jim Garrison, following his arrest of Clay Shaw, for testimony before the New Orleans grand jury. When Garrison forwarded extradition papers for Edgar Eugene Bradley, a member of the group, Governor Ronald Reagan refused to sign them.

The leader of one of these groups, the Christian Defense League (CDL), was the Reverend William P. Gale. During the war Gale had been an Army colonel in the Philippines training guerilla bands. His superior officer was Willoughby. By the late 1950s Gale was recruiting veterans for his "Identity" group, which was financed by a wealthy Los Angeles man.

One of the CDL's contacts was Captain Robert K. Brown, a special forces professional from Fort Benning, Georgia. Brown was working with anti-Castro Cubans, mercenaries similar to Skorzeny's teams. Brown is now publisher of Soldier of Fortune magazine and paramilitary texts such as Silencers, Snipers, and Assassins. The book explains how Mitchell WerBell made special weapons for the CIA, Bay of Pigs assault squads and other customers. WerBell, son of a wealthy Czarist cavalry officer, perfected a silencer so effective a gun can be shot in one room and not heard in the next. It is ideal for assassinations.

There had been prolonged controversy about how many shots were fired the day Kennedy was killed. The President's wounds, nicks on the limousine and curb, and other bullet evidence indicated quite a few. But the Warren Commission concluded there were only three. It took the testimony of spectators in Dealy Plaza who said they only heard three. It never considered the possibility that silencer-fitted guns were fired.

When Clay Shaw was arrested by Jim Garrison the news was of particular interest to the Italian newspaper Paesa Sera. It followed up with a story that Shaw belonged to a cover organization in Rome named Centro Mondiale Commerciale (CMC). Its location was frequently moved, its presidents rotated; its modus operandi altered. CMC included Italian fascists, elements of the European paramilitary right, the CIA, and the U.S. Defense Department. There were major shareholders with banks located in Switzerland, Miami, Baser and other major cities.

CMC had been formed in 1961, one year after Kennedy was elected. Its principals had worked with fascist networks established after World War II. The board of directors numbered Ferenc Nagy, a former Hungarian premier who led that country's Anti-Communist Countrymen's Party in exile. J. Edgar Hoover brought Nagy to the United States, where there were numerous Gehlen-supported emigre organizations. On August 18, 1951, the Saturday Evening Spot pictured Nagy with Czech, Pole, Hungarian and Russian exiles under the heading: "They Want Us To Go to War Right Now." On November 22, 1963 Nagy was living in Dallas.

CMC was actually a subsidiary of Swiss-based Permindex, whose president was Prince Gutierez de Spadafora, Italian industrialist and large landowner. Spadafora's daughter-in-law was related to Hjalmar Schacht. Clay Shaw, who managed the New Orleans Intemational Trade Mart, was a director. Another was Giorgio Mantello, aka George Mandel, who would later move to New Orleans. Once convicted of "criminal activities" in Switzerland, Mantello worked closely with his fellow Hungarian Nagy. One of the goals of the CMC was that "Rome will recover once again her position as center of the civilized world."

Major L. M. Bloomfield, a veteran of the OSS who resided in Montreal, was a suspect Garrison wanted to question. In Canada he reportedly controlled Credit Suisse, Heineken's Breweries, Israel Continental Company, Grimaldo Siosa Lines and other international firms. Shaw's name was found among eleven directors of a company in Montreal that actually was based in Rome. Who was giving the virtually unlimited money to CMC, and who was getting it? The answer might have been found in the huge amounts that flowed out of Evita Peron's accounts.

Paesa Sera reported on March 4, 1967 that CMC was a creature of the CIA serving as a money conduit, and that Shaw and Bloomfield conducted illegal political espionage under its cover. In New Orleans, Shaw was the respected citizen who had helped restore the French Quarter. In Rome he was a vital member of the boards of twin companies dealing with fascists accused of European assassinations. Shaw's address book contained the private number of Principessa Marcelle Borghese, now Duchessa de Bomartao, who is related to Prince Valerio Borghese. Called the "Black Prince" and "The New Duce," Borghese was leader of the Movimento Sociale Italiano, a neo-fascist syndicate. The Black Prince, who was a decorated submarine captain in the First World War, was convicted of cooperating with the nazis in WW II and given 12 years in prison.

The Black Prince is the same Borghese rescued by the CIA's James J. Angleton. No wonder Angleton was awarded the Sovereign Military Order of Malta by the Pope after the war. It might explain what Angleton was hinting at when questioned about the murder of JFK: "A mansion has many rooms; there were many things during the period; I'm not privy to who struck John."

Clay Shaw's affiliation with Permindex would plug in later to Argentina, Spain, Rome, New Orleans and Dallas. The international range of hit teams, using CIA money diverted overseas to cover companies set up by the Gehlen Organization, started coming together after Shaw's arrest.

In November, 1960 it would be Nixon versus Kennedy. Frank Sinatra introduced Judith Exner to John Kennedy on the eve of the New Hampshire primary. A few weeks later Sinatra introduced Judith Exner to Chicago Mafia boss Sam Giancana. So Exner became involved, as William Safire put it, in a "dual affair with the nation's most powerful mobster and the nation's most powerful political leader."

Giancana was busy with more than his love life; he was hired to form assassination teams to go after Fidel Castro. The man who retained him was Robert Maheu, a former FBI and CIA operative. It was a classic cutoff. Maheu never mentioned that the CIA was behind it. He intimated to Giancana that wealthy Cuban exiles were providing the funds. This sounded plausible, since Maheu was Howard Hughes' right-hand man.

Giancana put his Los Angeles lieutenant, Johnny Roselli, in charge of the hit squads. In 1978 when the House Select Committee questioned him, Roselli hinted that his assignment was aimed at Kennedy as well as Castro. Shortly afterward, his body was found floating in an oil drum off the Florida coast. Giancana never got a chance to testify. He was shot to death in his Chicago home.

The Howard Hughes organization, used as a cover for the kill-Castro conspiracy, (Hughes thought it was a patriotic idea) has long retained Carl Byoir Associates as its public relations arm. Throughout the war Byoir represented nazi bankers and industrialists and the I.G. Farben interests. One of his clients was Emest Schmitz, member of the I.G. Farben-Ilgner and the German American Board of Trade. His Information Services was subsidized by the nazi government. George Sylvester Viereck, editor of the German Library of Information, was also in business with Byoir. A lucrative Byoir client was the Frederick Flick Group. Flick, a Nuremberg defendant released by McCloy, was the single greatest power behind the nazi military muscle. Frederick Flick's son was close to the W.R. Grace Company, and invested over $400,000 in partnership with J. Peter Grace in the United States. During the war, WR. Grace was accused in a military report of protecting a certain nazi Colonel Brite in Bolivia. In 1951, when the CIA smuggled Barbie out of Germany, he was sent to join the same Colonel Brite. George de Mohrenschildt was a close associate of the company's founder, William Grace.

De Mohrenschildt was a man of many faces. He befriended Lee and Marina Oswald, introducing them to the White Russian community. He made phone calls to obtain Lee jobs and housing. As he told it to the Warren Commission, he was fascinated with this strange couple just out of Russia. But at the Petroleum Club in Dallas, De Mohrenschildt sang the praises of Heinrich Himmler. His travels took him all over the world on missions identified with intelligence. In 1956 he was employed by Pantepec Oil Company owned by the family of William Buckley.

De Mohrenschildt often discussed Oswald with J. Walton Moore, the CIA's Domestic Contacts Division resident in Dallas. In the spring of 1963, just after visiting the Oswalds, he went to Washington. There is a record of a phone call de Mohrenschildt made on May 7, 1963, to the Army Chief of Staff for intelligence. The same month he had a meeting in person with a member of that staff. His military connections seem to have been wide. One of the first persons de Mohrenschildt took the Oswalds to see in Dallas was retired Admiral Chester Barton.

Although De Mohrenschildt and his wife Jeanne testified at length before the Warren Commission, only attorney Albert Jenner and Pentagon historian Alfred Goldberg attended. One of Jenner's clients was General Dynamics, maker of the F-lll fighter that would achieve fame in Vietnam. The chief of security for General Dynamics in Dallas, Max Clark, was another De Mohrenschildt associate donating money to help Marina while George got Lee his next job in Dallas. He found one at the graphics house of Jagger-Chiles-Stovall, which held classified military contracts.

Jeanne de Mohrenschildt was originally brought to the U.S. by a family member employed by the Howard Hughes organization. In 1977 George was found fatally shot, allegedly a suicide, on the day a House Select Committee investigator came by looking for him. Jeanne consented to a press interview. She said George had been a nazi spy.

The placement de Mohrenschildt got for Oswald allowed him to visit the Sol Bloom agency at least 40 times. It was this agency that later decided the motorcade route for Kennedy's fatal visit.Ruth Paine, whom Oswald met via George, had called Roy Truly and procured work for Oswald at the Texas School Book Depository. If Maydell and the Gehlen agents were active in the U.S. they knew all the right moves to secure their patsy.

Helen Reyes Wrote:

John Bevilaqua Wrote:...about Vonsiatsky's and de Mohrenschildts White Russian HQ in Harbin, Manchuria (Manchuoko) where he and his close fiends engaged in mind control, programming of Japanese Kamikaze pilots and programmed assassins which he sent on suicide missions into Russia directly from Harbin according to Prof. John Stephan in "The Russian Fascists."

Harbin was "special" in many ways: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unit_731

Quote:Helen, what is your major line of research into the JFK hit?

None, I'm a rank amateur and dilletante. Currently I think E Howard Hunt, some Minuteman guy, Cordon Hull, Maurice Bishop, George HW Bush and a few others tried to make it look like Castro hit JFK, but drew in enough "sponsors" everywhere to make any theory at least plausible. Miami was the planned venue, Jupiter Island a safe house of sorts, Oswald and Thornley and Ferrie and Shaw and Banister just half-involved for cover. But I don't know, I'm open to anything. OK back to the "wall"

PS I don't know how significant it is, but Shirer in Rise and Fall speculated Hitler took the swastika symbol from returning Bavarian freikorps volunteers who discovered it in the Baltics and put it on their helmets. The 4 Baltic states of Finland, Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania all used it as a military insignia and on medals. He didn't seem to notice Blavatsky put it on her hardcover though.

John Bevilaqua Wrote:Jan, It is like we are posting from parallel universes, using common keystrokes from a single pair of hands and sharing only one brain. Which one is it today yours or mine? <grin> This is gettin kinda cringey. Don't tell me that you are half Polish, too, like me? If so, which half then?