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Altgens destroys Zapruder: Z film a blatant fraud - Paul Rigby - 26-04-2009
How easy is to the prove the Zapruder film's fraudulence? Surprisingly so.
Moorman’s photograph of the presidential limousine on Elm.
It is instanced here to show Zapruder’s alleged position & line of sight; and the height of the motorcycle outriders relative to the presidential limousine and the height of its occupants.
This photo is held by anti-alterationists to correspond to Z315-6.
http://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/gallery/displayimage.php?album=11&pos=4
Now for a crop, focusing on the presidential limousine’s right side, of the most famous photograph attributed to Associated Press man James Altgens.
This photograph is held by anti-alterationists to correspond to Zapruder frame 255.
Note the position alongside the Lincoln convertible of motorcycle outrider James Chaney – he has passed Kennedy and is turning to his left rear:
http://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/gallery/displayimage.php?album=2&pos=5
Now let us turn to the corresponding Z frame, 255:
http://www.assassinationresearch.com/zfilm/z255.jpg
Chaney has vanished!
Altgens destroys Zapruder: Z film a blatant fraud - Myra Bronstein - 26-04-2009
I placed the corresponding Altgens and Z-frame, 255, images side by side to make it easier to compare.
Here's the full Altgens as well, for perspective.
And finally, the full Moorman photo to show where Zapruder and Chaney were.
Altgens destroys Zapruder: Z film a blatant fraud - Myra Bronstein - 26-04-2009
Paul,
While I am certain that the Zapruder film has been altered, I'm unconvinced that these images show it. Isn't James M. Chaney's motorcycle 5-10" behind President Kennedy's limo? Wouldn't that place him outside of the Zapruder image, possibly where that white rectangular artifact is?
Altgens destroys Zapruder: Z film a blatant fraud - Paul Rigby - 26-04-2009
Myra Bronstein Wrote:Paul,
While I am certain that the Zapruder film has been altered, I'm unconvinced that these images show it. Isn't James M. Chaney's motorcycle 5-10" behind President Kennedy's limo? Wouldn't that place him outside of the Zapruder image, possibly where that white rectangular artifact is?
Thanks for taking the time and trouble with the photos, Myra. Now, to your question: He was assigned to the right rear, but as the Altgens photo shows, the slow speed of the presidential limo saw him move alongside it, then overtake it. Mark Lane had it right before the WC (2WCH43):
Chaney, according to Lane, said
Quote:“the first shot missed entirely. He said he was 6 feet to the right and front of the President’s car, moving about 15 miles an hour…when the first shot was fired.”
Chaney interview in Houston Chronicle, 24 November 1963.
As Altgens shows, Chaney wasn't at the rear of the limo, but alongside it, exactly as the Houston paper recorded him stating.
He drove on, of course:
That Day in Dallas: The Photographers Capture on Film The Day President Kennedy Died (Danvers, Mass: Yeoman Press, expanded edition, 2000), p.115 & p.119:
On the day of the assassination, Bill Lord of ABC News did a brief interview with Chaneyfor a broadcast over WFAA television. Chaney had this to say:
Quote:“I was riding on the right rear fender. We had proceeded west on Elm Street at approximately 15 to 20 miles per hour. We heard the first shot. I thought it was a motorcycle backfiring and, uh, I looked back over to the left and also President Kennedy looked back over his left shoulder. Then the, uh, second shot came, well then I looked back just in time to see the President struck in the face by the second bullet. He slumped forward into Mrs. Kennedy’s lap, and uh, it was apparent to me that we’re being fired upon. I went ahead of the President’s car to inform Chief Curry that the President had been hit. And then he instructed us over the air to take him to Parkland Hospital, and he had Parkland standing by. I went on up ahead of the – to notify the officer that was leading the escort that he had been hit and we’re going to have to move out. [The shot,] it was back over my right shoulder” (24).”
(24) Bill Lord interview of James Chaney for WFAA-TV, 11/22/63.
"I looked back just in time to see the President struck in the face by the second bullet..." Impossible, of course, if Chaney had not passed the presidential limo - and nowhere recorded in any of the fake films.
Confirmation for Chaney's version:
http://www.jfk-assassination.com/warren/wch/vol7/page345.php
Warren Commission Hearings: Vol. 7, p.345
Testimony of Forrest V. Sorrels
Mr. Stern: Now, did you recognize it at the time as a shot?
Mr. Sorrels: I felt it was, because it was too sharp for a backfire of an automobile. And, to me, it appeared a little bit too loud for a firecracker.
I just said, "What's that?" And turned around to look up on this terrace part there, because the sound sounded like it came from the back and up in that direction.
At that time, I did not look back up to the building, because it was way back in the back.
Within about 3 seconds, there were two more similar reports. And I said, "Let's get out of here" and looked back, all the way back, then, to where the President's car was, and I saw some confusion, movement there, and the car just seemed to lunch forward. And, in the meantime, a motorcycle officer had run up on the right-hand side and the chief yelled to him, "Anybody hurt?"
He said, "Yes."
He said, "Lead us to the hospital."
And the chief took his microphone and told them to alert the hospital, and said, "Surround the building." He didn't say what building. He just said, "Surround the building." And by that time we had gotten almost in under the underpass, and the President's car had come up and was almost abreast of us.
When I saw them get so close, I said, "Let's get out quick," or "Get going fast," or something to that effect. In other words, I didn't want them to pass us, because I knew we were supposed to be in front.
And that is when they floor-boarded the accelerator on the police car and we got out in front. And someone yelled loudly to go to the nearest hospital.
http://www.jfk-assassination.com/warren/wch/vol4/page353.php
Warren Commission Hearings: Vol. 4, p.353
Testimony of Winston G. Lawson
Mr. Lawson: The pilot car was up ahead of us, so appeared other things I recall noting a police officer pulled up in a motorcycle alongside of us, and mentioned that the President had been hit.
http://www.jfk-assassination.com/warren/wch/vol12/page28.php
Warren Commission Hearings: Vol. 12, p.28
Testimony of Chief Jesse E. Curry
Well, on November 22, I was in the lead car of the Presidential caravan. With me were Secret Service Winston Lawson and Forrest Sorrels, and the sheriff of Dallas County, Bill Decker, and we were nearing the triple underpass in the western part of Dallas, and which is near Stemmons Express-way-it was necessary for us to move to Elm Street in order to get on the Stemmons Expressway to get the President's caravan down to the Trade Mart where they were going to have a luncheon.
I heard a sharp report. We were near the railroad yards at this time, and I didn't know--I didn't know exactly where this report came from, whether it was above us or where, but this was followed by two more reports, and at that time I looked in my rear view mirror and I saw some commotion in the President's caravan and realized that probably something was wrong, and it seemed to be speeding up, and about this time a motorcycle officer, I believe it was Officer Chaney rode up beside us and I asked if something happened back there and he said, "Yes," and I said, "Has somebody been shot?" And he said, "I think so." So, I then ordered him to take us to Parkland Hospital which was the nearest hospital, so we took the President's caravan then to Parkland Hospital and they were the President, the Vice President and the Governor--were taken into the hospital and I remained at the hospital for--oh--some hour or so.
http://www.jfk-assassination.com/warren/wch/vol4/page161.php
Warren Commission Hearings: Vol. 4, p.161
Testimony of Jesse Edward Curry
I don't believe so, I am not sure. I am not positive. Because they were in pretty rapid succession. But after I noticed some commotion in the President's car and a motorcycle officer ran up aside of me and I asked him what had happened and he said shots had been fired, and I said, "Has the President been hit or has the President's party been hit? And he said, "I am sure they have."
I said, "Take us to the hospital immediately," and I got on the radio and I told them to notify Parkland Hospital to stand by for an emergency, and this is approximately, I would say, perhaps a couple of miles or so to Parkland Hospital from this, and we went to Parkland and I notified them to have them to be standing by for an emergency, and we went out there under siren escort and went into the emergency entrance.
As I recall, I got out of the car and rushed to the emergency entrance and told them to bring the stretchers out, and they loaded the President…
http://www.jfk-assassination.com/warren/wch/vol3/page266.php
Warren Commission Hearings: Vol. 3, p.266
(Testimony of Marrion L. Baker)
Mr. Belin: Did you talk to any of the other officers who were in or about the President's vehicle at the time of the shooting?
Mr. Baker: Yes, sir; I talked to several of them and all of them had kind of had the same story, you know. It had to come from above and behind.
Mr. Belin: When did you talk to these officers, like Officer Martin?
Mr. Baker: That was--I didn't talk to him until we got back to the city hall, which we got off, we were supposed to get off at 3 o'clock that day, we got off around 4 the same time, they called us all in together.
Mr. Belin: What other officers did you talk to and what did they say that you remember?
Mr. Baker: I talked to Jim Chaney, and he made the statement that the two shots hit Kennedy first and then the other one hit the Governor.
Mr. Belin: Where was he?
Mr. Baker: He was on the right rear of the car or to the side, and then at that time the chief of police, he didn't know anything about this, and he moved up and told him, and then that was during the time that the Secret Service men were trying to get in the car, and at the time, after the shooting, from the time the first shot rang out, the car stopped completely, pulled to the left and stopped.
http://www.jfk-assassination.com/warren/wch/vol6/page294.php
Warren Commission Hearings: Vol.6, p.294
Testimony of Bobby W. Hargis
Mr. Hargis: Yes; when President Kennedy straightened back up in the car the bullet him in the head, the one that killed him and it seemed like his head exploded, and I was splattered with blood and brain, and kind of a bloody water. It wasn't really blood. And at that time the Presidential car slowed down. I heard somebody say, "Get going," or "get going,"----
Mr. Stern: Someone inside---
Mr. Hargis: I don't know whether it was the Secret Service car, and I remembered seeing Officer Chaney. Chaney put his motor in first gear and accelerated up to the front to tell them to get everything out of the way, that he was coming through, and that is when the Presidential limousine shot off, and I stopped and got off my motorcycle and ran to the right-hand side of the street, behind the light pole.
Altgens destroys Zapruder: Z film a blatant fraud - Charles Drago - 26-04-2009
All who would argue for Z-film alteration are obliged to note that conspiracy in the death of JFK is established regardless of the film's provenance.
If you don't, and alteration cannot be unequivocally established, you provide aid and comfort to the accessories after the fact.
Proof of alteration helps along the process of suspect elimination -- if, that is, you choose to conclude that A) alteration was done to cover up evidence of conspiracy, and B) the alterationists were themselves acting on the orders of the conspirators.
For what other reason(s) might the film have been altered?
I can think of at least one.
Altgens destroys Zapruder: Z film a blatant fraud - Myra Bronstein - 26-04-2009
Paul Rigby Wrote:Myra Bronstein Wrote:Paul,
While I am certain that the Zapruder film has been altered, I'm unconvinced that these images show it. Isn't James M. Chaney's motorcycle 5-10" behind President Kennedy's limo? Wouldn't that place him outside of the Zapruder image, possibly where that white rectangular artifact is?
Thanks for taking the time and trouble with the photos, Myra. Now, to your question: He was assigned to the right rear, but as the Altgens photo shows, the slow speed of the presidential limo saw him move alongside it, then overtake it. ...
Thanks for the reply Paul. I'll look at it in its entirety in a moment.
Question first--who is the motorcycle cop to the limo's right rear in the Moorman photo (attached)?
Altgens destroys Zapruder: Z film a blatant fraud - Paul Rigby - 26-04-2009
Charles Drago Wrote:All who would argue for Z-film alteration are obliged to note that conspiracy in the death of JFK is established regardless of the film's provenance.
If you don't, and alteration cannot be unequivocally established, you provide aid and comfort to the accessories after the fact.
Proof of alteration helps along the process of suspect elimination -- if, that is, you choose to conclude that A) alteration was done to cover up evidence of conspiracy, and B) the alterationists were themselves acting on the orders of the conspirators.
For what other reason(s) might the film have been altered?
I can think of at least one.
CD,
We need to be clear that there were two versions of the Z-film, the first of which - described in impressive detail by Dan Rather on 25 November, shown on WNEW-TV, NY, in the early hours of the following morning etc. - sought to convince us of the patsy thesis: To wit, shots from high to the rear. This was a crude and unsatisfactory fabrication, swiftly overtaken by events, most notably the Parkland press conference.
The second version - the one we are familiar with today - represents a much more cunning beast. It was designed to conscript popular suspicion of an inside job to certain elite ends, most notably the campaign to restrain those forces determined to use Vietnam as a springboard into China. The classic synthesis of this cynical business is Thompson's Six Seconds in Dallas, which yolked (non-existent) rear wounds to (misplaced) frontal entries.
I'll offer much more detail on the latter later this year.
Paul
Altgens destroys Zapruder: Z film a blatant fraud - Charles Drago - 26-04-2009
Paul,
We are in agreement. Which is not uncommon, I'm pleased to add.
But I was making an entirely different point which goes to strategy rather than tactics.
I'll try again:
All who would argue that the Z-film was alterered must understand, and must repeatedly include in their pro-alteration presentations (regardless of length or audience) this simple truth: Conspiracy in the death of JFK is established without need of Z-film alteration proof.
Surely you and others can understand this point and, if necessary, expand upon it.
Altgens destroys Zapruder: Z film a blatant fraud - Paul Rigby - 26-04-2009
Paul Rigby Wrote:The second version - the one we are familiar with today - represents a much more cunning beast. It was designed to conscript popular suspicion of an inside job to certain elite ends, most notably the campaign to restrain those forces determined to use Vietnam as a springboard into China. The classic synthesis of this cynical business is Thompson's Six Seconds in Dallas, which yolked (non-existent) rear wounds to (misplaced) frontal entries.
Three golden rules for understanding the history of the Z fake:
1) The cover-up was - and remains - a process, not an event.
2) The coalition which sought and effected Kennedy's removal sundered - and it did so over the question of war with China.
3) The film was not above and beyond the shifts and twists of politics, but instead reflected and mediated them, following the shifting imperatives of the key forces.
To illustrate briefly:
1) The photo attributed to Altgens which captured Chaney alongside the presidential limo received swift and global distribution because it served important purposes at that particular juncture. That it later caused acute problems with respect to the Z film was neither here nor there.
2) Without the China factor, we cannot begin to understand why previously loyal supporters of the coup - Harrison Salisbury, Time-Life etc. - changed tack, however fleetingly, so dramatically in 1966/7.
3) A genuinely dissident analysis of the Z film & related evidence would have left rear wounds where they belong - in the dustbin of history.
Quote:It is no secret in the capitals of the world that an articulate and powerful element of the American decision-making complex believes passionately that the course of national survival lies in making nuclear war on China before her own nuclear potential is realized. The Chinese know this: their error may be in overestimating the influence of the “bomb-‘em-now” school in Washington.
Richard Starnes, “Red China Reacts – With Words,” The Washington Daily News, 1 August 1965, p.19
Altgens destroys Zapruder: Z film a blatant fraud - Jack White - 27-04-2009
Charles Drago Wrote:Paul,
We are in agreement. Which is not uncommon, I'm pleased to add.
But I was making an entirely different point which goes to strategy rather than tactics.
I'll try again:
All who would argue that the Z-film was alterered must understand, and must repeatedly include in their pro-alteration presentations (regardless of length or audience) this simple truth: Conspiracy in the death of JFK is established without need of Z-film alteration proof.
Surely you and others can understand this point and, if necessary, expand upon it.
Charles...there are NUMEROUS PROOFS OF CONSPIRACY in the JFK
case...none dependent on others. The Zfilm fakery is JUST ONE of them.
Let's not exclude it because there are lots of others.
Jack