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FBI's Pants on Fire! - Jim Hargrove - 17-12-2015
A UPI story called"Oswald Case 'Airtight,'" printed in daily newspapers all acrosst he country on 11/24/63, included the following paragraph:
Police Chief Jesse Curry
wove police evidence tighter
around Oswald. He said the
FBI reported that Oswald
bought the Italian 6.5 Carcano
bolt-action rifle with a tele-
scopic sight from a Chicago
mail order house for $12.78.
wove police evidence tighter
around Oswald. He said the
FBI reported that Oswald
bought the Italian 6.5 Carcano
bolt-action rifle with a tele-
scopic sight from a Chicago
mail order house for $12.78.
The next paragraph stated that the handwriting on the paperwork matched Oswald's! Trouble is, the price is completely wrong for the rifle with the scope attached. The real price was $19.95 plus postage. And a certain uncashed, unendorsed money order, which the FBI claimed to have at least 24 hours earlier, was for $21.45, the cost of the rifle with scope plus postage.
I think what happened was that someone at the FBI, in charge of framing "Oswald," misread one of the Kleins ads, which routinely showed a picture of the rifle with scope right above the price of the rifle without the scope. It's easy to make a mistake looking at the ads. And that's what happened.
When the FBI reported that a $12.78 rifle order had Oswald/Hidell handwriting, they were just making up a story and would create the evidence later and backdate all the reports. Amazing. Is business as usual for the FBI and some local police departments? Here's a newspaper.com image of the 11/24 UPI story, which I just found a couple of hours ago.
FBI's Pants on Fire! - Drew Phipps - 17-12-2015
I thought the intrepid Harry Holmes, postal inspector, assigned some girls to look through some store bought magazines and found the Klein's ad.
FBI's Pants on Fire! - Jim Hargrove - 17-12-2015
Sure, I know of another story similar to that too, but it doesn't matter.
On Saturday night, Curry said the FBI had reported that the rifle cost $12.78 from "a Chicago mail order house" and that the FBI had already analyzed the handwriting on the ordering materials and determined it was written by "Oswald."
With all that careful handwriting analysis, it sure is funny all those experts didn't notice the price of the gun... or the amount of the magic money order.
I think it's pretty clear that the FBI was tap dancing for four or five days over the rifle evidence and that they created, and backdated, a bunch of stuff to fix the mess they stepped in.
FBI's Pants on Fire! - David Josephs - 17-12-2015
Something to remember about the Holmes story.
They were looking for a MONEY ORDER in the amount of the rifle plus shipping - an amount that Holmes guesses was:
So I said, "Well, how much was it?" They didn't have a number for the money order, but they had an amount. They had me looking for a money order issued in the amount of $1[B]8.95 wh[/B]ich we couldn't turn up. I had all the manpower and I wanted to examine all these stubs. I said, "Where did you get your information?"
"Out of a sporting goods magazine," they told me.
So I gave one of my secretaries a $10 bill and sent her next door to Union Station which had one of those rotating things they used to have in railroad stations with postcards and magazines. I told her, "You buy every sporting magazine you can find over there and bring them back." So she brought about six of them back, something like that, and I assigned each one of them to whoever was around, inspectors and secretaries, and took one myself. "Now you thumb through those," I said, "and when you come to Klein's Sporting Goods, let's see what it looks like."
It wasn't but a couple of minutes that one of the girls hollered, "Here it is!"So I looked at it and down at the bottom of the ad it said that that particular rifle was such and such amount. But if it could not be carried on a person, such as a pistol, like a shotgun or a rifle, then it was $1.25 or $1.37 extra. Shipping charges were also added, so I added those together, took that figure and called around to all the different stations and the main office where these crews were checking stubs.
It wasn't ten minutes that they hollered, "Eureka!" They had the stub!
and shipping charges? on top of and extra amount related to the ad.... yet amazingly a $21.45 PMO winds up in evidence.
I've attached the PMO timeline I compiled when tracking down the PMO which includes the information the FBI and SS conveyed around to others.
The reason they used $12.78 follows. The one magazine they searched - Field and Stream I believe and not the mag Dept 358's coupon comes from... Americna Rifleman
I believe this is the Ad Holmes claims they found as this is from the Nov 1963 issue and includes an ad for a similar pistol.
What you will notice in the timeline is that the FBI supposedly has the original invoice for $21.45 in their hands by 4am Sat morn yet continues to provide close but not correct info on the amount.
From my work I found there is an amazing conflict with the Microfilm. In back to back reports starting at p187 of WCD7 https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=10408#relPageId=194&tab=page
we find that 3 FBI agents produce a report saying that Waldman KEEPS the microfilm while a virtually identical report from one of the 3, DOLAN, claims he took the film and gave Waldman a receipt and then 2 weeks later returns a copy of the microfilm back to Waldman.
How can we know which is accurate?
With regards to thie Rifle and Pistol purchases, key agents of the FBI, SS & USPS were working together to create evidence of a transaction which never happened.
In fact, I come to learn that C2766 + 99 other rifles were never at Kleins. the evidence produced is a fraud and proveably so.
FBI's Pants on Fire! - Bob Prudhomme - 17-12-2015
Jim Hargrove Wrote:Sure, I know of another story similar to that too, but it doesn't matter.
On Saturday night, Curry said the FBI had reported that the rifle cost $12.78 from "a Chicago mail order house" and that the FBI had already analyzed the handwriting on the ordering materials and determined it was written by "Oswald."
With all that careful handwriting analysis, it sure is funny all those experts didn't notice the price of the gun... or the amount of the magic money order.
I think it's pretty clear that the FBI was tap dancing for four or five days over the rifle evidence and that they created, and backdated, a bunch of stuff to fix the mess they stepped in.
I forget, how did the FBI know the rifle was purchased mail order and not locally in Dallas?
FBI's Pants on Fire! - Tracy Riddle - 17-12-2015
I've always thought it absurd how much extra money Oswald supposedly paid for shipping & handling on this mail-order rifle, almost enough to buy two if he had walked into a store (or one better quality rifle).
FBI's Pants on Fire! - David Josephs - 17-12-2015
Bob Prudhomme Wrote:Jim Hargrove Wrote:Sure, I know of another story similar to that too, but it doesn't matter.
On Saturday night, Curry said the FBI had reported that the rifle cost $12.78 from "a Chicago mail order house" and that the FBI had already analyzed the handwriting on the ordering materials and determined it was written by "Oswald."
With all that careful handwriting analysis, it sure is funny all those experts didn't notice the price of the gun... or the amount of the magic money order.
I think it's pretty clear that the FBI was tap dancing for four or five days over the rifle evidence and that they created, and backdated, a bunch of stuff to fix the mess they stepped in.
I forget, how did the FBI know the rifle was purchased mail order and not locally in Dallas?
They spoke to Feldsott in NYC on the 22nd. Read the Feldsott affidavit (or see my article linked below :-)
The FBI claims he gave them the info that C2766 was sent to Kleins in June 1962. And gave them packing slips.
If you haven't read thru this work you may want to give it a look... http://www.ctka.net/2015/JosephsRiflePart1.pdf
There were only so many companies importing Italian Rifles for wholesale distribution.
The entire rifle, pistol and PMO stories are complete crap. I look into the BYP and then I did an article on the pistol which again shows two distinct paths for what was supposedly the same weapon.
------------------------
Bob - we need to remember that Phase 1 was a commie conspiracy. The rifles would/should lead back to Castro supports (Robert McKeown for example who claims an Oswald and a cuban visited him around Labor Day 1963 asking to buy 4 scoped rifles for $10,000) - if planted by the CIA then these rifles might lead to even more embarassing FBI connections in order to keep them in line as they did in so many areas.
The FBI's own reports describe a June 1962 shipment of rilfes that includes a "N"2766 yet there are no records in evidence of Kleins ever getting a June shipment... The Order to Crescent for the TS rifles from Jan 1962 is changed in April to FC rifles which finally arrive in Feb 1963. The first Rifles RUPP removes are in AUG 1962. IOW - the records are designed to support a Feb 1963 shipment - possibly. In the same FBI report they mention a March 1963 Kleins shipment which includes a "C"2746.
"The records of Kleins disclosed...."
As I say - The Evidence IS the Conspiracy - all we need do is take the time to look, compile and present - the eBook in large format for images is in the works....
DJ
FBI's Pants on Fire! - Jim Hargrove - 17-12-2015
David Josephs Wrote:Bob - we need to remember that Phase 1 was a commie conspiracy. The rifles would/should lead back to Castro supports (Robert McKeown for example who claims an Oswald and a cuban visited him around Labor Day 1963 asking to buy 4 scoped rifles for $10,000) - if planted by the CIA then these rifles might lead to even more embarassing FBI connections in order to keep them in line as they did in so many areas.
Hey, D.J. - Agree that the attempted "Oswald" purchase from McKeown is critical here. People need to remember that Robert McKeown was a really close personal friend of Fidel Castro, and that he had already been convicted in the U.S. of running guns for him. Had Oswald succeeded in buying the rifles from Fidel Castro's gun-running friend, does anyone here doubt one of those guns would have turned up on the 6th floor of the Book Depository on 11/22? Can you see the headlines....
Fidel Castro's Rifle Kills JFK....
... or something equally lurid. Man, we would have invaded Cuba within days, which surely was the original goal of the assassins.
My bet is that the reason the rifle evidence is so terrible can be traced right back to the day McKeown smelled a rat and refused to sell to Oswald. McKeown's long-secret testimony is really convincing, despite the HSCA's denials. McKeown steadfastly refused to testify until he was granted full immunity.
FBI's Pants on Fire! - Drew Phipps - 17-12-2015
I read Bob's question to ask, "How did the FBI claim to have determined it was a mail order rifle, and precipitating all these searches?"
FBI's Pants on Fire! - Jim Hargrove - 17-12-2015
I *think* the deal was they traced the rifle to it's importer, Crescent Firearms, via the C2766 serial #. (Importers and retailers were required to keep records of each rifle.) As DJ said, Cresent's owner Louis Feldsott then told them about Kleins, which was a huge mail order operation. Maybe DJ can help if this isn't quite right.