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+--- Thread: Judyth Vary Baker: Living in Exile (/thread-3232.html)
Judyth Vary Baker: Living in Exile - Bernice Moore - 10-03-2010
Magda Hassan Wrote:http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2140352666545542746# Is this the one?
YES YOU QUICKIE YOU...TA B:alberteinstein::vroam:
Judyth Vary Baker: Living in Exile - Dawn Meredith - 10-03-2010
Bernice Moore Wrote:Magda Hassan Wrote:http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2140352666545542746# Is this the one?
YES YOU QUICKIE YOU...TA B:alberteinstein::vroam:
Thanks.
For the life of me I cannot understand why two people are trashing a book that neither has bothered to read.
Most curious.
Dawn
Judyth Vary Baker: Living in Exile - Bernice Moore - 10-03-2010
i just came in on this thread...which book.fill me in ta.Harvey and Lee or JUDYTHS first printed books.....b:flowers:
Judyth Vary Baker: Living in Exile - James H. Fetzer - 10-03-2010
MORE FROM JUDYTH ABOUT BIOWEAPONS: I appreciate Karl Kinaski's posts, because Judyth does have a story to tell--and, in my opinion, it is quite fascinating. She is a far more articulate, intelligent, and resourceful student of this case than at least 95% of the members of this forum. While I am convinced that she is "the real deal", even if she were not, her ability to marshal evidence for her interpretation of events is simply astounding and, based upon my experience, far exceeds that of her critics.
From Judyth:
I know a lot about the biowarfare efforts going on...I know the names of the doctors involved, as I saw their sign-off initials on our reports and I am not that stupid. I looked up the initials and saw how they were linked together...
There really was an Op to kill off Africans...One thing they did, and perhaps most important of all, is the monkeys we infected were sent to Haiti to get safely through Customs without tracing back to the US, then shipped back to Africa.
This is mind-blowing to me, because Haiti is where AIDS first showed up -- they cover this up as much as they can and try to tell people that a chimp, erx. bit somebody in Africa and that's how it spread. Nonsense. Those people were eating monkey brains and chimp flesh, etc., for centuries with no problem.
This critter was modified and let loose again in Africa.
I have shown the staff at Trine day as well as Ed how they did it, even when they did it.
They replaced the lost infected monkeys in fall of '63, around August 19th, with new monkeys shipped IN from Africa...I even remembered the newspaper article and made a xerox of it, which I have shared through the years with researchers, from the TYimes-Picayune, of course...And they shipped the monkeys in on a Sunday when nobody would notice...and had the article in the Sunday afternoon paper...
Today, you will hear that the AIDS precursors hail back to the 1930's.
This is not true, as a close look at the 'evidence' will reveal.
-------------------
I didn't answer the second question. Re: Dr. Sherman.
I had been in contact with Dr. Ochsner beginning when I was only 15 years old, when I met him at the dedication of the Watson clinic and showed him my cancerous fish.
![[Image: 19plxt.jpg]](http://i42.tinypic.com/19plxt.jpg)
Mrs. Georgianna Watkins of the American Cancer Society, where I worked as a volunteer in her office helping hospital patients, took me to the dedication of the clinic to meet Dr. Ochsner.
I met him again at the Science Writers Seminar, where I crashed the seminar and met Noble Prize winners, etc. Absolutely dedicated that they saw my work. It got in all the papers.
I enclose one such article.
![[Image: r2lt8k.jpg]](http://i44.tinypic.com/r2lt8k.jpg)
Dr. Ochsner knew I had the nerve to work with him on something like his project.
I was only 17 when I crashed the exclusive seminar in St. Petersburg. They invited me back. I thus became the first high school student ever 'invited' to the seminar. This was the 4th Science Writer's Seminar ...I met three Nobel Prize winners. One of them paid for my transportation that summer to work at Roswell Park Institute directly under Dr. George H. Moore.
![[Image: 295uzbq.jpg]](http://i39.tinypic.com/295uzbq.jpg)
Moore and Ochsner were close friends. They testified in the same anti-smoking cases against big tobacco. I had given lung cancer to mice faster than had been done in any of the fancy labs, under primitive conditions.
They personally inspected my work, which is also mentioned in newspaper articles. Moore, Dr. Diehl, and Dr. Ochsner testified together in other court cases. They were close friends. Dr. Diehl's personal card is enclosed for your inspection. He was in charge of research for the American cancer society-and its funding.
![[Image: qwwnet.jpg]](http://i41.tinypic.com/qwwnet.jpg)
I may be the only person in the world who has retained a card from Dr. Diehl. I saved it as part of the evidence to prove how close I was to the very top of the American Cancer Society's officials.
Dr. Ochsner was president of the American Cancer Society in their late 50's. Interestingly, his good friend "Wild Bill" Donovan, who founded the OS and was also the driving force to found the CIA, was Ochsner's close friend and also at the same time Ochsner was president. He was on several important access committees.
Finally, Donovan died at Walter Reed after being treated unsuccessfully in Ochsner's hospital--free of charge.
![[Image: 9zwq9t.jpg]](http://i41.tinypic.com/9zwq9t.jpg)
All these and many more details have been vetted by "60 Minutes", Marrs, Haslam, Shackleford, Platzman, Devries and Dankbaar....Greg Burnham saw some of it, too.
It is all plainly laid out in my book.
Judyth Vary Baker: Living in Exile - James H. Fetzer - 10-03-2010
MORE FROM JUDYTH ON CANCER RESEARCH AND BIOWEAPONS, PART II
Note that these seminars used to be very, very important and exclusive. It took 42 years to make the reports accessible to the public. The format has changed, though: it used to last longer and the reports could last up to 45 minutes and were extremely technical. There was no panel format.
=INTERNET REFERENCES ARE SLIGHT===
THE SEMINAR 4/1-6/1977 LASTED FIVE DAYS
THE SEMNAR April 5-10, 1963 LASTED FIVE DAYS
Writers seminar March 20 - 26 1976
==I CONTEND THE SEMINAR LASTED 5 1/2 days, but we can only find 5 days as dates everywhere else....The last half-day involved some special presentations and I cannot remember the press being present...They then came to my school and inspected my work...One was a Nobel prize winner, involved with bioweapon activity at University of Chicago, Dr. Urey...
A search on google tells you lots about the Nobelist:
![[Image: spua7q.jpg]](http://i42.tinypic.com/spua7q.jpg)
As for the science writers' seminar, the article here shows it finally was opened to the public after 42 years, in a different format...The true breakthroughs and deep tests were no longer being revealed to science writers, btw...
Cancer Immunology
http://archderm.highwire.org/cgi/reprint/84/6/948.pdf
by L GOLDMAN – 1961
![[Image: 33bg7pj.jpg]](http://i42.tinypic.com/33bg7pj.jpg)
Society Science Writers Seminar, 1961, St. Peters- burg, Fla. 5. Syverton, J. T.: Immunology and Cancer, ... Editorial, J.A.M.A. 169:1758 (April 11) 1959. ...
Webcast of ACS Science Writers Seminar
Webcast Offers Insight into Reporting of Cancer News
----
Article date: 2000/04/05
An opportunity to gain a better understanding of how medical reporters decide which advances in cancer research should be reported to the public is available beginning this week at http://www.cancereducation.com.
For the first time in the 42-year history of the American Cancer Society’s (ACS) Science Writers Seminar, the three and a half days of lectures on some of the latest cancer research – unfiltered by the press – may be viewed in their entirety via a special audiovisual presentation on the CancerEducation.com web site.
The seminar brings together some 30 top medical reporters and 30 leading cancer researchers to learn from one another in scientific and social sessions.
"This will be a rare opportunity for the public to hear these cancer research papers delivered on a level that is not quite as complex as they would be at a scientific meeting but with a sophistication geared to reporters who follow the cancer field," said Michael S. Weiss, CEO of CancerEducation.com. "At the same time, the public can see how these beat reporters probe the scientists to see what news is the hottest and how certain they are of their conclusions."
The format of the seminar involves two sessions a day, with four or five panel members giving 10-minute talks. Each talk is followed by 10 minutes of questioning from the reporters. Before each panel, the session chairperson briefs the reporters on the context of the papers they are about to hear.
Viewers can log in at their leisure to catch what is of interest during the 14 hours of sessions, or come back time after time to see the entire seminar. They may also see the full program and read the papers presented by visiting the News Room.
"Observing reporters and scientists communicate with one another should be a real boost for both patients and clinicians in their understanding of how research news is presented and delivered," said Harmon Eyre, MD, chief medical officer of the ACS.
"Our hope is that this unique collaboration with CancerEducation.com will be a valuable tool to help people make truly informed medical decisions."
Viewers will notice that the seminar’s opening panel is on women’s cancer and includes presentations on ovarian, endometrial, cervical and vulvar cancer. The women’s cancer panel is followed by one on colorectal cancer, then one on alternative and complementary therapies – which includes presentations on high-dose vitamin C, acupuncture against chemotherapy-induced nausea, anticancer activity of Japanese maitake mushrooms and the herbal remedy PC-SPES.
Other panels cover cancer genetics, breast cancer and prostate cancer. The breast cancer panel includes presentations on antidepressants used to fight hot flashes and the risk of experiencing fuzzy thinking even a decade after chemotherapy. The prostate cancer panel delves into the provocative question of whether the era of PSA (prostate-specific antigen) testing has led to a reduced death rate from the disease.
"It’s not always so easy to defend one’s research to a room full of skeptical reporters who have heard it all before," said Dr. Marc Lippman, director of the Lombardi Cancer Center at Georgetown University and chairman of CancerEducation.com’s medical advisory board.
[quote name='Karl Kinaski' post='186431' date='Mar 10 2010, 08:32 PM'][quote name='Glenn Viklund' post='186404' date='Mar 10 2010, 03:38 PM']First a note: All markings in bold and italic are done by me today.
Basic facts:
SNIPPED BY ME TO PREVENT BOREDOM[/quote]
I can't help, Mr. Viklund, but your words SMELL...what is your intention here on this forum, what is your profession, where do you come from, are you one of those Judyth Stalkers out of the fishy McAdams Team, operating with her stolen manuscript? Asylum-seeker, provisional asylum, blabla... I don't give a damn, Mr. Viklund. Judyth has a story to tell, don't interrupt her with this uninteresting of topic asylum quibble.
KK
[/quote]
Judyth Vary Baker: Living in Exile - James H. Fetzer - 11-03-2010
JUDYTH RESPONDS: WHO IS MR. VIKLUND? HOW DID HE LEARN CONFIDENTIAL INFORMATION ABOUT ME?
HE WRITES:
'Of course, even though the ONLY ONE COUNTRY that ever looked at these arguments of you being ”hunted” and more, said they did not believe a word of these claims–here's exactly what they wrote:
”Judyth Vary Baker has not shown that any likelihood of her native country lacking the will or the capabilities to protect her, exists.”
REPLY: IT IS A FACT THAT NO AMERICAN CAN 'PROVE' THAT THEIR COUNTRY LACKS THE WILL OR CAPABILITY TO PROTECT ONE OF ITS CITIZENS. SEE WHAT A PERSON WHO RECEIVES A DEATH THREAT, SUCH AS DR. FETZER, HAS TO SAY ABOUT THE CAPABILITY OF HIS COUNTRY TO PROTECT HIM FROM THAT THREAT.
THIS IS THE STANDARD REPLY THEY HAD TO MAKE FOR AN AMERICAN. TO SAY OTHERWISE WOULD BE POLITICALLY INCORRECT, NO MATTER HOW MANY DICK CHENEYS ARE RUNNING THINGS.
End quote. Anyone who takes the time to read the upper court's decision will certainly see that she tried to prove just that. A monumental cascade of reasons is what she presented them with. None, of course, that made any impression on either one of the two courts involved in Judyth's case..."
How did Mr. Viklund learn that I had supplied the court with "a monumental cascade of reasons" unless he had access to my confidential files?
How did he get that quotation?
Here is a misstatement from Mr. Viklund:
”Glenn Viklund [glenn54.vikl...@dataphone.se] wrote:
> One last thing. The document published by Tony is just a request for her
> to come in to the immigration authorities. It's got nothing to do with her
> appeal, or her being granted on appeal.
[REPLY: It was sent only as proof was not an illegal alien and was in the system when the accusations were made by Barb, McAdams, and Co.]
On the contrary, this document is
> what any asylum seeker would receive after having been denied asylum. They want to arrange for her trip back home -
[NOTE from JVB: The document said FOR ME TO COME IN TO DISCUSS WHEN I WAS LEAVING SWEDEN, NOT A RETURN TO THE UNITED STATES.]
...which probably means that they will pay for her trip to wherever she is going when leaving Sweden.
[NOTE from JVB: 'PROBABLY' IS UNTRUE. ONLY you are deported to your home country, do they pay for your trip. They do not pay for your transportation to any other country. I paid my own way out and there was no deportation order involved. I come and go freely back and forth between Sweden and other countries. This would not have been allowed if I had been deported.]
This person got into my private files. How else did he know there was "a monumental cascade of reasons" when every single document and photo I offered was labeled confidential and I was promised that it would be kept confidential forever?
Or Mr. Viklund has amazing powers to read through file cabinets, apparently, with x-ray vision, to see how thick my file was.
He then goes on to say:
'I note that ”provisional asylum” is still today a frequently used description in various forums, even though this term does not exist. ASYLUM SEEKER, folks. It really isn't that hard. Try it, it works and above all – it is the correct description of her status during her stay in Sweden. She provided an ID in this thread with a photo. ”ASYLSÖKANDE”, which is the Swedish word for ASYLUM SEEKER.
![[Image: 24n0hky.jpg]](http://i46.tinypic.com/24n0hky.jpg)
[NOTE from JVB: Mr. Viklund is conflating the term 'asylum seeker' --which describes the person--with 'provisional asylum' which describes the situation of the asylum seeker who is waiting for the decision. What does he prefer to call it? Asylum-seeker-waiting-for-final-decision?
I have already posted examples of the term being used on the Internet in 2008 and 2009 and can provide some more for Mr. Viklund.
But it is time for Mr. Viklund to identify himself as more than somebody connected to a cell phone system and tell us how he was able to find out direct quotes from my confidential files that were NOT stated to me, as my personal witnesses can attest. I would not like to think that Mr.. Vicklund was allowed to write down direct quotes from my files.
How did he get them?
What does Mr. Viklund do for a living? I just talked to my friends in Sweden via email and they are shocked that he did such a thing. He is considered a spy by my friends in Sweden. The Swedes are sensitive about both human rights and the right to confidentiality of files regarding those seeking political asylum. They realize somebody's life could be endangered if these files are not kept confidential.
For example, regarding violation of privacy, no photos are allowed to be taken of people using ATMs. Some of their rights have recently eroded.
What a mean thing he says next:
ASYLUM SEEKER, the correct description of her status....is used to define Africans, Arabs and such. Doesn't quite have the same shine to it, now does it, Pamela.
What is this man saying? That the desperate who come to Sweden to save their lives are to be sneered at? 'Africans?' 'Arabs and such'? What kind of man is this Mr. Viklund, if that is his name? This is NOT the way the Swedes I know talk.
NOTE THIS:
(February 2010) ..... Throughout this year, Egyptian police have shot dead 20 African asylum seekers ...
They certainly would have preferred to have been in Sweden...
Viklund also writes:
About the document they provided, where a rather insignificant summon to a meeting is presented as a grant of asylum. The intellectual level of this kind of argumentation is that of a rather naive child.
[JVB: Why more sneers? This was already explained as a simplification..heaven knows it was provided only to prove i was not an ILLEGAL ALIEN, as these people accused me of being...]
....he claims he is a 'lurker' --fine...that very, very rare native Swede, conveniently located in Sweden, that speaks up, after a decade, on McAdams' newsgroup....Go ahead and buy that, people....Even if he DOES show up again when inspired by events on this forum...a Swede, no less! on the newsgroup, though he never posted before, and after a couple posts, never would again.”
[JVB: sorry, bringing up his name meant that he had to surface again...]
Lots of errors here. I contacted McAdams, on my own initiative.
[JVB: Prove it, Mr. Viklund...They constantly reported my whereabouts for years, on a regular basis...]
As I've explained, I've been following the JFK debate for a long time, and found it interesting that JVB was in Sweden. I realised that I could quite easily check some of the things that were furiously debated regarding her asylum process, at that time. And yes - I have made a few posts after dec -08, but I've mainly remained a reader of the forum. Yes - a lurker, if you insist...
”HE REPORTED ON WHAT HE COULD FIND OUT ABOUT MY CASE AND MY PRIVATE FILES. HE EVEN PUBLISHED MY CASE FILE NUMBER ON THE INTERNET, SHOCKING ALL THE SWEDES I KNOW, WHO ARE VERY INTERESTED TO MEET THIS PARAGON OF ETHICAL BEHAVIOR, AN EMBARRASSMENT TO THEM.”
These files are not your private domain at all. They are official records, held at the courts involved and are publicly available to anyone who asks for them.
[JVB: You can't get them online. You have to MAKE A LOT OF PHONE CALLS---EVEN THEN, GOOD LUCK AT GETTING ANYTHING...MY SWEDISH FRIENDS TRIED TO DUPLICATE YOUR FEAT...They say you made a trip there or made a special contact that you should not have made unless you had some morbid interest and persuaded others to cooperate... My own friends tried to duplicate what Mr. Viklund said he accomplished. They are shocked at what he said he was able to do with "telephone calls."... I urge anyone who wishes to try to get the same information about me --a known friend, not a McAdams clone--to try to do so....if they can get confidential information, I can sue for breach of confidentiality.]
You are no exception from the rule, whatsoever. You will need to learn a few things about the Swedish principle of public access to records. It is part of our constitution and cannot be fiddled with.
[Public access to decision records does not include public access to confidential information given by a political asylum applicant...see below....not descriptions of my files....]
BUT FIRST, FINISHING WHAT HE WROTE:
Question: Since I came from Hungary, a Schengen country. WHY WASN'T IMMEDIATELY DEPORTED BACK TO HUNGARY, TO HAVE THEM HANDLE MY REQUEST, SAVING SWEDEN A LOT OF MONEY AND INVESTIGATION TIME?
Not so, most likely this was because your time in Hungary had ran out. In which case you – and everyone else – coming from any other Schengen country would have to be considered for the asylum process in Sweden. But lets give you the benefit of doubt here: what kind of permit did you have during your stay in Hungary?
[JVB: My time in Hungary had not run out. So why was I not sent back THERE? My passport shows I had only been there 2 months when forced to leave due to threats. You can stay 90 days without a work permit, as in all EU countries.... But I was working as a teacher, which included getting our work permits in Bratislava, Slovakia before it became Schengen. NOTHING 'ran out.' ]
As you seem to have copies of mostly everything, just Xerox it and publish it in this thread. Should be a quick thing.
[JVB: FIRST, let's get Xeroxes about who YOU really are, Mr. Viklund. My Swedish friends are anxious to find you. They want to meet you. They wish to discuss with you your violation of my privacy rights...They are shocked and horrified at what you have disclosed, showing you managed to get into confidential records. They were also shocked at what you said about Africans and Arabs. They think you are Swedish, but they also think you're a spy.]
NOTE THIS STATEMENT:
Well, the process of Political Asylum is about protection from something. Nothing particular about your claim here. The definition of political asylum is that you are on the run. That's what you claimed – from a whole lot of things by the way, when reading your lengthy story sometimes unclear exactly from whom or what - and that's what they considered during the process.
[JVB: Just how does Mr. Viklund know what elements of my testimony they considered?
He also writes:
”MY SWEDISH FRIENDS WERE VERY UPSET, BECAUSE MY FILE NUMBER WAS NOT EASY TO GET. THEY COULD NOT GET IT. ”
Well, too bad. It shouldn't take anyone more than a few phone calls.
”I WAS TOLD MY FILE NUMBER WOULD 'ALWAYS' REMAIN CONFIDENTIAL AND THAT ANYTHING I PUT IN THAT FILE WOULD REMAIN CONFIDENTIAL, FOREVER”
Highly unlikely that anyone told you this. The process is the same for all, and your case was in every respect treated according to standard practice. I don't believe a word of this. What was the officials name? The probability of your case being exempt from our constitutional laws are so miniscule that it is neglectable.
![[Image: i5pv15.jpg]](http://i43.tinypic.com/i5pv15.jpg)
==Note here how hard it is to get a 'positive' on appeal==
![[Image: 2v0bask.jpg]](http://i40.tinypic.com/2v0bask.jpg)
A. IT IS OUR POLICY NOT TO COMMENT ON INDIVIDUAL ASYLUM REQUESTS IN ORDER TO PROTECT
THE INTEGRITY AND CONFIDENTIALITY OF THE ASYLUM PROCESS.
An analysis carried out by the three Swedish migration courts, in Stockholm, Gothenburg and Malmö, shows that the proportion of asylum appeals that are rejected differs greatly between the courts. During the last quarter of 2006, 38% of asylum appeals were sustained in Gothenburg, while only 20% in Stockholm and 27% in Malmö respectively. Possible explanations for the difference in verdicts include differences in the process regarding the number of judges determining cases and whether asylum-seekers get to speak in court or not, as well as variation in the asylum cases including the age of the case and origin of asylum-seekers. The migration courts, which have started a database where they will be able to compare each other’s verdicts, point out that there are a few guiding verdicts by the Migration Court of Appeal.
(Dagens Nyheter 1 June 2007 http://www.dn.se/DNet/jsp/polopoly.jsp?d=147&a=656477)
[quote name='Karl Kinaski' post='186431' date='Mar 10 2010, 07:32 PM'][quote name='Glenn Viklund' post='186404' date='Mar 10 2010, 03:38 PM']First a note: All markings in bold and italic are done by me today.
Basic facts:
SNIPPED BY ME TO PREVENT BOREDOM[/quote]
I can't help, Mr. Viklund, but your words SMELL...what is your intention here on this forum, what is your profession, where do you come from, are you one of those Judyth Stalkers out of the fishy McAdams Team, operating with her stolen manuscript? Asylum-seeker, provisional asylum, blabla... I don't give a damn, Mr. Viklund. Judyth has a story to tell, don't interrupt her with this uninteresting of topic asylum quibble.
KK
[/quote]
Judyth Vary Baker: Living in Exile - James H. Fetzer - 13-03-2010
HERE IS A RESPONSE I RECEIVED FROM JUDYTH THIS MORNING. BECAUSE SHE NEEDS NEW GLASSES, SHE FREQUENTLY USES ALL CAPS. Sometimes she uses === and sometimes not. I take the liberty of correcting her typos and occasional misspellings and improve the formatting to make what she is saying easier to follow. The use of ===, I would observe, is not a permanent trait, as this post--which, because it is short, I post here exactly as I received it--itself displays. The edited version shows the way in which I would edit it for posting, where Judyty has been following all of my postings and approves of the manner in which I have been handling them.
ORIGINAL FROM JUDYTH:
I gave an authorized interview to DE GROENE AMSTERDAMMER PUBLISHED JUNE 21, 2003. THE INTERVIEW IN SMALL PRINT ON LARGE PAGES GOES ON FOR 4 FULL PAGES---FROM PAGE 20, 21, 22 AND 23
.THE COVER WAS THE MUIG SHOT OF LEE, SIDEWAYS, TAKLEN 11 23 63. THE NAME OF THE ARTICLE WAS 'DE MOORD OP KENNEDY: HET KAN NOG GEKKER"
(HE IS NOT THE KILLER)
IT WAS WRITTEN BY RENE ZWAAP.
AFTER THAT CAME ANOTHER MAGAZINE ARTICLE. THIS NE I WAS NOT ALLOWED TO SEE OR CORRECT BEFORE IT WENT TO PRESS, AS WIM DANKBAAR MAY RECALL. WE WERE DISAPPOINTERD WITH SEVERAL STATEMENTS IN IT THAT WERE INACCURATE.
THE FOUR PAGE ARTICLE BY RENE ZWAP MENTONS NOTHING ABOUT WHO SPOKE FIRST, BUT IS A MUICH LONGER ARTICLE. PLEASE HAVE THE GENTLEMAN WHO QUESTIONS 'WHO SPOKE FIRST' IN RUSSIAN TO SEND THE ARTICLE AND TANSLATION. IT MAY BE YET ANOTHER ARTICLE OVER WICH I HAD NO CONTROL.
FOR EXAMPLE, AN ARTICLE BY THE 'SUN'--A TABLOID-- ABOUT ME, SHOWED A PHOTO OF RUTH PAINE HOLDING A CHILD AND SAID IT WAS MARNA OSWALD.
AS A WITNESS WHO HAS ALWAYS STARED NEQUIVOCALLY THAT OSWALD RESPONDED TO ME IN RUSSIAN WHEN I SPONTANEOUSLY THANKED HIM, IN RUSSIA, FOR PICKING UP A DRPPED NEWSPAPER, I MUST ASK WHY I SHOULD BE RESPONSIBLE FOR WHAT A FOREIGNER WRITES ABOUT ME, WHICH HAS BEEN TRANSLATED BY BABBLEFISH, WHICH TURNED LEE'S NAME INT "LEE HARVEY NURSE" AND SO ON.
I AM ON FM IN 2003, THE SAME TME THE DUTCH MAGAZINE ARTICLES CAME OUT, STATING LEE SPOKE TO ME FIRST. GO LISTEN TO THAT.
NIT=PICKING.
JUDYTH
There are many errors using 'bablefish" to translate.
VERSION FOR POSTING:
JUDYTH'S RESPONSE ABOUT MEETING LEE:
There are many errors using 'bablefish" to translate.
I gave an authorized interview to DE GROENE AMSTERDAMMER PUBLISHED JUNE 21, 2003.
THE INTERVIEW IN SMALL PRINT ON LARGE PAGES GOES ON FOR 4 FULL PAGES---FROM PAGE 20, 21, 22 AND 23.
THE COVER WAS THE MUG SHOT OF LEE, SIDEWAYS, TAKLEN 11 23 63.
THE NAME OF THE ARTICLE WAS 'DE MOORD OP KENNEDY: HET KAN NOG GEKKER"
(HE IS NOT THE KILLER)
IT WAS WRITTEN BY RENE ZWAAP.
AFTER THAT CAME ANOTHER MAGAZINE ARTICLE.
THIS ONE I WAS NOT ALLOWED TO SEE OR CORRECT BEFORE IT WENT TO PRESS, AS WIM DANKBAAR MAY RECALL.
WE WERE DISAPPOINTED WITH SEVERAL STATEMENTS IN IT THAT WERE INACCURATE.
THE FOUR PAGE ARTICLE BY RENE ZWAAP MENTIONS NOTHING ABOUT WHO SPOKE FIRST,
BUT IS A MUCH LONGER ARTICLE.
PLEASE HAVE THE GENTLEMAN WHO QUESTIONS 'WHO SPOKE FIRST' IN RUSSIAN TO SEND THE ARTICLE AND TRANSLATION. IT MAY BE YET ANOTHER ARTICLE OVER WHICH I HAD NO CONTROL.
FOR EXAMPLE, AN ARTICLE BY THE 'SUN'--A TABLOID--ABOUT ME, SHOWED A PHOTO OF RUTH PAINE HOLDING A CHILD AND SAID IT WAS MARINA OSWALD.
AS A WITNESS WHO HAS ALWAYS STATED UNEQUIVOCALLY THAT OSWALD RESPONDED TO ME IN RUSSIAN WHEN I SPONTANEOUSLY THANKED HIM, IN RUSSIAN, FOR PICKING UP A DROPPED NEWSPAPER, I MUST ASK WHY I SHOULD BE RESPONSIBLE FOR WHAT A FOREIGNER WRITES ABOUT ME, WHICH HAS BEEN TRANSLATED BY BABLE FISH, WHICH EVEN TURNED LEE'S NAME INTO "LEE HARVEY NURSE" AND SO ON?
I WAS ON FM IN 2003, THE SAME TME THE DUTCH MAGAZINE ARTICLES CAME OUT,
STATING LEE SPOKE TO ME FIRST. GO LISTEN TO THAT.
[THIS IS] NIT-PICKING.
JUDYTH
[quote name='Barb Junkkarinen' post='186515' date='Mar 11 2010, 07:58 AM'][quote name='John Gillespie' post='186489' date='Mar 11 2010, 04:47 AM']Professor Fetzer,
I wrote to Judyth several years ago through this forum about something that ought to strike any number of folks as very significant. There was an interview in a Dutch magazine with Judyth in which she told the interviewer that when she met LHO he spoke first and in Russian. Then, I saw shortly thereafter that McAdams (if you'll pardon the expression) has it the other way around: that Judyth says she spoke first and in Russian.
I don't believe McAdams and do believe what I read after translating the Dutch interview on Babelfish. But either way this is major and more than a bit curious why this has not come under a harsher light. Now, if no one gets why any of this is significant, so be it (duh). But, if you or someone else could get her to retell that tale without prompting her, terrific. She didn't respond to my email. Thanks.
As Always,
JG[/quote]
Hi John,
Here is an excerpt from a post Judyth posted herself in 2001. It is a very long response to comments made by Mary Ferrell; salient excerpt only here, the entire message can be found at: http://groups.google.com/group/alt.assassi...sassination.jfk
NOTE: Mary Ferrell's words are indicated by the ">" ... Judyth's comments are easy to recognize, as she sets them off in ======== at the beginning and end of each comment.
Judyth V. Baker View profile
More options Dec 30 2001, 11:51 am
Newsgroups: alt.assassination.jfk
From: electlad...@aol.com (Judyth V. Baker)
Date: 30 Dec 2001 14:51:16 -0500
Local: Sun, Dec 30 2001 11:51 am
Subject: Re: Mary Ferrell on Judyth
[......]
>She [Judyth-bj] was so startled that she dropped a rolled-up newspaper
> that was under her arm and Lee Oswald stooped and retrieved it. When
> he handed it to her, she thanked him in Russian.
=====ERROR. i have plainly repeated what happened her to many readers.
As i was HANDED the letter, i dropped the rolled-up paper that had a
coded message printed in it: "JARYO...nice here..." etc. It was kissed
with lipstick and LHO noticed it, he later told me. I WAS NEVER
STARTLED BY ANYTHING. He picked it up and handed it to me and I said
thanks, comrade, In Russian, Today, I say "TUSEN TAK" in Norwegian. It
was a habit i had and have always kept, ask any of my friends, to say
'thank you' in various foreign languages. ======
On page 53/54, Volume I of her published book, Judyth wrote:
I put the stamp on the letter automatically, and handed it to the postman. As I did so, I lost my underarm grip on the newspaper, and the newspaper -- with the envelope that had the ad on it -- fell to the floor. The young man picked up the newspaper, and, after glancing at the circled and red-marked ad, and the envelope, he handed it back to me. I took it, and gave him my prettiest smile.
I had a habit of saying a few common phrases. such as thank you, goodbye, or hello, in Russian, wanting to keep up my slight abilities in the language. With almost nobody to speak Russian to, this was my strategy. I had worked too hard to allow all my Russian to slip away.
"Karashaw, Tovarietsch," I said, in my atrocious Russian.
I was also sort of flirting with this young man, miffed that there was nothing at all for me from Robert (he wasn't 'Bobby' to me now!) But instead of puzzling/inyeresting the young stranger with my Russian phrase, as I'd hoped, I received a shock. For he leaned close to me and said, in perfect Russian, "It's not good to speak Russian in New Orleans."
NOTE: The tranlaltor I posted before does not work on her text, because romanized words are often spelled in different ways.
Хорошо (harushow, or karusho are pretty close) means "good" ...
Спасибо (Spasiba) is "thank you."
Saying, "Good, comrade" could be used loosely as "thank you, comrade" but is not the direct translation/meaning of the word she used.
Товари (tovarishch) does translate as "comrade" ... her romanized spelling is just different, but pretty close.
Bests,
Barb :-)
[/quote]
Judyth Vary Baker: Living in Exile - James H. Fetzer - 13-03-2010
Here's another post about this, which I am posting before I am able to track down a link, titled BARB, TRYING TO LOOK 'FAIR':
JUDYTH WROTE THIS IN RESPONSE TO WHO SPOKE FIRST:
I put the stamp on the letter automatically, and handed it to the postman. As I did so, I lost my underarm grip on the newspaper, and the newspaper -- with the envelope that had the ad on it -- fell to the floor. The young man picked up the newspaper, and, after glancing at the circled and red-marked ad, and the envelope, he handed it back to me. I took it, and gave him my prettiest smile.
I had a habit of saying a few common phrases. such as thank you, goodbye, or hello, in Russian, wanting to keep up my slight abilities in the language. With almost nobody to speak Russian to, this was my strategy. I had worked too hard to allow all my Russian to slip away.
"Karashaw, Tovarietsch," I said, in my atrocious Russian.
I was also sort of flirting with this young man, miffed that there was nothing at all for me from Robert (he wasn't 'Bobby' to me now!) But instead of puzzling/interesting the young stranger with my Russian phrase, as I'd hoped, I received a shock. For he leaned close to me and said, in perfect Russian, "It's not good to speak Russian in New Orleans."
NOTE: The translator (?) I posted before does not work on her text, because romanized words are often spelled in different ways.
Хорошо (harushow, or karusho are pretty close) means "good" ...
Спасибо (Spasiba) is "thank you."
Saying, "Good, comrade" could be used loosely as "thank you, comrade" but is not the direct translation/meaning of the word she used.
Товари (tovarishch) does translate as "comrade" ... her romanized spelling is just different, but pretty close.
BARB WROTE: HOWEVER, JIM, SHE IS NOT QUITE RIGHT IN THE TRANSLATION SHE OFFERS. SHE SAYS,
NOTE: The translator (?) I posted before does not work on her text, because romanized words are often spelled in different ways.
Хорошо (harushow, or karusho are pretty close) means "good" ...
Спасибо (Spasiba) is "thank you."
Saying, "Good, comrade" could be used loosely as "thank you, comrade" but is not the direct translation/meaning of the word she used.
Товари (tovarishch) does translate as "comrade" ... her romanized spelling is just different, but pretty close.
Bests,
Barb :-)
==THE 'GOOD, COMRADE" "KARASHAW" WAS USED INSTEAD OF THE EASILY-SAID 'SPASIBA' because Lee had done an 'action'--had picked up the fallen newspaper and handed it to me....It is a lingusitic matter that I chose "karashaw" instead of "spasiba" which would not have recognized the effort of bendng down to pick up the paper, but just for handing me the paper.
==j==
[quote name='Barb Junkkarinen' post='186547' date='Mar 11 2010, 07:53 PM']Thanks, Jim ... a link to the radio interview would be great. And would clear it right up.
Thanks,
Barb :-)
[quote name='James H. Fetzer' post='186544' date='Mar 11 2010, 06:41 PM']Good catch, Barb. I think the comma was superfluous and what it should have said is,
I WAS ON FM IN 2003, THE SAME TIME THE DUTCH MAGAZINE ARTICLE CAME OUT
STATING LEE SPOKE TO ME FIRST. GO LISTEN TO THAT.
without the comma. What she means, no doubt, is that at the same time the article
came out (stating Lee spoke to me first), I was on the air explaining what happened
(where he picked it up a paper I had dropped and gave it to me and I thanked him in
Russian). Dropped paper, picked up, expression of thanks (by Judyth) in Russian.
AS A WITNESS WHO HAS ALWAYS STATED UNEQUIVOCALLY THAT OSWALD RESPONDED
TO ME IN RUSSIAN WHEN I SPONTANEOUSLY THANKED HIM, IN RUSSIAN, FOR PICKING
UP A DROPPED NEWSPAPER . . . (where I have corrected the typographical errors . . .)
In the context of this post, is there really any ambiguity? Just drop the comma and
reread the post. Apart from the comma, I don't think there's anything wrong here.
But I will ask if there is an archive where the interview can be heard and get back.
[quote name='Barb Junkkarinen' post='186542' date='Mar 11 2010, 06:25 PM'][quote name='James H. Fetzer' post='186538' date='Mar 11 2010, 05:07 PM']ORIGINAL FROM JUDYTH:
AS A WITNESS WHO HAS ALWAYS STARED NEQUIVOCALLY THAT OSWALD RESPONDED TO ME IN RUSSIAN WHEN I SPONTANEOUSLY THANKED HIM, IN RUSSIA, FOR PICKING UP A DRPPED NEWSPAPER, I MUST ASK WHY I SHOULD BE RESPONSIBLE FOR WHAT A FOREIGNER WRITES ABOUT ME, WHICH HAS BEEN TRANSLATED BY BABBLEFISH, WHICH TURNED LEE'S NAME INT "LEE HARVEY NURSE" AND SO ON.
I AM ON FM IN 2003, THE SAME TME THE DUTCH MAGAZINE ARTICLES CAME OUT, STATING LEE SPOKE TO ME FIRST. GO LISTEN TO THAT.[/quote]
The two statements above are at odds with one another. Which is it? And listening to this radio broadcast sounds like a good idea. Where can we find it?
Barb :-)
[/quote]
[/quote]
[/quote]
Judyth Vary Baker: Living in Exile - James H. Fetzer - 13-03-2010
JUDYTH WRITES: SO WHO IS THIS "GLENN VIKLUND" AND WHAT IS HE DOING HERE? PART I
Mr.Viklund first showed up on McAdams' newsgroup, including Barb J, after that newsgroup contended I was an illegal alien of Sweden, and Pamela and Shackleford provided a letter showing I was legally in Sweden.
Viklund said he was a lurker.
After delivering information on me, he largely vanished -- until The Education Forum had Barb posting on the political asylum matter again.
Mr. Viklund appeared again, and made many statements showing he had made a big effort to get into my political asylum records. My own friends in Sweden could only get the "verdict."
Today I found this:
![[Image: 2mzcggk.jpg]](http://i42.tinypic.com/2mzcggk.jpg)
====It seems our 'lurker' has charged $$$$ in the past to obtain information about people====
He stated that I 'probably" had overstayed my time in Hungary. I have documents proving otherwise.
He says I am not to use the internet to defend my statements. But I have the right to do so.
The US Human Rights Report on Sweden comments on persons coming from other EU countries to Sweden for political asylum:
http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/hrrpt/2008/eur/119107.htm
"The government returned asylum seekers who arrived from EU countries or from countries with which it maintained reciprocal return agreements. In most cases persons returned had passed through or had asylum determinations pending in other EU countries. In many cases authorities deported asylum seekers within 72 hours of their arrival."
![[Image: v6ndw5.jpg]](http://i49.tinypic.com/v6ndw5.jpg)
[quote name='Barb Junkkarinen' post='186546' date='Mar 11 2010, 07:50 PM'][quote name='Pamela McElwain-Brown' post='186532' date='Mar 11 2010, 04:21 PM']Since "Glenn Viklund" has decided to make an appearance on the Ed Forum and post his take on Judyth's experiences in Sweden without posting anything to document exactly what his connections are to the situation, are we to then infer that we are to be considered 'sheeple' and just swallow without questioning anything he says?
More precisely, what documentation, if any, does "Glenn Viklund" claim connects him in any way to this situation?[/quote]
"
LOL! So now someone who follows the case, who gets documentation, and about a subject *you* started in the first place, needs "documentation" connecting himself to the situation" before he can post about it?
His connection to the issue is the same as just about everyone else ... he has been interested in the JFK case for decades, follows the discussions, Judyth was long ago made part of those discussions, you made the asylum issue part of the discussion a couple years ago when you claimed she was living under asylum in a foreign country.
By all means, don't be a swallowing "sheeple" (as you note above) ... as he has stated, anyone can call the migration board and get the same information he did. He got it by phone, then in writing, then obtained the actual documents. Just why do you cast aspersions on his character rather than check the actual info yourself first to verify his information? The name of the person he spoke to and got the written info from has been posted. That's a trail to the source lit up like a runway at night.
And, tsk, tsk anyway. As a moderator posted in this thread just yesterday, "(iv) Members should not make personal attacks on other members. Nor should references be made to their abilities as researchers. Most importantly, the motivations of the poster should not be questioned. At all times members should concentrate on what is being said, rather than who is saying it. It is up to the reader to look at the biography submitted by the poster, to judge whether they are telling the truth or not. The word “liar” is banned from use on the forum."
Barb :-)
[/quote]
Judyth Vary Baker: Living in Exile - James H. Fetzer - 13-03-2010
Nice point, Pamela! I am still stunned that, after nearly 20 years of research on JFK, Wellstone, and 9/11, I only received my first DEATH THREAT after I took an interest in Judyth and began speaking out on her behalf:
1. EMAIL:
![[Image: 11t6hpz.jpg]](http://i48.tinypic.com/11t6hpz.jpg)
2. SUSPECT:
![[Image: 5pkcgh.jpg]](http://i40.tinypic.com/5pkcgh.jpg)
3. DATE OF BLOG:
![[Image: 25f7wid.jpg]](http://i39.tinypic.com/25f7wid.jpg)
Of course, Barb, who has an "explanation" for EVERYTHING, will have one that has nothing to do with Judyth. But like so many of her other posts, it fails the "smell test". It is only after I have made a public statement on behalf of Judyth Vary Baker that I am subjected to this kind of harassment!
For more about cyberwarfare and internet harassment, visit http://jamesfetzer.blogspot.com/2010/02/yo...berwarfare.html
[quote name='Pamela McElwain-Brown' post='186559' date='Mar 11 2010, 10:54 PM'][quote name='Karl Kinaski' post='186557' date='Mar 11 2010, 02:40 PM']
Another uppercut for Barb! Uh, I like this fight! Great entertainment!
KK[/quote]
We are witnessing a full-blown Barb-offensive against Judyth. Of course, it has been Barb's mission for many years to track down every detail of Judyth's life, including trying to find where she was being hidden by the Swedish govt, so this should come as no surprise.
But there is also a larger dynamic, which you have already eloquently addressed -- namely, who and what will attempt to block Judyth from having an open forum?
If Judyth were truly as insignificant as Barb tries to portray her, surely there would be no need for an offensive in the first place.
[/quote]