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Anyone want to discuss HARVEY & LEE? - Jim Hargrove - 13-07-2015 Jim Hargrove Wrote:Tom Scully Wrote:You are an attorney, Dawn. Is it not considered, in your line of work, that a claim that an FBI report is fake or otherwise unreliable, is an extraordinary claim? What are the obligations (burden of proof) of the party who makes such a claim? If there is anyone here who thinks the FBI is a trusted source for the Kennedy assassination post, please reply to this. Thank you. Anyone want to discuss HARVEY & LEE? - Jim Hargrove - 13-07-2015 Jim Hargrove Wrote:In 1975 Warren Commission co-counsel Burt W. Griffin said, "All of the records were in the hands of the two agencies (FBI and CIA) and, if they so desired, any infor*mation or files could have been destroyed or laundered prior to the time the Commission could get them." [Houston Chronicle, 9/2/75] Sorry about the "bump." I try not to do that often, but my posts on the FBI came at the very bottom of a page and may have been missed by most people. Anyone want to discuss HARVEY & LEE? - Albert Doyle - 13-07-2015 I think Scully is done. When I accused him of stirring up a fluster instead of directly answering points he returned with a bizarre collection of text quotes that never really say anything and never really answer anything. Apparently his argument method is a sort of soap box speech making that only returns to his regressive orations and never answers your specific arguments. Scully never answered the fact that the personality profiles of both men, combined with SR Landesberg's undeniable use of a southern accent, confirms that the provocateur and Rizzuto were definitely two different men. Scully avoids answering this because he knows it works against his semantic quote-based argument method. Scully never bothered to address the fact that Barry Gray spoke to both men and said they were different people. Turner only met with Rizzuto. His witnessing is worthless in this context. There's simply no way that the awkward, unconfident and yielding SH Landesberg, with his tendency to break in to stressful stuttering when pressured, was the same man who passably pulled off character impersonation in a lengthily-sustained southern accent during interviews, and, more importantly, during rough provocateur work where he was under pressure. Apparently Scully thinks nitpicking the details of FBI reports translates into holy infallibility in FBI reports where the FBI self-description of obvious frame jobs becomes sacrosanct and unquestionable. Scully noticeably never answers where he draws the line on truthfulness in FBI reporting? Apparently he thinks once you prove someone got a minor detail on an FBI report wrong that translates to unlimited license for claiming everything in FBI reports is true. And he doesn't have to answer to any other evidence. Anyone who tries to ignore the fact SR Landesberg was strongly associated with southern accents and fit the personality description of L'eandes perfectly is just flat-out dishonest and not credible. They're in denial of the evidence. FBI was clearly avoiding investigation of this individual and trying to pin blame on SH Landesberg. They would use the same telemetric for Ralph Yates shortly after. While Golz was a good investigator he really dropped the ball badly by not realizing the importance of what he witnessed on TV and making all efforts to identify the specific program. He really screwed up there because he had a huge opportunity. Like weasels seeking the easiest opportunity deniers take full advantage of this video not being found. Parnell is what you call a "Denial Troll". It's part of the COINTELPRO psy-ops strategy to flagrantly deny some very obvious evidence in your face. The greater the outrageousness of the denial the more effective the result. I'm not not sure how that translates into the recent poll taken on H&L. I don't know what percentage of those negative voters are agents or what percentage are recent neo-con contrarians who have transformed their frustration with the evidence into anal attacking of fringe witnesses. Sort of like caged animals turning on each other in cannibalism. It's obviously time to ignore Parnell since his gig is mostly based on ignoring evidence and trolling denial. That's more a game for children than any serious researchers. . Anyone want to discuss HARVEY & LEE? - Albert Doyle - 13-07-2015 What the deniers are avoiding here, to their eternal loss, and the fatal destruction of their position, is that there's no doubt that even with their fraudulent FBI version of Rizzuto that even FBI admits he was doing provocateur work. I assume the photo FBI possessed was from a rally where Rizzuto was allegedly photographed attracting attention to himself by doing that provocateur work. Where the deniers fail and where their excuse-making no longer works to get them out of the evidence is the fact that even if Rizzuto was L'eandes (which he clearly wasn't) that therefore any person he claimed was sponsoring him would definitely be a serious person of interest that normal FBI procedure would want to either confirm or discount. The mental illness excuse would not serve as reason to not investigate Rizzuto possibly being sponsored. Even after going to the wrong hotel neither FBI nor the deniers have any excuse for not pursuing Regan to find out if the proven provocateur L'eandes had any sponsorship. The deniers' constant excuse-making for everything doesn't cover this and credible people would not accept it. This is clearly viable proof that FBI was avoiding any honest investigation of the evidence. The deniers also have no right to ignore that SR Landesberg was clearly the person associated with a southern accent. For them to blithely brush this off at their own word deserves objective evaluation. They are clearly grasping for the extreme opposite that goes against the vast majority of the evidence and need to be judged for it by credible persons other than themselves. Despite their obvious denial SR Landesberg was well-known to affect a southern accent, as L'eandes was described as doing. Barry Gray said Rizzuto and L'eandes were two different people. Anyone want to discuss HARVEY & LEE? - Dawn Meredith - 13-07-2015 Albert: I take issue with this: "While Golz was a good investigator he really dropped the ball badly by not realizing the importance of what he witnessed on TV and making all efforts to identify the specific program. He really screwed up there because he had a huge opportunity. Like weasels seeking the easiest opportunity deniers take full advantage of this video not being found." Golz was a fine reporter and except for Penn Jones and Dorothy Kilgallen, was the ONLY reporter to actually write the truth on this case, until he retired from journalism. I knew Earl and he was a fine man. Perhaps he did try to learn more on this and was not successful. Dawn Anyone want to discuss HARVEY & LEE? - Albert Doyle - 13-07-2015 I'm not trying to tear down Golz, he did a good job with Carolyn Arnold. Even small hints of what, where, and when this show occurred could allow others to identify it. Proof of SR Landesberg admitting he regretted getting mixed up with Lee Harvey Oswald would practically prove Armstrong's claim by itself. It has to be out there somewhere. Anyone want to discuss HARVEY & LEE? - Tom Scully - 13-07-2015 Anyone want to discuss HARVEY & LEE? - Tom Scully - 13-07-2015 Albert Doyle Wrote:What the deniers are avoiding here, to their eternal loss, and the fatal destruction of their position, is that there's no doubt that even with their fraudulent FBI version of Rizzuto that even FBI admits he was doing provocateur work. I assume the photo FBI possessed was from a rally where Rizzuto was allegedly photographed attracting attention to himself by doing that provocateur work. Cite your source, back your claim. Please avoid risking the hypocrisy of posting a source footnoted by an FBI report. Support your claim so as to afford us all an opportunity to consider your sources, and weigh them. SH Landesberg was arrested. You are making an extraordinary, unsupported claim that if accurate, interferes with what a reasonable person would believe justified the arrest of Landesberg for the crime of providing the FBI with false information. Barry Gray Not shown to assert that "Rizzuto and L'eandes were two different people," makes the arrest of Landesberg more likely to be reasonable. You cannot have that because it erodes your belief system, but you cannot so far, and I've asked you to post it numerous times, support your claim of what Barry Gray believed. You resort instead to repitition and attacking me personally. Are your tactics in lieu of posting support for your opinion, effective? Post proof "Barry Gray said Rizzuto and L'eandes were two different people.", or retract your claim and post an apology, or if you cannot rise to that level, simply cease and desist! Who do expect your audience for your acting out is? You bloviate uncannily similarly to "conclusions" that the WCR was replete with. Page 3 of 3 : pg. 90 https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=62288&search=rizzuto_and+Barry#relPageId=90 Anyone want to discuss HARVEY & LEE? - Jim Hargrove - 14-07-2015 Anyone want to discuss HARVEY & LEE? - Tom Scully - 14-07-2015 |