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+--- Thread: Mary's Mosaic: Entering Peter Janney's World of Fantasy (/thread-9490.html)
Mary's Mosaic: Entering Peter Janney's World of Fantasy - Jim DiEugenio - 28-06-2012
Well, I can tell you did not even read the book.
According to Damore he found the so called diary. Not once, not twice, but three times.
Except Janney couldn't find them and, conveniently, Damore never revealed them to anyone.
Now, prior to Damore, the story was that they supposedly contained traces of her affair with JFK. And that is why they were eliminated.
I am not even sure I believe that. But I'll believe that before I buy what Janney is selling.
Mary's Mosaic: Entering Peter Janney's World of Fantasy - Charles Drago - 28-06-2012
The core truth in this disinformation -- if it is such, and I'm leaning that way.
"They killed him because they couldn't control him anymore."
Of course, I could have told you that.
Mary's Mosaic: Entering Peter Janney's World of Fantasy - Jim DiEugenio - 28-06-2012
Charles I can see that you know very little about this matter also.
So please read Lisa's excellent essay and then read mine since I will touch on matters she leaves out.
What you are quoting does not come from any "diary".
It comes from that CIA asset Timothy Leary. And it is complete crap that I will go over minutely in my essay. Leary did not utter one word of this stuff until decades after Mary Meyer died. ANd he did it to sell books. Just like he made up an alleged affair with, get this, Marilyn Monroe. Now if you believe that Leary slept with Monroe then you might buy Ultimate Sacrifice also.
But the idea that JFK was changing in 1963 is absurd. It was one of the faults with the Douglass book. And it is something I will correct in my book this fall. Kennedy could not be changing since, once in the Senate, he was never a Cold Warrior to start with. Kennedy got his education not from toking with Mary Meyer in 1963. But from his discussions in Edmund Gullion's office in Saigon in 1951. And this is what started him on his opposition road with Allen Dulles which exploded after the Bay of Pigs in 1961. And its what caused him to immediately break with the Dulles brothers foreign policy once he was inaugurated. And this was exemplified in Laos, Vietnam, Indonesia, COngo and even Iran at THAT TIME! This idea that Kennedy was "turning" after the Missile Crisis is, in large part, a myth. But bullshit artist Tim Leary did not know that. So he sold it in his book. But it only holds if you don't study Kennedy's career. IF you do it exposes Leary as the liar he was. And the idea that JFK needed someone like Mary Meyer to show him the way in foreign policy is so ridiculous as to be risible.
But this is the snake oil that Janney is selling. Straight out of John Simkin.
Please CD, you are better than that.
Mary's Mosaic: Entering Peter Janney's World of Fantasy - Phil Dragoo - 28-06-2012
From James Douglass, JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why It Matters, Chapter Three: JFK and Vietnam, page 93:
Ten years before he became president, John F. Kennedy learned that it would be impossible to win a colonial war in Vietnam.
In 1951, when he was a young member of Congress, Kennedy visited Vietnam with his twenty-two-year-old brother, Robert. At the time France was trying to reassert control over its pre-World War II colony of Indochina. Although the French army's commander in Saigon insisted to the Kennedys that his 250,000 troops couldn't possibly lose to the Viet Minh guerrillas, JFK knew better. He was convinced by the more skeptical view of Edmund Gullion, an official at the U.S. Consulate. Kennedy knew and trusted Gullion, who had helped him earlier as a speechwriter on foreign policy.
Author's source: Note 1 Richard D. Mahoney, JFK: Ordeal in Africa (New York: Oxford University Press, 1983), p. 108.
~~~
Why would someone place seventy thousand at the foot of high gun emplacementsoh, they'll never be able to get up there.
Kennedy saw the same fatal hubris in the CIA Bay of Pigs.
Did he turn on, tune in, trip out with Mary? Can we believe Tim Leary?
I saw Baba Ram Das in Ginsberg's harmonium trio and the former was mum.
A Cheshire Cat smile.
Mary's Mosaic: Entering Peter Janney's World of Fantasy - Seamus Coogan - 28-06-2012
I dunno when it was that I began to distrust Tim Leary.
I guess was at my cousins place way back in my teens, well before JFK mania took full control. I had heard of him previously but hadn't thought to much about him. Anyhow, he appeared on TV talking about all manner of drugs. I recall either my cousin and or one of his mates saying the guy was something like a 'full of shit try hard' and/or 'sell out'. I think they had read some biographies detailing Leary's nefarious interractions with some 60's bands/contempories my cousin and his bandmates were fans of. Anyhow, Leary then became a wanker lol (best advice my cousins mate's ever gave me it turns out). Anyhow, I matured and had a chance to break free of my cousin and his pal's influence. I read some of his stuff and decided that yeah, he was pretty self infatuated. Thus I thought 'Oh well he is a dick' and moved on with my life.
He reawakened my brain however, when he had his ashes spread in space. It was about this time I suspected something odd was up.
Soon after his this I heard he was hanging out with psychopath G Gordon Liddy doing speaking tours prior to his death in the 90's. I know now their engagements began way back in 1982!!!! (http://www.nytimes.com/2006/06/25/books/review/25sante.html?pagewanted=all). It only get's worse though cos he appeared in a film with Liddy in 1979 (http://www.druglibrary.net/schaffer/lsd/books/bel7.htm). Not surprisingly it emerged some years later he was an informant for the police. Apparently the official truth came out in about 1999. But I swear blind I'd heard this a couple of years earlier. As it turns out there was a lot of shit about this going down in the early 70's, with PILL 'People Investigating Leary's Lies' set up by his counter culture contemporaries like Allen Ginsberg, who now thought he was a fraud. Nonetheless, the question of course is while Leary was prepared to spill his guts when he got arrested. How far back did his ties to the establishment really go? http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/380815.stm. The drug library link above goes into some detail about this. I am also pretty sure Jim or someone here has posted some good stuff on this.
Now please I am not denoting CD in this. But one thing I have seen, is that it's pretty hard for some people to accept that their heroes of yesteryear were likely something else. I once had a bitter row with some homophobe dick about James Dean. The guy couldn't get it through his head that Jimmy 'his hero' was as camp as a row of tents! It's even worse in the political field, I've had some big time row's with naifs who adore intelligence/establishment groupies like Gloria Steinem. I've never crossed swords with Kenn Thomas of Steamshovel Press, but he has long been an admirer of Leary. In fact I think he regularly runs to Leary's aid if he's called out, claiming an age old establishment smear campaign against him. After viewing Kenn's schtick with regard to all manner of bollocks concerning JFK. It is little wonder Kenn admires a liar like Leary. Because, regardless of who or what Leary was. That is essentially what he is. As Jim says he once claimed to have slept with Monroe. At the end of all this is one fact. Not to long after I had looked into Leary, I first read Jim's article, when he mentioned that it was Leary himself who was the source for the acid story, which I'd heard about but had never sourced. I was like "Oh my god why did I ever consider this shite plausible?".
Mary's Mosaic: Entering Peter Janney's World of Fantasy - Albert Doyle - 28-06-2012
Side point: I wonder what subtle nuances Janney witnessed as a person who literally existed in a CIA living room? Bad research practices or not.
Mary's Mosaic: Entering Peter Janney's World of Fantasy - Seamus Coogan - 28-06-2012
Albert Doyle Wrote:Side point: I wonder what subtle nuances Janney witnessed as a person who literally existed in a CIA living room? Bad research practices or not.
Yeah bro that was what Lisa was saying near the end.
Mary's Mosaic: Entering Peter Janney's World of Fantasy - Jim DiEugenio - 28-06-2012
That's come really great stuff there on Leary, Seamus.
I am really going to go after Janney for using him as a major source.
Mary's Mosaic: Entering Peter Janney's World of Fantasy - Seamus Coogan - 28-06-2012
Jim DiEugenio Wrote:That's come really great stuff there on Leary, Seamus.
I am really going to go after Janney for using him as a major source.
I'm flattered but bamboozled. I thought it was you who gave me the lowdown on his CIA/LSD linked stuff lol. Id bloody like to know who did.
Mary's Mosaic: Entering Peter Janney's World of Fantasy - Lauren Johnson - 28-06-2012
Hey mate,
Any opinions on Mimi Alford's book?