24-03-2010, 05:11 PM
(This post was last modified: 24-03-2010, 09:32 PM by James H. Fetzer.)
JUDYTH COMMENTS ON THE "TWO" MARGUERITES
[NOTE: This will be presented in three parts and may require some work for me to get it right.]
WHO WAS MARGUERITE OSWALD? PART III
A study of Marguerite Claverie Oswald as [proposed] surrogate mother of “Harvey” Oswald
![[Image: dpfkuw.jpg]](http://i44.tinypic.com/dpfkuw.jpg)
Between 1939 and the late 60’s or so, a lot can happen when hypothyroidism is at work. Hypothyroidism often goes undiagnosed. Even today, it is called the most undiagnosed of all chronic debilitating conditions. Note this Google entry (and there are many more):
1. Hypothyroidism— the Most Under-Diagnosed Condition | EmpowHER ...
24 Mar 2009 ... Hypothyroidism— the Most Under-Diagnosed Condition. March 24, 2009 - 2:18pm 833 reads 2 ... CONNECT with Women Interested inHypothyroidism ...
http://www.empowher.com/.../hypothyroidi...-condition - Cached
To review: Fully developed thickened nose. The chin gets thicker with the condition. Facial features coarsen. Hair loss continues. “…the hypothyroid state [includes] fat pads on back, pudgy hands, broad face, fiat nose, large tongue, and pot belly.’
![[Image: vqpg1w.jpg]](http://i44.tinypic.com/vqpg1w.jpg)
It is possible that Marguerite Oswald had this condition. It would explain what seems to be “two” Marguerite Oswalds.
It is a natural explanation, a reasonable one, and one which must be considered. Often the simplest explanation for why a person seems to be different from what she looked in high school is a medical explanation. My features also changed and coarsened and I gained weight because I, too, suffered from hypothyroidism for years before it was diagnosed.
The only photo where “Marguerite”’s eyebrows do not go upward is in an early photo John Armstrong obtained of Marguerite Oswald showing her ‘tall and slender’ tough she is sorter than those around her in the photo — it is the one shown above after the Ekdahl photo. But one thing at a time.
The matter of height –- a concern voiced by Armstrong who sees a reduced height later -- is not thoroughly addressed. Measurements can be take from photographs. Marguerite is shown in the Ekdahl photo wearing fashionable high heels. Over time, osteoporosis can make a woman lose inches in height. But did Marguerite really shrink to shrimp-size?
![[Image: 2hwlef9.jpg]](http://i43.tinypic.com/2hwlef9.jpg)
Marina Oswald and I are both 5’ 2” tall. In this photo, Marguerite sits higher in the couch than Marina does. Her head is higher, while her legs are extended, showing she is actually seated further forward than Marina, and therefore, is even a bit taller than she seems here. Marguerite is more than 5’ 2” tall. She seems closer to 5’ 5.” Measurements can be taken.
In the next photo, her shoulders are not much lower than Robert Oswald’s (turned). Robert is considerably taller than Marina: hence, Marguerite is not ‘that’ short, after all.
![[Image: 15q4rxc.jpg]](http://i40.tinypic.com/15q4rxc.jpg)
MARGUERITE OSWALD’S SPEECH HABITS
I have taken many linguistics courses, including courses at the doctoral level, at three universities -- most recently, at the University of Louisiana at Lafayette. Besides courses there in sociolinguistics and psycholinguistics, one course was an independent study on Cajun and Louisiana-based linguistic speech habits.
First, we must establish the identity of the woman in the photograph above as native-born in Louisiana with Cajun speech community influences, as her French-style maiden name suggests.
Marguerite Oswald was born Marguerite Claverie. In the interview cited here, a linguist can hear certain word choices and their pronunciations typical of an urban-raised Cajun who had lived a long time in the New Orleans area.
I interviewed over 400 Cajun speaking older people for a research project and have kept some of these tapes. I chose people who were live adults in 1963, partly because I hoped to find witnesses concerning Lee and me. An article I wrote about these interviews was published in the local Lafayette, LA newspaper during the Christmas season of 1998, about Christmas as ‘it used to be” from the 1960’s backward to the early 1920’s. Such a topic gave me the opportunity to hear the names and whereabouts of relatives. In this manner, in fact, I was able to locate one of my witnesses, Anna Lewis.
With this background information, and the information shown just below, we assert the fact that Marguerite Oswald’s voice indicates that she was born and raised in New Orleans, her speech habits influenced by her Cajun-bred family and environment. We must then ask ourselves if this woman was capable of being a substitute mother for “Harvey” as claimed. For now, we will not look at Lee’s/Harvey’s school records — this we leave for another examination to be forthcoming.
MARGUERITE OSWALD’S RECORDED INTERVIEW ~1965:
There are traces of Texas accent in her voice—not surprising, since she also lived for years in Texas. However, the linguistically-trained ear can pick up typical Cajun-influenced pronunciation in Marguerite’s interview, which was conducted after the Warren Commission’s report was issued:
“Didn” intead of “didn’t” (no ‘t’ sound)
“im-ME-jut-lee” instead of “immediately”
Another place says, she does say ‘immediately,’ but it is in a different kind of placement in the sentence, allowing her more time to speak the word properly… Such a mixed linguistic habit is commonly found in urban New Orleans speech patterns in the 1960’s, among Cajuns with some early education in standard English.
“Course” instead of “of course’
“Hah-vey” instead of “Harvey”
“wile” instead of “wild”
“…understand the impact of all of this…” all spoken with a in Cajun-influenced accent
“I din’n give him the emotional support…”
In addition, her sentence structure habit is also Cajun-influenced.
Conclusion: Marguerite Claverie Oswald was born in Louisiana and her early childhood, at least, was spent specifically in the New Orleans area. She has had only a moderate level of education, but the length of her sentences, length of words chosen, and appropriate responses under stress in this interview indicate that she was above average in intelligence.
A note in passing: I have also analyzed Lee Oswald’s voice recordings and assert that Lee Oswald spent his childhood in New Orleans, though he eradicated a great deal of his Texas-influenced accents and had mainstreamed his English speech patterns.
Due to his dyslexia, which made reading more difficult, Oswald had developed a good ear I compensation, allowing him to pass his classes more easily and also to pick up foreign languages with great facility. His facility in Russian came, however, from much practice, as I as a witness can testify. Lee Oswald constantly practiced his Russian with me.
I have brought to the attention for a decade the fact that Lee Oswald used the words “axed” /”Ax” for “ask”/”asked” in his radio ‘debate’ as well as before radio and TV microphones in Dallas just prior to his death by assassination.
In conclusion, the question has been raised: were there two Marguerite Oswalds, one raising “Harvey” and the other raising “Lee”? Photos of a relatively tall and slender Marguerite are matched against later photos showing a shorter, dumpy-looking woman.
I state as a witness that Lee Oswald told me his mother had aged fast --before her time -- and he blamed himself and his brothers as being a great burden to her. As a single mother, she found herself unable to cope with three boys and almost fell apart. Lee said that later, she had started to develop a goiter when they lived in Texas. Only recently, she had started using iodized salt and the goiter was being corrected. I explained to him that people with goiters had a thyroid problem –- and that was probably why she was depressed, moody, had gained so much weight, and why her hair was falling out, which distressed her a great deal.
About 70% of thyroid deficiencies go undetected among those with no health insurance. I, myself, almost went into a coma from thyroid deficiency because my health insurance did not support blood tests. I had volunteered and gave blood, for an experiment, and, about a week later, was called at 11:00 pm and told to immediately go to the emergency room. My thyroid level was so dangerously low that, in fact, I was quite ill by then and thought I was just fighting the flu. I would have gone into a coma if that call hadn’t roused me to go to the hospital. I experienced much what Marguerite did: weight gain, hair thinning to the point I was wearing a wig, dry skin, exhaustion. I aged a decade in a year. I must take thyroid replacement T4 for the rest of my life.
Seeing how drastically my own looks changed and how my hair thinned, and the great weight gain I experienced, when I saw the photos of Marguerite Oswald being labeled as a ‘different’ woman because she, too, had gained weight, had thinned hair, had coarsened facial features that ruined her good looks, with thickening in the neck area, I recognized that she probably suffered from hypothyroidism, not from “being a secret agent.”
Those who contend that Marguerite was not the same woman as shown in earlier photos may have been photography experts, but they were not trained in Cajun linguistic analysis. They were not trained in the medical sciences. I also have a degree in anthropology and have spent years—some documented as advanced courses—in forensics studies.
I offer this information in the hope that I have shed more light on an explanation for Marguerite Oswald’s radical change in appearance over the years. Other matters can be handled as they arise by inspecting the accuracy and extensiveness of research conducted in this area by Armstrong and others. It is because of my status as witness that I was able to come to some of these conclusions, having been told by Lee Oswald that his mother had aged quickly and had some kind of thyroid problem. I have told researchers about this problem, by the way, ever since 2000.
Judyth Vary Baker
March, 2010
[NOTE: This will be presented in three parts and may require some work for me to get it right.]
WHO WAS MARGUERITE OSWALD? PART III
A study of Marguerite Claverie Oswald as [proposed] surrogate mother of “Harvey” Oswald
Between 1939 and the late 60’s or so, a lot can happen when hypothyroidism is at work. Hypothyroidism often goes undiagnosed. Even today, it is called the most undiagnosed of all chronic debilitating conditions. Note this Google entry (and there are many more):
1. Hypothyroidism— the Most Under-Diagnosed Condition | EmpowHER ...
24 Mar 2009 ... Hypothyroidism— the Most Under-Diagnosed Condition. March 24, 2009 - 2:18pm 833 reads 2 ... CONNECT with Women Interested inHypothyroidism ...
http://www.empowher.com/.../hypothyroidi...-condition - Cached
To review: Fully developed thickened nose. The chin gets thicker with the condition. Facial features coarsen. Hair loss continues. “…the hypothyroid state [includes] fat pads on back, pudgy hands, broad face, fiat nose, large tongue, and pot belly.’
It is possible that Marguerite Oswald had this condition. It would explain what seems to be “two” Marguerite Oswalds.
It is a natural explanation, a reasonable one, and one which must be considered. Often the simplest explanation for why a person seems to be different from what she looked in high school is a medical explanation. My features also changed and coarsened and I gained weight because I, too, suffered from hypothyroidism for years before it was diagnosed.
The only photo where “Marguerite”’s eyebrows do not go upward is in an early photo John Armstrong obtained of Marguerite Oswald showing her ‘tall and slender’ tough she is sorter than those around her in the photo — it is the one shown above after the Ekdahl photo. But one thing at a time.
The matter of height –- a concern voiced by Armstrong who sees a reduced height later -- is not thoroughly addressed. Measurements can be take from photographs. Marguerite is shown in the Ekdahl photo wearing fashionable high heels. Over time, osteoporosis can make a woman lose inches in height. But did Marguerite really shrink to shrimp-size?
Marina Oswald and I are both 5’ 2” tall. In this photo, Marguerite sits higher in the couch than Marina does. Her head is higher, while her legs are extended, showing she is actually seated further forward than Marina, and therefore, is even a bit taller than she seems here. Marguerite is more than 5’ 2” tall. She seems closer to 5’ 5.” Measurements can be taken.
In the next photo, her shoulders are not much lower than Robert Oswald’s (turned). Robert is considerably taller than Marina: hence, Marguerite is not ‘that’ short, after all.
MARGUERITE OSWALD’S SPEECH HABITS
I have taken many linguistics courses, including courses at the doctoral level, at three universities -- most recently, at the University of Louisiana at Lafayette. Besides courses there in sociolinguistics and psycholinguistics, one course was an independent study on Cajun and Louisiana-based linguistic speech habits.
First, we must establish the identity of the woman in the photograph above as native-born in Louisiana with Cajun speech community influences, as her French-style maiden name suggests.
Marguerite Oswald was born Marguerite Claverie. In the interview cited here, a linguist can hear certain word choices and their pronunciations typical of an urban-raised Cajun who had lived a long time in the New Orleans area.
I interviewed over 400 Cajun speaking older people for a research project and have kept some of these tapes. I chose people who were live adults in 1963, partly because I hoped to find witnesses concerning Lee and me. An article I wrote about these interviews was published in the local Lafayette, LA newspaper during the Christmas season of 1998, about Christmas as ‘it used to be” from the 1960’s backward to the early 1920’s. Such a topic gave me the opportunity to hear the names and whereabouts of relatives. In this manner, in fact, I was able to locate one of my witnesses, Anna Lewis.
With this background information, and the information shown just below, we assert the fact that Marguerite Oswald’s voice indicates that she was born and raised in New Orleans, her speech habits influenced by her Cajun-bred family and environment. We must then ask ourselves if this woman was capable of being a substitute mother for “Harvey” as claimed. For now, we will not look at Lee’s/Harvey’s school records — this we leave for another examination to be forthcoming.
MARGUERITE OSWALD’S RECORDED INTERVIEW ~1965:
There are traces of Texas accent in her voice—not surprising, since she also lived for years in Texas. However, the linguistically-trained ear can pick up typical Cajun-influenced pronunciation in Marguerite’s interview, which was conducted after the Warren Commission’s report was issued:
“Didn” intead of “didn’t” (no ‘t’ sound)
“im-ME-jut-lee” instead of “immediately”
Another place says, she does say ‘immediately,’ but it is in a different kind of placement in the sentence, allowing her more time to speak the word properly… Such a mixed linguistic habit is commonly found in urban New Orleans speech patterns in the 1960’s, among Cajuns with some early education in standard English.
“Course” instead of “of course’
“Hah-vey” instead of “Harvey”
“wile” instead of “wild”
“…understand the impact of all of this…” all spoken with a in Cajun-influenced accent
“I din’n give him the emotional support…”
In addition, her sentence structure habit is also Cajun-influenced.
Conclusion: Marguerite Claverie Oswald was born in Louisiana and her early childhood, at least, was spent specifically in the New Orleans area. She has had only a moderate level of education, but the length of her sentences, length of words chosen, and appropriate responses under stress in this interview indicate that she was above average in intelligence.
A note in passing: I have also analyzed Lee Oswald’s voice recordings and assert that Lee Oswald spent his childhood in New Orleans, though he eradicated a great deal of his Texas-influenced accents and had mainstreamed his English speech patterns.
Due to his dyslexia, which made reading more difficult, Oswald had developed a good ear I compensation, allowing him to pass his classes more easily and also to pick up foreign languages with great facility. His facility in Russian came, however, from much practice, as I as a witness can testify. Lee Oswald constantly practiced his Russian with me.
I have brought to the attention for a decade the fact that Lee Oswald used the words “axed” /”Ax” for “ask”/”asked” in his radio ‘debate’ as well as before radio and TV microphones in Dallas just prior to his death by assassination.
In conclusion, the question has been raised: were there two Marguerite Oswalds, one raising “Harvey” and the other raising “Lee”? Photos of a relatively tall and slender Marguerite are matched against later photos showing a shorter, dumpy-looking woman.
I state as a witness that Lee Oswald told me his mother had aged fast --before her time -- and he blamed himself and his brothers as being a great burden to her. As a single mother, she found herself unable to cope with three boys and almost fell apart. Lee said that later, she had started to develop a goiter when they lived in Texas. Only recently, she had started using iodized salt and the goiter was being corrected. I explained to him that people with goiters had a thyroid problem –- and that was probably why she was depressed, moody, had gained so much weight, and why her hair was falling out, which distressed her a great deal.
About 70% of thyroid deficiencies go undetected among those with no health insurance. I, myself, almost went into a coma from thyroid deficiency because my health insurance did not support blood tests. I had volunteered and gave blood, for an experiment, and, about a week later, was called at 11:00 pm and told to immediately go to the emergency room. My thyroid level was so dangerously low that, in fact, I was quite ill by then and thought I was just fighting the flu. I would have gone into a coma if that call hadn’t roused me to go to the hospital. I experienced much what Marguerite did: weight gain, hair thinning to the point I was wearing a wig, dry skin, exhaustion. I aged a decade in a year. I must take thyroid replacement T4 for the rest of my life.
Seeing how drastically my own looks changed and how my hair thinned, and the great weight gain I experienced, when I saw the photos of Marguerite Oswald being labeled as a ‘different’ woman because she, too, had gained weight, had thinned hair, had coarsened facial features that ruined her good looks, with thickening in the neck area, I recognized that she probably suffered from hypothyroidism, not from “being a secret agent.”
Those who contend that Marguerite was not the same woman as shown in earlier photos may have been photography experts, but they were not trained in Cajun linguistic analysis. They were not trained in the medical sciences. I also have a degree in anthropology and have spent years—some documented as advanced courses—in forensics studies.
I offer this information in the hope that I have shed more light on an explanation for Marguerite Oswald’s radical change in appearance over the years. Other matters can be handled as they arise by inspecting the accuracy and extensiveness of research conducted in this area by Armstrong and others. It is because of my status as witness that I was able to come to some of these conclusions, having been told by Lee Oswald that his mother had aged quickly and had some kind of thyroid problem. I have told researchers about this problem, by the way, ever since 2000.
Judyth Vary Baker
March, 2010