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Thread: Israel threatens to destroy Syrian air defenses

  1. #1

    Default Israel threatens to destroy Syrian air defenses

    The IAF attacked SDF forces in the Palmyra area in their defense of ISIS allies March 17th losing one aircraft with one aircraft damaged by the Syrian missiles according to Syrian sources. Israeli sources, while admitting the attack denied losing any aircraft, claimed to shoot down one of Syria's anti-aircraft missiles. Every aspect of this raid and response is a very unusual and an escalation of military tension. Pat Lang opined that Israeli's had tried to cross a red line and were rejected. Message sent; message received.

    Until today. Israel has now threatened Syria with the destruction of there entire air defense if they defend their country again. Pat Lang now admits the Israeli's show no fear of the Russians and are threatening a major escalation of unknown proportions.

    My guess is that the Israeli's know there's a new sheriff in town and his name is Trump. The big gamble is that Russia will back down. Another angle is that Netanyahu met with Putin recently and was no shown the kind of respect he thought he deserved.
    Last edited by Lauren Johnson; 03-20-2017 at 03:56 AM.
    "We'll know our disinformation campaign is complete when everything the American public believes is false." --William J. Casey, D.C.I

    "We will lead every revolution against us." --Theodore Herzl

  2. #2

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lauren Johnson View Post
    The IAF attacked SDF forces in the Palmyra area in their defense of ISIS allies March 17th losing one aircraft with one aircraft damaged by the Syrian missiles according to Syrian sources. Israeli sources, while admitting the attack denied losing any aircraft, claimed to shoot down one of Syria's anti-aircraft missiles. Every aspect of this raid and response is a very unusual and an escalation of military tension. Pat Lang opined that Israeli's had tried to cross a red line and were rejected. Message sent; message received.

    Until today. Israel has now threatened Syria with the destruction of there entire air defense if they defend their country again. Pat Lang now admits the Israeli's show no fear of the Russians and are threatening a major escalation of unknown proportions.

    My guess is that the Israeli's know there's a new sheriff in town and his name is Trump. The big gamble is that Russia will back down. Another angle is that Netanyahu met with Putin recently and was no shown the kind of respect he thought he deserved.
    Yep, I also suspect it was an attempt to test the boundaries of Russia and to see how the US would respond. The studied nonchalance of the DOD spokesman is telling, I think.
    The shadow is a moral problem that challenges the whole ego-personality, for no one can become conscious of the shadow without considerable moral effort. To become conscious of it involves recognizing the dark aspects of the personality as present and real. This act is the essential condition for any kind of self-knowledge.
    Carl Jung - Aion (1951). CW 9, Part II: P.14

  3. #3

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    Commentary by Alexander Mercouris

    The Russians have now formally confirmed earlier media reports that following the Israeli air raid on Syria on Friday the Israeli ambassador in Moscow was called in to the Russian Foreign Ministry to be handed a stern lecture and a stiff protest.Moscow’s confirmation of the Russian protest to Israel, and the fact that the Israeli ambassador was summoned to the Russian Foreign Ministry within hours of the raid taking place, shows how seriously the Russians are treating this incident.

    What is most interesting – and worrying – about this incident is not whether or not an Israeli aircraft was shot down. The Syrians regularly claim to have shot down Israel aircraft, and the Israelis equally regularly deny this was the case. The Syrians have provided no evidence of any Israeli aircraft being shot down, and it is unlikely one was.

    Rather what is worrying about this incident is that the Syrians claim that the air raid targeted Syrian military facilities near Palmyra – deep inside Syria – and that the Syrians were sufficiently concerned about the air strike that they in turn attempted to shoot the Israeli aircraft down whilst they were flying over Israeli territory.

    To understand what happened it is necessary to piece together the facts of the incident to the extent that the limited information available makes that possible.

    The first report of the incident was provided by the official Syrian news agency SANA, whose report reads as follows
    According to a statement by the Command, the four Israeli aircrafts violated the Syrian airspace in al-Breij area through the Lebanese territories at 2:40 am.
    The Israeli warplanes targeted a military site near Palmyra in the eastern countryside of Homs, said the Army’s Command, confirming that the Syria air defense forces confronted the enemy’s aircrafts and shot down one of them inside the occupied territories, hit another and forced the other two to withdraw.

    “This blatant Israeli act of aggression came as part of the Zionist enemy’s persistence with supporting ISIS terrorist gangs and in a desperate attempt to raise their deteriorating morale and divert attention away from the victories which Syrian Arab Army is making in the face of the terrorist organizations,” the statement read.
    From this report it appears that the Israeli aircraft did not penetrate deep into Syrian territory. Rather it seems that the Israeli aircraft slipped across the border, almost immediately launched their missiles against their target, and then turned back home.

    Probably the most accurate account of the Israeli aircraft movements during the raid is provided here
    According the Lebanese Armed Forces (LAF), at 2:34 AM four Israeli jets flying at low altitude entered Lebanese airspace from the Mediterranean over the south Lebanese village of Al-Abbassiyeh. Though the LAF claims the jets turned back to Israel shortly afterwards, it appears they may have actually continued flying towards northeastern Lebanon. From there, according to the Syrian Arab Army (SAA), the jets entered Syria at 2:40 AM over the village of al-Bureij – across the border from northeastern Lebanon – and, using stand-off missiles, targeted a Syrian army position in the direction of Palmyra. Other pro-Assad sources claimed that nearby Beqaa Valley residents heard explosions at a target between the Lebanese border and Damascus. Though the Israeli army acknowledged – for the first time – that it had carried out the strike, it did not reveal any information on its targets.
    The stand-off missiles the Israelis would have used would have been either Popeye missiles or – more probably – longer range Delilah cruise missiles, which undoubtedly do have the range to reach targets near Palmyra from the al-Bureij area.

    The Syrians appear to have retaliated by launching S-200 (“SAM-5”) missiles at the Israeli aircraft after the raid as the aircraft were returning home to their bases.

    The Syrians seem to have waited until the Israeli aircraft had recrossed the Lebanese border back into Israel before launching their missiles. The SANA report clearly says that the air defence missiles were launched at the Israeli aircraft whilst they were over “occupied territory”, which might mean the West Bank or the Golan Heights, but more likely is intended to mean Israel itself (Syria has still not recognised Israel and officially considers the whole of Israel to be occupied Palestinian territory).

    The Israelis claim that one of the Syrian air defence missiles launched at their aircraft was itself shot down by an Israeli Arrow-3 missile.

    There is again no evidence of any Syrian missile being actually shot down, and as several people have pointed out, using an air defence missile designed to protect Israel from missiles launched at ground targets in order to shoot down an air defence missile launched unsuccessfully at an aircraft, on the face of it makes little sense.

    If the Israelis did launch one of their Arrow-3 missiles at a Syrian S-200 missile that was attempting to shoot down one of their aicraft, then that suggests that they misidentified the Syrian missile, which in turn also suggests that they were taken by surprise and did not expect the Syrian response.

    That a missile strike of some sort did take place over Israeli territory is however confirmed by eyewitness reports
    A sonic boom could be heard in parts of Israel and the West Bank, including Jerusalem, sirens sounded in the Jordan Valley.
    Clearly neither the Syrians nor the Israelis are being entirely forthcoming about what happened, but that this was an extremely serious incident is of no doubt.

    The Israelis regularly carry out air strikes in Syria. It is however a long time since they have launched a strike so deep into Syria as Palmyra.

    The Israelis have not admitted that the target of the strike was near Palmyra. However they have not denied it either, and unofficial reports from Israel suggest the target of the strike was in fact Syria’s Tiyas or T4 air base, which is located in the general area of Palmyra.

    The Syrians in turn, though they make regular claim of having shot down Israeli aircraft overflying their territory, have not attempted to shoot down Israeli aircraft flying over Israeli territory for a very long time. That they attempted to do so in this case, essentially ambushing Israeli aircraft as they were returning to their bases after the raid, shows both their anger at the raid and the significant recent increase in their capabilities, with the Syrians now able to track Israeli aircraft inside Israeli controlled territory after they complete their missions.

    The Russians for their part have never been known to call in the Israeli ambassador over an Israeli air raid in Syria at any time since Russia began its intervention in Syria in September 2015. That they have done so in this case shows how seriously they are treating this incident.

    Lastly, the blustering response from the Israelis, with Netanyahu issuing thinly veiled warnings to Moscow and the Israelis bragging about their ability to destroy Syria’s air defences and threatening to do so “without the slightest hesitation”, suggests that they are rattled, and that they have been taken by surprise and are alarmed by the Syrian and Russian response.

    The key to explaining this incident is the probable target of the raid: Syria’s Tiyas or T4 air base.

    Contrary to some claims, the Tiyas air base has never been captured by ISIS or by any other Jihadi group, though ISIS did unsuccessfully attempt to capture it following its temporary capture of Palmyra last December.

    Tiyas is one of Syria’s biggest air bases, and was the base from which the Syrian army launched its counter-offensive which recaptured Palmyra a few weeks ago. Tiyas is now providing critical support to the ongoing Syrian military offensive against ISIS, whose ultimate objective appears to be the relief of the besieged eastern desert city of Deir Ezzor.

    Unofficially, the Israelis always claim that their air strikes in Syria are intended to prevent weapons supplies to Hezbollah. In this case unofficial claims are circulating in Israel that the air strike was intended to stop a handover of Scud missiles at the Tiyas air base by Syria to Hezbollah.

    This is on the face of it extremely unlikely. There are no reports of Hezbollah fighters present in any number near Palmyra or at the Tiyas base, or of them being involved in the ongoing Syrian military offensive against ISIS. It is anyway unlikely that the Syrians would use the Tiyas air base – close to the front line in the fight against ISIS and far away from Hezbollah’s bases in Lebanon – in order to supply Scud missiles to Hezbollah. If the Syrians really were transferring such powerful weapons to Hezbollah, a far more likely place for them to do it would be Damascus.

    A far more natural explanation for the Israeli raid is that it was intended to disrupt the ongoing Syrian army offensive against ISIS, which relies heavily on smooth operation of the Tiyas air base. This after all is what the Syrian military is quoted by SANA (see above) as saying was the reason for the raid
    “This blatant Israeli act of aggression came as part of the Zionist enemy’s persistence with supporting ISIS terrorist gangs and in a desperate attempt to raise their deteriorating morale and divert attention away from the victories which Syrian Arab Army is making in the face of the terrorist organizations.”
    There have been persistent reports throughout the Syrian war that Israel would prefer a Jihadi victory or even an ISIS victory in Syria to the restoration of the Syrian government’s full control over Syria.

    The Syrian government’s major regional allies are Iran and Hezbollah, which Israel has come to see as its major enemies, so the possibility that Israel might wish to see the Syrian government defeated is not in itself unlikely. Possibly rather than an outright Jihadi victory, which might cause Israel serious problems in the future, what some tough minded people in Israel want is an indefinite prolongation of the war, so as to tie down the Syrian military, Hezbollah and Iran, preventing them from challenging Israel.

    If that is indeed the thinking of some people in Tel Aviv, then it would explain the raid on the Tiyas air base. It would however be an astonishingly reckless and cynical thing to do, to support an organisation like ISIS in order to disrupt the alliance between Syria, Iran and Hezbollah.

    Of course there is a widespread view that it was precisely in order to disrupt this alliance between Syria, Iran and Hezbollah that the Syrian war was launched in the first place. Whether or not that is so, and whether or not Israel had any part in that, the Israelis now need to reconsider their stance. On any objective assessment their tactic of providing discrete backing to ISIS and to the other Jihadi groups fighting the Syrian government is achieving the opposite of Israel’s interests.

    Instead of weakening or breaking the alliance between Syria, Iran and Hezbollah, the Syrian war has made it stronger, with Iran and Hezbollah both coming to Syria’s rescue, and Iraq increasingly cooperating with them in doing so. The result is that Iran’s influence in Syria has grown stronger so that there is now even talk of Iran establishing a naval base in Syria, whilst Hezbollah is probably stronger than it has ever been before.

    The Syrian military is also becoming significantly stronger, with the incident of the raid showing that technical help from Russia has now made it possible for the Syrians to track and intercept Israeli aircraft over Israeli territory.

    The Syrian war has also caused Russia to intervene in Syria, making Russia a de facto ally of Syria, Iran and Hezbollah.

    The result is that Russia is now busy establishing a massive air defence and military base complex in Syria, which for the first time has brought a military superpower with far greater technological and military resources than Israel’s own close to Israel’s border.

    The result is that for the first time in its history – apart from the brief period of the so-called War of Attrition (‘Operation Kavkaz’) of 1970 – Israel’s military dominance in the region of the region is being seriously challenged. Already there are reports that the Russian air defence system in Syria is too advanced for the Israelis to defeat, and that the Russians have the ability to track every single Israeli aircraft that takes off in Israel itself.

    Lastly, the Russian protest to Israel on Friday shows that the Russians are prepared to speak up for Syria if it is being attacked or threatened.

    Perpetual military confrontation with its neighbours is not the solution to Israel’s security problems. Nor is the attempt to conjure up a witches’ brew of Jihadi terrorist groups in order to disrupt or destabilise them a good idea, whilst an outright alliance with groups like ISIS – however discretely it is done – is frankly a deeply immoral and appalling idea.

    It is to be sincerely hoped that following the incident on Friday there are some cooler heads in Israel that are able to see this.
    "We'll know our disinformation campaign is complete when everything the American public believes is false." --William J. Casey, D.C.I

    "We will lead every revolution against us." --Theodore Herzl

  4. #4

    Default More Israeli Aggression in Our Future

    Pat Lang with another idea for the Israeli against Syria. Israel might well no longer feel threatened by Hezbollah will act accordingly.

    "David’s Sling, meant to counter medium-range missiles possessed by Iranian-backed Hezbollah militants in Lebanon, will be operational in early April.

    This marks the completion of Israel’s missile defense system, he said.
    That includes the Arrow, designed to intercept ballistic missiles in the stratosphere from long-range threats like Iran and Iron Dome that defends against short-range rockets from Gaza. The official spoke anonymously in line with protocol.
    Israeli deployed its Arrow system Friday when Syria fired missiles at its jets on a mission to destroy a weapons convoy bound for Hezbollah." Washpost
    ----------------
    The deployment of this system will mark a turning point. As I have written on SST many times Israel has been deterred since 2006 from attacks on the Tabouleh Line -2 (Hizbullah missile and rocket systems). This system plus Iron Dome may change that calculus altogether and Israel may become a great deal more aggressive not only in Lebanon but over Syria as well while looking to demonstrate the cost of any resistance to Israeli military power and political hegemony. pl
    "We'll know our disinformation campaign is complete when everything the American public believes is false." --William J. Casey, D.C.I

    "We will lead every revolution against us." --Theodore Herzl

  5. #5

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    I'm expecting it to go hot in Lebanon and/or Gaza any minute now.
    "I think it would be a good idea." Mahatma Gandhi, when asked what he thought of Western civilization.

    The philosophers have only interpreted the world, in various ways; the point is to change it.
    Karl Marx.

    "Well, he would, wouldn't he?" Mandy Rice-Davies, 1963, replied Ms Rice Davies when the prosecuting counsel pointed out that Lord Astor denied an affair or having even met her.

  6. #6

    Default Where does Russia fit in all this?

    Supposedly Russia told Israel the game's over. Russia Insider:

    Someone's lying (or crazy) — and only Putin knows who. We reported yesterday that Syria's U.N. envoy Bashar Jaafari said that Syria's use of anti-aircraft missiles against Israeli fighter jets was a "message" from Putin.

    Israel's ambassador was summoned by Moscow after Friday's airstrikes, and reports have emerged that Russian military advisors were operating just a few kilometers from the area that was targeted by Israeli strikes; so there's certainly circumstantial evidence to back up Jaafari's claim.

    But Israel's Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu insists the exact opposite — that Putin understands that "if there is a feasibility from an intelligence and military standpoint - [Israel will] attack [targets in Syria]".


    According to theJerusalem Post:
    Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu told reporters on Tuesday that Israel was not told by Russia to put a halt to missions inside Syrian territory.

    Netanyahu said that he had made clear to Russian President Vladimir Putin that Israel would continue to fly missions over Syrian airspace.

    "If there is a feasibility from an intelligence and military standpoint - we attack and so it will continue," the premier said during his visit in China.

    On Monday, Syrian President Bashar Assad told Russian parliament members, who paid an official visit to Damascus on Monday, that he was counting on Moscow to prevent Israel from attacking his country in the future.

    “We are counting on Russia to prevent a conflict with Israel,” Assad was quoted as saying by several Russian media outlets.

    Russian news agency Interfax also quoted him as saying that “Damascus counts on Russia to take a role in order to prevent Israel from attacking Syria in the future.”
    Moscow might have a hard time navigating fruitful relations with Israel and Iran/Syria simultaneously. Let's hope for everyone's sake that the airstrikes stop — and no more missiles need to be fired.
    Andrew Korybko on the other hand claims Russia and Israel are far closer. There is no crisis and there will be no war.

    The alternative media community, especially its social media iteration, is experiencing collective psychosis in hallucinating that “Israel” and Russia are on the verge of war with one another.The prevailing narrative is that Israeli “Defense Minister” Lieberman’s threat to destroy Syria’s air defense systems is tantamount to a declaration of war against Russia, with the assumption being that Moscow is on a crusade against Zionism and has thus become Tel Aviv’s worst enemy.

    There’s no diplomatic way to say this, but the presumptions on which such a crazy conclusion has been reached are absolutely and utterly wrong.

    Far from being Israel’s hated nemesis like many in the alternative media community wishfully pretend that it is, Moscow is one of Tel Aviv’s closest allies, and this is entirely due to President Putin’s deliberate policies. Not only does he enjoy a very strong personal friendship with Netanyahu, but President Putin also sees a lot of opportunity to advance his country’s interests in Israel through the large Russian diaspora there.

    Russia wants to compete with the US for influence in Israel for several interrelated reasons.

    Firstly, Judaism is one of Russia’s four official religions as stipulated by the 1993 constitution, thus partially making Russia a “Jewish State” in the technical-legal sense. To be fair, though, Russia is also an Orthodox, Muslim, and Buddhist country too by the same measure.

    Coupled with the Russian diaspora in Israel, Moscow seeks to leverage these religious-personal connections in order to acquire greater clout over the Israeli-Palestinian peace process, which in turn would be expected to boost Russia’s global Great Power prestige (which is exceptionally important to its leadership).

    As a “reward” for its positive involvement in helping to resolve this seemingly intractable issue, Russia might expect Israel to grant its state companies important contracts in building, servicing, and/or investing in any potential Eastern Mediterranean pipeline from the offshore Leviathan gas field to the EU, which would exponentially increase Moscow’s influence on the global energy market and consequently on world affairs in general.

    To be absolutely clear, I respectfully disagree with this approach for principled reasons, though I understand why Russia has embarked on it, and what it hopes to reap from its multifaceted engagement with Israel.

    Returning to the current context and topic of this article, there’s no way whatsoever that Russia would ever even consider lobbying a volley of nuclear missiles at Israel no matter what Netanyahu does in Syria, even if he delivers on his government’s threats to destroy the country’s air defense systems.

    In such a frightful scenario, Russia would assuredly issue a sharp diplomatic rebuke against Israel and probably take symbolic measures to express its disapproval, but it won’t ever preemptively intervene and stop Israeli jets from bombing Syria because its mandate is strictly to fight terrorism, and not defend Syria’s borders from outside state aggression.

    Moreover, it’s an open fact that Russia and Israel have established mechanisms to coordinate their military action in Syria so as to avoid inadvertent clashes, which is hardly the behaviour that anyone would expect from two parties on the brink of an all-out nuclear exchange against each other.

    Let’s face it — Russia and Israel are high-level and comprehensive strategic allies with one another, though this by no means signifies that Moscow is incapable of “balancing” its relations between Tel Aviv and Damascus.

    In fact, it’s this very tricky diplomatic “balancing act” which might actually be somewhat restraining Israel from taking more aggressive action in Syria, as it understands that there’s a certain limit to what it can do and “get away with” before it overly embarrasses Russia and negatively impacts on bilateral relationships.

    Everyone knows that Russia has deployed S-400 air defense missiles in Syria, and this fact was reported on with much fanfare and enthusiasm in the alternative media community, both through its professional outlets and on social media. Many people naively assumed that this would put a stop to Israel’s occasional strikes in Syria, yet several high-profile ones have occurred in the time since, in spite of the presence of the S-400s.

    This can only be interpreted as proof that Russia has no desire to overstep its anti-terrorism mandate and defend Syria’s external borders, nor would it even want that heavy responsibility if Damascus offered it.

    In addition, the fact that these strikes happened without any noticeable interference from the Russian side can be taken as visible confirmation that the mechanisms earlier described between Moscow and Tel Aviv are working properly in avoiding any inadvertent clashes between the two sides.

    This does not mean, however, that Russia condones Israel’s illegal military activity in Syria (especially its latest bombing), but just that it passively stands by and chooses time and again to avoid becoming involved in what Moscow sees as a strictly bilateral issue between Tel Aviv and Damascus.

    Nevertheless, a blatant act of state-on-state aggression such as attempting to obliterate Syria’s nationwide anti-air defense systems wouldn’t be tolerated by Russia, and would probably compel President Putin to freeze relations with “Israel” due to the unacceptable diplomatic embarrassment that Netanyahu would have inflicted on Moscow.

    Netanyahu, for his part, is keenly aware of the limits of what he can and cannot do in Syria without risking Russia’s genuine ire, so it is extremely unlikely that he will carry through on his Defense Minister’s threat. That being said, however, Israel — being the quintessential rogue state that it is — might backstab Russia by doing this anyhow so long as its leadership believes that the “cost-benefit” calculation “justifies” such action.

    The only realistic scenario for that to happen would be if Israel was convinced — whether “rightly” or wrongly — that Iranian and Hezbollah activity in Syria posed an “imminent threat” to its interests that would surpass any perceived indirect negotiating/”balancing” benefits vis-a-vis these parties that Tel Aviv’s alliance with Moscow provides.

    It’s been speculated that Russia is very understanding of Israel’s concerns about Iran and Hezbollah in Syria, and that Moscow might even be discretely pressing for Damascus to draw up a “face-saving” plan for ensuring these forces’ post-war withdrawal from the country, so if that’s the case, then Israel has no reason to further escalate its aggression against Syria under the false pretexts of combating these two Resistance actors.

    The fact that Tel Aviv issued its latest threats, however, indicate that this speculation might not be entirely true, since it would logically follow that any successful Russian efforts on this front would negate whatever “reason” Israel might have for jeopardizing its mutually advantageous alliance with Moscow.

    Another possible explanation might be that Syria doesn’t agree with Russia’s rumored suggestions in this respect and therefore isn’t going along with them, which from Tel Aviv’s perspective might cause it to recalculate that its alliance with Moscow is disposable because it has failed to bear fruit on one of its most important fronts.

    Much more likely, however, is that there isn’t any secret Russian-Israeli understanding to conspire against Iran and Hezbollah’s post-war presence in Syria, and that Israel’s latest threat was issued independently of its relationship with Russia, though of course only time will tell what the truth really is.

    To get back to the topical issue at hand, any large-scale state-to-state attack that Israel might launch against Syria probably wouldn’t be stopped by Russia, but it would definitely ruin the relationship between Moscow and Tel Aviv. Russia isn’t going to go to war against Israel for the sake of saving Syria and formally going beyond its specific mandate, no matter how much millions of people might wish that it would under those circumstances.

    Even so, Russia is a proud and dignified civilization-state which won’t accept the global humiliation that would ensue from passively allowing such a massive aggression to occur under its watch, despite it legally not being Russia’s responsibility to protect Syria’s external borders or to prevent state aggression against its military, which is why it would be forced to freeze all ties with Israel in response.

    In that scenario, Russia’s “balancing” policy would come to an abrupt end and Moscow might reactively realign its regional priorities with the Resistance Bloc of Iran and Hezbollah instead of remaining “impartial” like it currently is, though still taking care not to do anything which could be perceived as stoking Israel’s paranoia that Russia might also be in the process of becoming a “threat” to it too.

    To wrap everything up, no realistic case can be argued that Russia is on the verge of war with Israel. Historical facts such as the unprecedented Russian-Israeli Strategic Partnership, the public existence of bilateral military coordination mechanisms in Syria, and the sincere personal friendship between President Putin and Netanyahu, categorically disprove any such claims.

    While it might be “fashionable” to pretend that Russia is opposed to Israel, that’s simply not true at all, no matter how much people in the alternative media community might deeply wish for it to be so. Even in the disastrous event that Israel decides to launch an all-out conventional attack against Syria and escalate its presently ongoing Yinon Plan of divide-and-rule “Arab Spring” Hybrid War into something much larger, there’s no way that Russia would intervene, although it would clearly be displeased and would have to take appropriate diplomatic countermeasures in order to save its prestige.

    The bottom line is that supporters of the Syrian Arab Republic mustn’t let their optimistic well wishing desires cloud their analytical judgement and objective appraisal of reality, because failure to do so will only result in the creation of an alternative universe totally divorced from the world in which we truly live.

    And that, folks, leads to legitimately “fake news” such as the hysterical claims that Russia is about to go to war with Israel.
    "We'll know our disinformation campaign is complete when everything the American public believes is false." --William J. Casey, D.C.I

    "We will lead every revolution against us." --Theodore Herzl

  7. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by David Guyatt View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lauren Johnson View Post
    The IAF attacked SDF forces in the Palmyra area in their defense of ISIS allies March 17th losing one aircraft with one aircraft damaged by the Syrian missiles according to Syrian sources. Israeli sources, while admitting the attack denied losing any aircraft, claimed to shoot down one of Syria's anti-aircraft missiles. Every aspect of this raid and response is a very unusual and an escalation of military tension. Pat Lang opined that Israeli's had tried to cross a red line and were rejected. Message sent; message received.

    Until today. Israel has now threatened Syria with the destruction of there entire air defense if they defend their country again. Pat Lang now admits the Israeli's show no fear of the Russians and are threatening a major escalation of unknown proportions.

    My guess is that the Israeli's know there's a new sheriff in town and his name is Trump. The big gamble is that Russia will back down. Another angle is that Netanyahu met with Putin recently and was no shown the kind of respect he thought he deserved.
    Yep, I also suspect it was an attempt to test the boundaries of Russia and to see how the US would respond. The studied nonchalance of the DOD spokesman is telling, I think.
    Israel getting involved will tend to unite Syrians behind the government. Surprised they are.
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  8. #8

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    Israel getting involved will tend to unite Syrians behind the government. Surprised they are.
    Assad already has the strong support of his population because the alternative is far worse. The so-called "civil war" is in fact an invasion originated and paid for by NATO countries, Saudi Arabia, and Israel. There is no civil war.
    "We'll know our disinformation campaign is complete when everything the American public believes is false." --William J. Casey, D.C.I

    "We will lead every revolution against us." --Theodore Herzl

  9. #9

    Default Ha'Aretz: Russia destroyed Syrian Democracy

    The supposedly liberal Ha'Aretz goes nuts:

    Haaretz just published the magnum opus of Israeli mourning for what "could have been" in Syria. We are of course referring to "They Broke It, They Should Fix It: Let Russia and Iran Pay to Rebuild Syria". If you enjoy the headline, you'll love the self-righteous delusions which follow it.
    According to Haaretz: Israel yearned for democracy in Syria; Israel wanted desperately to help fight Islamic State in Syria; Israel wanted to provide humanitarian aid to Syrian refugees.
    But Haaretz very helpfully clarifies: Syrian democracy was destroyed by Russia and Iran's support for Assad and an "opposition dominated by Islamist militants"; Defeating Islamic State is a "no-brainer", but it "would involve partnering with Iran"; and while Israel would love to provide aid to suffering Syrians, "realistically there’s no policy that will yield the kind of results that would truly benefit the Syrian people."


    Israel absolves itself of any wrongdoing or even sideline support for the "moderate" rebels. (Israel was "cheer[ing] on the white hats in Syria’s six-year civil war"; Israel had "hopes" for the Arab Spring, says Haaretz.)Israel was just trying to be a good neighbor. The real culprits of this conflict are Russia and Iran, the two countries that "broke" Syria:
    The bill for reconstruction is estimated at $200 billion, and some say it could even reach five times that figure. Never exactly an economic tiger, Syrian GDP would have to grow at a 5% annual rate for the next 30 years to get back to where it was in 2010. Who’s going to pay the bill?
    Naturally, it should be the Russians and Iranians. Assad is their man and Syria their ally.
    Needless to say, Moscow and Tehran don’t see it that way. Yes, they broke it, so they should pay for it, but as they see it, the U.S., Europe, Turkey and the Gulf powers helped break Syria, too.
    Last month Mikhail Bogdanov, Russia’s deputy foreign minister for Middle East issues, told European Union diplomats that Moscow would contribute nothing to a reconstruction effort he estimated would cost tens of billions of dollars.
    That is chutzpah of the first order, but to be fair, the Russians don’t have the kind of money, and neither do the Iranians. If the money is going to be delivered, it will be from the West.
    Sassy.



    You want to see some chutzpah? Behold:
    [L]et’s put humanitarian considerations aside. That doesn’t sound nice, but realistically there’s no policy that will yield the kind of results that would truly benefit the Syrian people. That’s because the Assad regime is not just an oppressive dictatorship, it’s also an economic incompetent, wedded to doctrine of state control mixed in with a strong element of cronyism.
    Helping the Syrian people is a waste of time and money because Assad will spend all foreign aid on booze and hookers, or maybe that " World of Tanks" computer game.
    We understand. We get it. Israel sees Iran as even more evil and terrible than Islamic State. Ergo, Islamic State losing in Syria is bad for Israel.
    That's not a neutral position though, and it's certainly not representative of anything approaching altruism or thoughtful support for the Syrian people.


    Our advice to Israel: You are welcome to have your own national "interests", as insane and inhumane as they may be. But please stop pretending that Netanyahu is crying himself to sleep each night as he worries about Syrian democracy. The Islamist head-choppers lost. Get over it.
    "We'll know our disinformation campaign is complete when everything the American public believes is false." --William J. Casey, D.C.I

    "We will lead every revolution against us." --Theodore Herzl

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