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+--- Thread: On the Staying Power of Disinformation: White Windbreaker Man ID'd? (/thread-411.html)
On the Staying Power of Disinformation: White Windbreaker Man ID'd? - Myra Bronstein - 17-03-2009
James Richards Wrote:Myra,
Yes, I think it was Felipe Vidal Santiago. I also submit that Vidal was the one who instigated the plot that was to ultimately become the operation in Dallas. ...
Thanks again James.
Would you care to expand on your thoughts that Vidal instigated the plot?
Also, to put it in context, where do you believe the CIA and Vidal were in the assassination org chart?
For example, I think the Business Financers and Military/Pentagon types were higher up the planning ladder, leaving the CIA (and their Cuban/Mob/misc hit men) to do the wet work. They were doing the wet work with extreme prejudice but I believe they were tacticians, not deciders or funders.
Your thoughts?
James Richards Wrote:...
In addition, I think that when one is researching DCM, one must factor in his visibility, he proximity to the actual shooting and if he is directing a coordinated crossfire (which I believe he is doing with a series of hand signals) then he would be one very cool customer, one of proven courage in battle and someone the other participants would respect.
...
With Umbrella Man (Roy Hargraves, I believe we're in agreement about him) relaying Vidal's signals with the umbrella?
James Richards Wrote:...
In 1963, where the world of anti-Castro politics was fractured and embittered, there was only 2 men who had all the boxes ticked. Vidal was one of them.
...
And who was the second man?
James Richards Wrote:...BTW, this image below has never before been published. It is Vidal as a very young Naval officer.
James
Great find.
God he looks nothing like his older self.
On the Staying Power of Disinformation: White Windbreaker Man ID'd? - James Richards - 17-03-2009
Myra,
To be brief, I believe Vidal got wind of the olive branch the Kennedy administration was offering to Castro via Lisa Howard.
Vidal wasn't happy and began plans to hit JFK in Miami. He took this to his contact Col. Bishop aka Clarence Ward Bishop aka John Adrian O'Hare.
O'Hare was an asset of David Morales and I submit, this was the Agency's first contact with the basic assassination plot. Hence the plan expanded to involve a patsy, to blame Castro and a dangling carrot to the various participants that they would get their Cuba back.
This is what kept Vidal interested and when it did not come to be, he was not happy and spoke out about it. Certain events were then put into action that ultimately led to his capture and execution inside Cuba.
Vidal did not like or trust the CIA and they as an organization did not like him. I also do not think the CIA as an organization were behind the assassination although several folk who were employed by them were.
Re the second man I mentioned, this was Tony Cuesta who I also think was mixed up in the events of Dallas. Nagell for one was keen to get Dick Russell to look in that direction.
I also believe that the assassination conspiracy and the subsequent cover-up were two different things.
Cheers,
James
On the Staying Power of Disinformation: White Windbreaker Man ID'd? - Jack White - 17-03-2009
I seldom disagree with James, but on Vidal, I disagree 100%.
The man photographed is clearly a Negro.
Jack
On the Staying Power of Disinformation: White Windbreaker Man ID'd? - Peter Lemkin - 17-03-2009
And I don't often disagree with you jack. James, correct me if wrong, but Vidal was a very tall, thin [as is DSM] and quite dark-skinned Cuban, I think they match well. Other factors than just the photo match leads me to believe it was Vidal.
On the Staying Power of Disinformation: White Windbreaker Man ID'd? - James Richards - 17-03-2009
Peter,
Yes, Vidal was tallish and of slender build. As for his complexion, his skin went very dark after spending time in the sun.
James
On the Staying Power of Disinformation: White Windbreaker Man ID'd? - Myra Bronstein - 18-03-2009
This is fascinating James. Thanks.
James Richards Wrote:...Hence the plan expanded to involve a patsy, to blame Castro and a dangling carrot to the various participants that they would get their Cuba back.
...
Do you think that getting Cuba back was part of the original plan? Or was the promise of retaking Cuba a ruse to get the Cubans to participate, but not part of the actual plan?
On the Staying Power of Disinformation: White Windbreaker Man ID'd? - James Richards - 18-03-2009
Myra,
I think the primary aim was to kill JFK, to do it violently and in public. This was a message.
Believe it or not, to get participants for this type of action is not an easy thing to do. To blindly say that professional killers just work for money is not always true, especially given the profile of the target and the way in which it is to be carried out.
To have a group of people politically motivated and who would seemingly benefit from the killing is ideal.
Like most murders, this was personal and born out of hatred and revenge.
James
On the Staying Power of Disinformation: White Windbreaker Man ID'd? - Myra Bronstein - 18-03-2009
James Richards Wrote:Myra,
To be brief, I believe Vidal got wind of the olive branch the Kennedy administration was offering to Castro via Lisa Howard.
Vidal wasn't happy and began plans to hit JFK in Miami. ...
James,
Prior to the Miami attempt there was, as I'm sure you know, supposedly a Chicago attempt--complete with patsy--that failed. How would that fit in with Vidal's plans? Do you think there really was a serious attempt to kill President Kennedy in Chicago?
Also, do you know if there was a patsy lined up for the Miami attempt? I know that Oswald made job contacts in DC, presumably for an attempt there before Dallas was finalized. So he was a portable patsy. But I've never seen any evidence that he was being prepared for a move to Miami.
Thanks.
On the Staying Power of Disinformation: White Windbreaker Man ID'd? - Myra Bronstein - 18-03-2009
James Richards Wrote:Myra,
I think the primary aim was to kill JFK, to do it violently and in public. This was a message.
Believe it or not, to get participants for this type of action is not an easy thing to do. To blindly say that professional killers just work for money is not always true, especially given the profile of the target and the way in which it is to be carried out.
To have a group of people politically motivated and who would seemingly benefit from the killing is ideal.
Like most murders, this was personal and born out of hatred and revenge.
James
James,
Do you think that President Kennedy's decision to pull out of Vietnam was a factor in his murder?
On the Staying Power of Disinformation: White Windbreaker Man ID'd? - James Richards - 18-03-2009
Myra,
I hope not to confuse you here. Vidal's original plan was to be for Miami in the summer of 1963. That plan was subsequently usurped and expanded.
Vidal was in the loop here as the dangle was that an invasion of Cuba would be the result. This is why he stayed with the program.
The later Chicago and Miami failures was indeed from the playbook of the same conspirators that succeeded in Dallas.
I do not have any information regarding patsies for those cities. That would depend on what kind of assassination was intended.
Dallas was one game plan but it is impossible to say what was intended for those other cities.
Having said that, Vaughn Marlowe in California may provide an insight as to where the thinking was at the time.
As for JFK pulling out of Vietnam, I'm sure that made several folk unhappy but I'm not convinced they were involved in what happened in Dallas.
After JFK's death, there was a lot of political manoeuvering and I submit that we should not confuse that with reasons why he was killed in the first place.
Remember, JFK had a serious medical condition, he was indiscriminate with his affairs and there was plenty of career ending dirt his enemies could have used to discredit him out of office.
I get back to why JFK was killed the way he was in an open car travelling through a modern American city? If we ponder that mind-set then we may get a little closer to those who planned it.
Like I said, this was personal. In my opinion of course.
James