What was LHO doing in the lunch room?

[Paul Harris]

What was LHO doing in the lunch room as the crowds were building outside the TSB just minutes before the motorcade arrived?

If you believe LHO was the lone assassin of President Kennedy, why would he have been wasting time in the lunch room after having gone through the trouble to construct a brown paper bag, bring his rifle to work, hide the rifle when he got to work and then construct a sniper's lair? Not knowing the exact time the motorcade would drive by the TSB, why would he have risked the chance of missing the motorcade by being in the lunch room as large crowds were building outside just minutes before the motorcade arrival?

Or, if you believe LHO was part of a conspiracy and set up as the patsy, why would the other conspiracy participants/shooters have alllowed him to be in the lunch room to establsh an alibi just minutes before the motorcade arrival? It would seem logical that the once the participants/shooters entered the TSB, it was imperative that LHO be with the participants/shooters and not visible to other TSB workers to prevent an alibi.

My own belief is that LHO was stationed by that phone and allowed the participants/shooters into the TSB back door, lead them up to the top floor and would have expalined to any TSB workers that they men were SS agents and he was letting them inspect/secure the building. Since LHO was seen in the lunch room at about the same time witnesses saw two men on the sixth floor, I think he was serving as a lookout for any police that may have been alerted and entered the building. I think LHO perhaps received a call just a couple of minutes before the motorcade arrived instructing him to head up to the top floors either by the stairs or elevator.

[Greg Burnham]

What was LHO doing in the lunch room as the crowds were building outside the TSB just minutes before the motorcade arrived?

If you believe LHO was the lone assassin of President Kennedy, why would he have been wasting time in the lunch room after having gone through the trouble to construct a brown paper bag, bring his rifle to work, hide the rifle when he got to work and then construct a sniper's lair? Not knowing the exact time the motorcade would drive by the TSB, why would he have risked the chance of missing the motorcade by being in the lunch room as large crowds were building outside just minutes before the motorcade arrival?

Or, if you believe LHO was part of a conspiracy and set up as the patsy, why would the other conspiracy participants/shooters have alllowed him to be in the lunch room to establsh an alibi just minutes before the motorcade arrival? It would seem logical that the once the participants/shooters entered the TSB, it was imperative that LHO be with the participants/shooters and not visible to other TSB workers to prevent an alibi.

My own belief is that LHO was stationed by that phone and allowed the participants/shooters into the TSB back door, lead them up to the top floor and would have expalined to any TSB workers that they men were SS agents and he was letting them inspect/secure the building. Since LHO was seen in the lunch room at about the same time witnesses saw two men on the sixth floor, I think he was serving as a lookout for any police that may have been alerted and entered the building. I think LHO perhaps received a call just a couple of minutes before the motorcade arrived instructing him to head up to the top floors either by the stairs or elevator.

There is every reason to believe that LHO was NOT a part of the plot to assassinate JFK. Your scenario literally FORCES him into inculpatory activities (by your novel interpretation of otherwise innocuous behavior) of which there is no supporting evidence.

Are you considering writing a work of fiction and just trying it out on us here?

[Phil Dragoo]

Oswald was in the lunch room to eat lunch.

He ate lunch.

He got change.

He bought a Coke.

He was accosted by Truly and Baker.

Gil Jesus shows Oswald's movements:

http://www.giljesus.com/jfk/lunchroom_encounter.htm


David Ratcliffe amplifies:

http://www.ratical.org/ratville/JFK/PG/PGchp8.html


In no account is the slightest inkling Oswald did anything in the lunchroom besides eat lunch.

No one saw him on a tour
No one saw him on the stair
No one saw him guard a door
No one saw him on the phone
When they saw him he was alone

At the station he made the startling revelation
I'm just a patsy

And that was the title of the work in progress by George DeMohrenschildt
He who had pled with George Bush of the Central Intelligence Agency
To call off the vigilantes

While a publisher might merely require a proposal
Making of Oswald more than a patsy requires proof

Bartender, a Drago martini, shaken, not stirred:

[ATTACH=CONFIG]3611[/ATTACH]

[Charles Drago]

What was LHO doing in the lunch room as the crowds were building outside the TSB just minutes before the motorcade arrived?

If you believe LHO was the lone assassin of President Kennedy, why would he have been wasting time in the lunch room after having gone through the trouble to construct a brown paper bag, bring his rifle to work, hide the rifle when he got to work and then construct a sniper's lair? Not knowing the exact time the motorcade would drive by the TSB, why would he have risked the chance of missing the motorcade by being in the lunch room as large crowds were building outside just minutes before the motorcade arrival?

Or, if you believe LHO was part of a conspiracy and set up as the patsy, why would the other conspiracy participants/shooters have alllowed him to be in the lunch room to establsh an alibi just minutes before the motorcade arrival? It would seem logical that the once the participants/shooters entered the TSB, it was imperative that LHO be with the participants/shooters and not visible to other TSB workers to prevent an alibi.

My own belief is that LHO was stationed by that phone and allowed the participants/shooters into the TSB back door, lead them up to the top floor and would have expalined to any TSB workers that they men were SS agents and he was letting them inspect/secure the building. Since LHO was seen in the lunch room at about the same time witnesses saw two men on the sixth floor, I think he was serving as a lookout for any police that may have been alerted and entered the building. I think LHO perhaps received a call just a couple of minutes before the motorcade arrived instructing him to head up to the top floors either by the stairs or elevator.

There is every reason to believe that LHO was NOT a part of the plot to assassinate JFK. Your scenario literally FORCES him into inculpatory activities (by your novel interpretation of otherwise innocuous behavior) of which there is no supporting evidence.

Are you considering writing a work of fiction and just trying it out on us here?

Or perhaps a work of friction?

[Albert Doyle]

My own belief is that LHO was stationed by that phone and allowed the participants/shooters into the TSB back door, lead them up to the top floor and would have expalined to any TSB workers that they men were SS agents and he was letting them inspect/secure the building. Since LHO was seen in the lunch room at about the same time witnesses saw two men on the sixth floor, I think he was serving as a lookout for any police that may have been alerted and entered the building. I think LHO perhaps received a call just a couple of minutes before the motorcade arrived instructing him to head up to the top floors either by the stairs or elevator.

The shooters were already seen on the top floor by several witnesses on Houston street. If you coordinated your theory to known conspiracy evidence you would understand that any last second admission of snipers by Oswald would violate the same last-second argument made against Oswald. That is, if Oswald had brought the rifle to work that day with the intention of shooting the president then why would he be in the lunchroom at 12:25 as Carolyn Arnold witnessed? Since the motorcade was a few minutes late, why would any CIA sniper team time it to the last second like that? You might argue that they were waiting for the Depository employees to go out front and be distracted. But if this was true then they most likely would have been seen by the employees on the upper floors when they entered.

Your theory fails when you realize several witnesses looked-up and saw people with rifles in the windows who weren't Oswald well before the assassination. Oswald didn't need to let any snipers in, they were already there. Also Victoria Adams verified that Oswald was not on the steps at the critical time necessary for him to have rushed back down in the infamous 90 seconds it would have required. No matter how much you try to put Oswald upstairs, Victoria Adams, the automatic door, and Oswald's calmness and not being out of breath prevents any notion of this fantastic and untrue Warren Commission version.

I have no doubt Oswald was assigned to be in the lunchroom exactly because they needed to keep him away from the active floors to prevent him from interfering with Kennedy's assassination. If you read DiEugenio's accounts of Carolyn Arnold's witnessing of Oswald in the lunchroom she very clearly said she witnessed him there at 12:25. She never said 12:15. She said she was shocked to read her account on the record later on only to find FBI had altered her statement and changed the time to 12:15. The notion that Oswald sprinted upstairs at 12:25:30, and then pulled-off some miraculous quick-shot shooting, and then dashed back downstairs in 90 seconds while appearing completely calm and casual and not out of breath to an officer pointing a gun at him should be obvious for what it is. The obvious answer here is Oswald was in the lunchroom the whole time and never left it - as he was assigned. Oswald's behavior at the police station of keeping strict cover should clue people that he was obediently following orders.


You don't realize your arguments work against you by your own logic. If Oswald risked being seen in the lunchroom, and would therefore have to explain why he wasn't watching the motorcade, then your theory of him risking being seen going up the stairs with a sniper team just prior to the shooting also incurs the same risk. It's not how they would have done it. The way they did it is the way they would have done it.


Oh yeah, there was no chance for any police entering the building because they had been given strict stand-down orders as many officers testified.

[Edwin Ortiz]

I guess you are saying LHO just didnt care about seeing JFK going down his block he would rather eat his lunch though he loved handing out political pamphlets and doing radio interviews ...he was eager to get home and grab a pistol...what was he so scared of.... i mean he did end up at the theatre with a pistol,,he was awfully anxious to watch a movie and wanted to see it free ...all can agree he did end up with a pistol ...is it all coincidence or conspiracy ..sounds like a b fensterwald book.......are you definitely sure he wasnt part of the plot or did he just know about it .

What was LHO doing in the lunch room as the crowds were building outside the TSB just minutes before the motorcade arrived?

If you believe LHO was the lone assassin of President Kennedy, why would he have been wasting time in the lunch room after having gone through the trouble to construct a brown paper bag, bring his rifle to work, hide the rifle when he got to work and then construct a sniper's lair? Not knowing the exact time the motorcade would drive by the TSB, why would he have risked the chance of missing the motorcade by being in the lunch room as large crowds were building outside just minutes before the motorcade arrival?

Or, if you believe LHO was part of a conspiracy and set up as the patsy, why would the other conspiracy participants/shooters have alllowed him to be in the lunch room to establsh an alibi just minutes before the motorcade arrival? It would seem logical that the once the participants/shooters entered the TSB, it was imperative that LHO be with the participants/shooters and not visible to other TSB workers to prevent an alibi.

My own belief is that LHO was stationed by that phone and allowed the participants/shooters into the TSB back door, lead them up to the top floor and would have expalined to any TSB workers that they men were SS agents and he was letting them inspect/secure the building. Since LHO was seen in the lunch room at about the same time witnesses saw two men on the sixth floor, I think he was serving as a lookout for any police that may have been alerted and entered the building. I think LHO perhaps received a call just a couple of minutes before the motorcade arrived instructing him to head up to the top floors either by the stairs or elevator.

There is every reason to believe that LHO was NOT a part of the plot to assassinate JFK. Your scenario literally FORCES him into inculpatory activities (by your novel interpretation of otherwise innocuous behavior) of which there is no supporting evidence.

Are you considering writing a work of fiction and just trying it out on us here?

[Charles Drago]

OK, it's a 101 course right here.

But is it History 101 or Stand-Up Comedy 101?

Or are we really talking about Stand-Up Tragedy?

Or Disinformation 401?

Writing only for myself, I have zero patience for neophytes and the half-witty. Especially when agents provocateur frequently introduce themselves by playing just those roles.

As I've said to so many self-focused, would-be jazz players who come unprepared to jam sessions: Practice at home, not on the bandstand.

When you can play "Cherokee" up and in at least four keys, come play here.

Until then, woodshed elsewhere.

Clear?

[Seamus Coogan]

OK, it's a 101 course right here.

But is it History 101 or Stand-Up Comedy 101?

Or are we really talking about Stand-Up Tragedy?

Or Disinformation 401?

Writing only for myself, I have zero patience for neophytes and the half-witty. Especially when agents provocateur frequently introduce themselves by playing just those roles.

As I've said to so many self-focused, would-be jazz players who come unprepared to jam sessions: Practice at home, not on the bandstand.

When you can play "Cherokee" up and in at least four keys, come play here.

Until then, woodshed elsewhere.

Clear?

Well said CD and very true!

[Albert Doyle]

As naive as it might be, this original post led me to consider that Oswald went into the lunchroom exactly because it was empty. The others were out watching the motorcade. It could be Oswald entered the lunchroom exactly because no one was in it. (In other words, it was a place where he was unlikely to be seen)

[Peter Lemkin]

We do seem to be getting a rash of naive or playing naive types, lately. Several trying to draw out the opinions of older member and then putting up a completely impossible theory implicating LHO as being with the assassins. My hunch is these are not independent actions, but coordinated....just my gut feeling. Sunstein stuff. McAdams stuff. Pozner stuff. Russo stuff. Big Lie stuff.

Oswald was operational that day. Likely told to keep his eye out on possible attempts on JFK as he likely did [or was made to look like he did] in Chicago. He was NOT on the 6th floor and never had a rifle that day, nor was he ever a part of the assassination! Period! It is unclear exactly when or what triggered in him that he was being set up. I'd imagine as soon as the shots were fired he'd know something was very wrong. As he was seen to be calm in the lunchroom he was either not yet aware he was being set-up or a very cool operative. By soon after he had left the TSBD he was aware, IMO, that he had been set-up...or that idea was growing in his head. He did not kill Tippit, but did go to the Texas theater [apparently so did another person using his identity], likely to meet a contact for exfiltration from Dallas, protection or further instructions. He was moving around from seat to seat, as his contact wasn't there. When he saw the police enter he knew the fix was in, and he did his best until he was silenced - silenced because he could speak to being innocent and having been an agent long in the employ of Naval Intel, CIA, FBI and maybe one other agency....and set-up as the patsy. Revisionist versions of Oswald did it won't fly - especially here.