23-03-2010, 08:57 PM
JUDYTH RESPONDS TO JACK WHITE:
I have a post from dated July 4, 2004, where Rich DellaRosa states that I resigned from his forum...DellaRosa also said that he not only erased the posts and files, but would do it again in a heartbeat, because I was telling 'fairytales' and had nothing to important to say. He also added some insults. I did not exhibit any 'abusive behavior' on the forum. his has been repeated several times by Jack and I wish to disabuse the reader who might start reading at this point in the thread.
==RESPONSE TO THE REST OF J W'S POST==MY COMMENTS IN CAPS==
Her story at that time...and my memory from that far back may be faulty, and Rich is no longer available to confirm, here is how I remember it, and arguments about it led to JVB eventually being banished from the forum for abusive behavior:
QUOTES FROM RICH DELLAROSA, JULY 4, 2004:
....you ersased (sic) everything.
You resigned...
"Your posts were deleted AFTER you resigned."
[I DISAGREE: THEY WERE ERASED BEFORE I RESIGNED]
JVB's story then (as I recall) was that LHO and JVB conversed EVERY night by phone.
==ON TMWKK THE LOVE AFFAIR AND EVER SINCE 1999 WHEN I FIRST SPOKE OUT, I MENTIONED 14-15 PHONE CALLS BETWEEN OCTOBER 6 AND EARLY AM NOV. 21.==
He would go across Beckley Street from his rooming house to a 24-hour laundromat and call her on a pay phone there, and they would talk for hours. This was countered on several counts, as I recall.
==IT HAS NEVER BEEN COUNTERED. A JANITOR IS IN THE MARY FERRELL CHRONOLOGY REPORTING SEEING LEE OSWALD THERE THE LAST NIGHT HE CALLED ME. I DID NOT SAY THAT LEE USED THE LAUNDROMAT EVERY TIME FOR A CALL. I DESCRIBED BEING ABLE TO HEAR CARS PASSING BY ON SEVERAL OCCASIONS...NOR DID I CLAIM A PAYPHONE EXISTED INSIDE THE LAUNDROMAT. I HAVE SOME INFORMATION ABOUT HIS, THOUGH, THAT THE RESEARCH COMMUNITY SHOULD KNOW ABOUT. IT CASTS ASPERSIONS ON THE ROLE AND CONDUCT OF RUTH PAINE ON THE EVENING OF NOV. 21==
Some researcher found no such nearby laundromat existed.
==INACCURATE. THE JANITOR'S LAUNDROMAT REPORT WAS FROM THE FBI.==
At that time, pay phone calls were timed by the minute, and were very expensive, especially long distance, and JVB had LHO spending huge sums on pay phone calls.
==FALSE. JACK WHITE HAS OBVIOUSLY NEVER SEEN THE LOVE AFFAIR DOCUMENTARY, WHERE I EXPLAIN WE TAPPED INTO A MAFIA RACING LINE AND ALL CALLS WERE FREE. I EXPLAINED HE SET-UP TO "60 MINUTES" IN SOME DETAIL. A GOOD RESEARCHER SHOULD A LEAST LOOK AT THE DOCUMENTARY, WHICH IN ITSELF IS JUST A DISTILLATION.... WITNESSES ARE NOT IN IT DUE TO THEIR FEAR. WE HAVE DOCUMENTED PRESSURE USED AGAINST ANNA LEWIS, FOR EXAMPLE.==
Then she told of a very long call the night of November 21,
==FALSE. NEVER SAID THAT. IT WAS LATE ON THE NIGHT OF WEDNESDAY, NOV. 20, EXTENDING INTO EARLY AM NOV. 21. ==
lasting past midnight. This was countered with the fact that LHO was in Irving and not at the rooming house, and his pre-assassination night was well documented. When reminded that LHO could not call from the all-night laundromat, JVB was adamant that the long midnight call was made,
[NOT TRUE!]
and that he found another pay phone in Irving.
[NOT TRUE!]
==UTTER FABRICATION THAT DOES NOT MATCH ANYTHING EVER WRITTEN OR SPOKEN BY ME.....FALSE STATEMENTS ARE BEING ATTRIBUTED TO ME==
For this to have happened, LHO would have had to get out of bed without waking Marina, leave the Paine house secretly, walk to find a pay phone in the residential neighborhood, talk a long time, return to the Paine house, and sneak back into bed without awakening Marina or children. This is how I remember the forum exchanges from years ago.
==YOU HAVE THE DATE WRONG, JACK. I HAVE ALWAYS STATED THE CALL WAS THE NIGHT OF NOV. 20 TO EARLY AM NOV. 21. I HAVE TO RESPOND BECAUSE PEOPLE WILL THINK YOU ARE CORRECT, AND YOU ARE NOT. A DIFFERENT FORUM STARTED SAYING "SHE SAID SHE 'TALKED TO OSWALD ON NOV. 21" AND THE NEXT THING I KNEW, THEY SAID WE TALKED THE NIGHT OF NOV. 21. I TRIED TO CORRECT THEM, BUT MY STATEMENT WAS IGNORED.. THIS MAY BE WHAT YOU RECALL.==
JVB became very abusive to Rich and some other researchers after about nine months, and Rich finally banished JVB and her supporters (at that time mostly Martin Shackleford, Bob Vernon, Wim Dankbaar and several others).
==I TRY NOT TO BE ABUSIVE TO ANYONE, JACK. PEOPLE SUPPORTING ME THERE OBJECTED TO MY TREATMENT AND GOT BANISHED, TOO. THINK ABOUT THAT! WHAT IF THE EDUCATION FORUM BANISHED DR. FETZER, GREG BURNHAM AND PAMELA BROWN FOR DEFENDING SOME OF MY STATEMENTS ON THESE THREADS? BUT THAT'S WHAT HAPPENED IN DELLAROSA'S FORUM.==
My details may not be totally accurate, but this is the gist that I remember from those long ago arguments. In the aftermath of the banishments, someone with an ISP in Amsterdam hacked Rich's forum twice, each time causing it to go down for several days, and losing earlier messages, including the JVB exchanges.
==THESE MAY HAVE BEEN THE DUTCH THIEVES, WHO STOLE MY BELONGINGS, THREATENED MY FRIENDS, HACKED INTO EVERYWHERE I HAD POSTED AND DELETED MY POSTS. THEY ALSO HACKED INTO MY COMPUTER, STOLE MY BOOK, AND POSTED ALTERED VERSIONS OF IT ONLINE, PICKED UP BY MCADAMS TO USE AGAINST ME, THIS MATERIAL INCLUDED THE UNFINISHED OUTLINE 'DEADLY ALLIANCE' WHICH HAD NOT YET BEEN CORRECTED IN FULL, BUT IS SILL BEING USED AGAINST ME WITH ITS SEVERAL ERRORS LEFT TO VIEW==
The phone call story seemed preposterous to some on the forum then, and I still find it difficult to swallow. I feel I must speak up again, because this same argument I thought was settled years ago, and now it surfaces again.
==YOU HAVE IT WRONG, JACK. MARRS, LIVINGSTONE, SHACKELFORD, DEVRIES, DANKBAAR, PLATZMAN AND OTHERS KNOW THE TIME LINE HAS NEVER CHANGED AND NO CALL EVER OCCURRED THE NIGHT OF THE 21ST. NOR DID I EVER STATE ANYTHING ABOUT A CALL FOR IRVING FOR THAT DATE.I STOUTLY DEFENDED THE MATTER EXACTLY AS I AM DOING NOW. BUT IT WAS ERASED==
Jack
ADDENDUM: During the midnight phone call, LHO told JVB that JFK would be killed on Friday, as the story goes. This caused forum members to charge JVB with being an accessory to the assassination, if she knew in advance of the attempt and did not try to contact authorities. This led to various accusations and counter accusations, as I recall.
[quote name='Jack White' date='Mar 23 2010, 03:48 AM' post='187523']
I had vowed not to waste more time on the JVB story, but I cannot let this go unchallenged. It covers the
same ground which was disputed years ago on the DellaRosa forum.
With due respect to Greg and Jim...the latest is not the way I remember it...from about 8 years ago on Rich's forum.
Her story at that time...and my memory from that far back may be faulty, and Rich is no longer available to
confirm, here is how I remember it, and arguments about it led to JVB eventually being banished from the
forum for abusive behavior:
JVB's story then (as I recall) was that LHO and JVB conversed EVERY night by phone. He would go across Beckley
Street from his rooming house to a 24-hour laundromat and call her on a pay phone there, and they would talk for
hours. This was countered on several counts, as I recall. Some researcher found no such nearby laundromat existed.
At that time, pay phone calls were timed by the minute, and were very expensive, especially long distance, and
JVB had LHO spending huge sums on pay phone calls. Then she told of a very long call the night of November 21,
lasting past midnight. This was countered with the fact that LHO was in Irving and not at the rooming house,
and his pre-assassination night was well documented. When reminded that LHO could not call from the all-night
laundromat, JVB was adamant that the long midnight call was made, and that he found another pay phone in
Irving. For this to have happened, LHO would have had to get out of bed without waking Marina, leave the
Paine house secretly, walk to find a pay phone in the residential neighborhood, talk a long time, return
to the Paine house, and sneak back into bed without awakening Marina or children. This is how I remember
the forum exchanges from years ago. JVB became very abusive to Rich and some other researchers after
about nine months, and Rich finally banished JVB and her supporters (at that time mostly Martin Shackleford,
Bob Vernon, Wim Dankbaar and several others). My details may not be totally accurate, but this is the gist
that I remember from those long ago arguments. In the aftermath of the banishments, someone with an ISP
in Amsterdam hacked Rich's forum twice, each time causing it to go down for several days, and losing earlier
messages, including the JVB exchanges.
The phone call story seemed preposterous to some on the forum then, and I still find it difficult to swallow. I feel I
must speak up again, because this same argument I thought was settled years ago, and now it surfaces again.
Jack
ADDENDUM: During the midnight phone call, LHO told JVB that JFK would be killed on Friday, as the story goes.
This caused forum members to charge JVB with being an accessory to the assassination, if she knew in
advance of the attempt and did not try to contact authorities. This led to various accusations and counter
accusations, as I recall.
[/quote]
I have a post from dated July 4, 2004, where Rich DellaRosa states that I resigned from his forum...DellaRosa also said that he not only erased the posts and files, but would do it again in a heartbeat, because I was telling 'fairytales' and had nothing to important to say. He also added some insults. I did not exhibit any 'abusive behavior' on the forum. his has been repeated several times by Jack and I wish to disabuse the reader who might start reading at this point in the thread.
==RESPONSE TO THE REST OF J W'S POST==MY COMMENTS IN CAPS==
Her story at that time...and my memory from that far back may be faulty, and Rich is no longer available to confirm, here is how I remember it, and arguments about it led to JVB eventually being banished from the forum for abusive behavior:
QUOTES FROM RICH DELLAROSA, JULY 4, 2004:
....you ersased (sic) everything.
You resigned...
"Your posts were deleted AFTER you resigned."
[I DISAGREE: THEY WERE ERASED BEFORE I RESIGNED]
JVB's story then (as I recall) was that LHO and JVB conversed EVERY night by phone.
==ON TMWKK THE LOVE AFFAIR AND EVER SINCE 1999 WHEN I FIRST SPOKE OUT, I MENTIONED 14-15 PHONE CALLS BETWEEN OCTOBER 6 AND EARLY AM NOV. 21.==
He would go across Beckley Street from his rooming house to a 24-hour laundromat and call her on a pay phone there, and they would talk for hours. This was countered on several counts, as I recall.
==IT HAS NEVER BEEN COUNTERED. A JANITOR IS IN THE MARY FERRELL CHRONOLOGY REPORTING SEEING LEE OSWALD THERE THE LAST NIGHT HE CALLED ME. I DID NOT SAY THAT LEE USED THE LAUNDROMAT EVERY TIME FOR A CALL. I DESCRIBED BEING ABLE TO HEAR CARS PASSING BY ON SEVERAL OCCASIONS...NOR DID I CLAIM A PAYPHONE EXISTED INSIDE THE LAUNDROMAT. I HAVE SOME INFORMATION ABOUT HIS, THOUGH, THAT THE RESEARCH COMMUNITY SHOULD KNOW ABOUT. IT CASTS ASPERSIONS ON THE ROLE AND CONDUCT OF RUTH PAINE ON THE EVENING OF NOV. 21==
Some researcher found no such nearby laundromat existed.
==INACCURATE. THE JANITOR'S LAUNDROMAT REPORT WAS FROM THE FBI.==
At that time, pay phone calls were timed by the minute, and were very expensive, especially long distance, and JVB had LHO spending huge sums on pay phone calls.
==FALSE. JACK WHITE HAS OBVIOUSLY NEVER SEEN THE LOVE AFFAIR DOCUMENTARY, WHERE I EXPLAIN WE TAPPED INTO A MAFIA RACING LINE AND ALL CALLS WERE FREE. I EXPLAINED HE SET-UP TO "60 MINUTES" IN SOME DETAIL. A GOOD RESEARCHER SHOULD A LEAST LOOK AT THE DOCUMENTARY, WHICH IN ITSELF IS JUST A DISTILLATION.... WITNESSES ARE NOT IN IT DUE TO THEIR FEAR. WE HAVE DOCUMENTED PRESSURE USED AGAINST ANNA LEWIS, FOR EXAMPLE.==
Then she told of a very long call the night of November 21,
==FALSE. NEVER SAID THAT. IT WAS LATE ON THE NIGHT OF WEDNESDAY, NOV. 20, EXTENDING INTO EARLY AM NOV. 21. ==
lasting past midnight. This was countered with the fact that LHO was in Irving and not at the rooming house, and his pre-assassination night was well documented. When reminded that LHO could not call from the all-night laundromat, JVB was adamant that the long midnight call was made,
[NOT TRUE!]
and that he found another pay phone in Irving.
[NOT TRUE!]
==UTTER FABRICATION THAT DOES NOT MATCH ANYTHING EVER WRITTEN OR SPOKEN BY ME.....FALSE STATEMENTS ARE BEING ATTRIBUTED TO ME==
For this to have happened, LHO would have had to get out of bed without waking Marina, leave the Paine house secretly, walk to find a pay phone in the residential neighborhood, talk a long time, return to the Paine house, and sneak back into bed without awakening Marina or children. This is how I remember the forum exchanges from years ago.
==YOU HAVE THE DATE WRONG, JACK. I HAVE ALWAYS STATED THE CALL WAS THE NIGHT OF NOV. 20 TO EARLY AM NOV. 21. I HAVE TO RESPOND BECAUSE PEOPLE WILL THINK YOU ARE CORRECT, AND YOU ARE NOT. A DIFFERENT FORUM STARTED SAYING "SHE SAID SHE 'TALKED TO OSWALD ON NOV. 21" AND THE NEXT THING I KNEW, THEY SAID WE TALKED THE NIGHT OF NOV. 21. I TRIED TO CORRECT THEM, BUT MY STATEMENT WAS IGNORED.. THIS MAY BE WHAT YOU RECALL.==
JVB became very abusive to Rich and some other researchers after about nine months, and Rich finally banished JVB and her supporters (at that time mostly Martin Shackleford, Bob Vernon, Wim Dankbaar and several others).
==I TRY NOT TO BE ABUSIVE TO ANYONE, JACK. PEOPLE SUPPORTING ME THERE OBJECTED TO MY TREATMENT AND GOT BANISHED, TOO. THINK ABOUT THAT! WHAT IF THE EDUCATION FORUM BANISHED DR. FETZER, GREG BURNHAM AND PAMELA BROWN FOR DEFENDING SOME OF MY STATEMENTS ON THESE THREADS? BUT THAT'S WHAT HAPPENED IN DELLAROSA'S FORUM.==
My details may not be totally accurate, but this is the gist that I remember from those long ago arguments. In the aftermath of the banishments, someone with an ISP in Amsterdam hacked Rich's forum twice, each time causing it to go down for several days, and losing earlier messages, including the JVB exchanges.
==THESE MAY HAVE BEEN THE DUTCH THIEVES, WHO STOLE MY BELONGINGS, THREATENED MY FRIENDS, HACKED INTO EVERYWHERE I HAD POSTED AND DELETED MY POSTS. THEY ALSO HACKED INTO MY COMPUTER, STOLE MY BOOK, AND POSTED ALTERED VERSIONS OF IT ONLINE, PICKED UP BY MCADAMS TO USE AGAINST ME, THIS MATERIAL INCLUDED THE UNFINISHED OUTLINE 'DEADLY ALLIANCE' WHICH HAD NOT YET BEEN CORRECTED IN FULL, BUT IS SILL BEING USED AGAINST ME WITH ITS SEVERAL ERRORS LEFT TO VIEW==
The phone call story seemed preposterous to some on the forum then, and I still find it difficult to swallow. I feel I must speak up again, because this same argument I thought was settled years ago, and now it surfaces again.
==YOU HAVE IT WRONG, JACK. MARRS, LIVINGSTONE, SHACKELFORD, DEVRIES, DANKBAAR, PLATZMAN AND OTHERS KNOW THE TIME LINE HAS NEVER CHANGED AND NO CALL EVER OCCURRED THE NIGHT OF THE 21ST. NOR DID I EVER STATE ANYTHING ABOUT A CALL FOR IRVING FOR THAT DATE.I STOUTLY DEFENDED THE MATTER EXACTLY AS I AM DOING NOW. BUT IT WAS ERASED==
Jack
ADDENDUM: During the midnight phone call, LHO told JVB that JFK would be killed on Friday, as the story goes. This caused forum members to charge JVB with being an accessory to the assassination, if she knew in advance of the attempt and did not try to contact authorities. This led to various accusations and counter accusations, as I recall.
[quote name='Jack White' date='Mar 23 2010, 03:48 AM' post='187523']
I had vowed not to waste more time on the JVB story, but I cannot let this go unchallenged. It covers the
same ground which was disputed years ago on the DellaRosa forum.
With due respect to Greg and Jim...the latest is not the way I remember it...from about 8 years ago on Rich's forum.
Her story at that time...and my memory from that far back may be faulty, and Rich is no longer available to
confirm, here is how I remember it, and arguments about it led to JVB eventually being banished from the
forum for abusive behavior:
JVB's story then (as I recall) was that LHO and JVB conversed EVERY night by phone. He would go across Beckley
Street from his rooming house to a 24-hour laundromat and call her on a pay phone there, and they would talk for
hours. This was countered on several counts, as I recall. Some researcher found no such nearby laundromat existed.
At that time, pay phone calls were timed by the minute, and were very expensive, especially long distance, and
JVB had LHO spending huge sums on pay phone calls. Then she told of a very long call the night of November 21,
lasting past midnight. This was countered with the fact that LHO was in Irving and not at the rooming house,
and his pre-assassination night was well documented. When reminded that LHO could not call from the all-night
laundromat, JVB was adamant that the long midnight call was made, and that he found another pay phone in
Irving. For this to have happened, LHO would have had to get out of bed without waking Marina, leave the
Paine house secretly, walk to find a pay phone in the residential neighborhood, talk a long time, return
to the Paine house, and sneak back into bed without awakening Marina or children. This is how I remember
the forum exchanges from years ago. JVB became very abusive to Rich and some other researchers after
about nine months, and Rich finally banished JVB and her supporters (at that time mostly Martin Shackleford,
Bob Vernon, Wim Dankbaar and several others). My details may not be totally accurate, but this is the gist
that I remember from those long ago arguments. In the aftermath of the banishments, someone with an ISP
in Amsterdam hacked Rich's forum twice, each time causing it to go down for several days, and losing earlier
messages, including the JVB exchanges.
The phone call story seemed preposterous to some on the forum then, and I still find it difficult to swallow. I feel I
must speak up again, because this same argument I thought was settled years ago, and now it surfaces again.
Jack
ADDENDUM: During the midnight phone call, LHO told JVB that JFK would be killed on Friday, as the story goes.
This caused forum members to charge JVB with being an accessory to the assassination, if she knew in
advance of the attempt and did not try to contact authorities. This led to various accusations and counter
accusations, as I recall.
[/quote]