A Noble Lie - OK City Bombing.

[Dawn Meredith]

This great documentary is now free on youtube. We own a copy but the last 2 weeks I have been trying to get a few friends to take the time to view
it. To no avail of course. CNN and MSNBC is their thing. And they believe every word from Mocking bird media.
Every time I watch this film I learn something new.

[Peter Lemkin]

https://deeppoliticsforum.com/forums/sho...ty+bombing

I miss my friend Adele E. - our former member.....and victim of the 11.22.63 plot! RIP Adele!

[David Andrews]

I'd be interested in hearing speculation or informed opinion on this topic:

If OKC was an inside job, what was it all for?

What did the Deep State, or even the Executive administration and the law enforcement agencies and intelligence community, get out of perpetrating so much destruction and calamity?

[Peter Lemkin]

I'd be interested in hearing speculation or informed opinion on this topic:

If OKC was an inside job, what was it all for? What did the Deep State, or even the Executive administration and the law enforcement agencies and intelligence community, get out of perpetrating so much destruction and calamity?

It is easier to see with 911, OKC was practice and to do the same, but at a lesser level and to a lesser degree. 911 was for:
- the Patriot Act and other accompanying legislation that is so secret you don't even know it was passed, but it was and is part now of COG.
- to have an 'state enemy' to replace the Soviet Union' to keep the MIC and associated firms in the money.
- to have a state of perpetual war and an endless war....which we now have...
- to be able to better and further control the US Citizens
- to frighten [to better control] US Citizens - the 'terrorists' are everywhere....

I'm surprised this needs to be spelled out. To me it seems obvious. They got the World they wanted and we got the World they wanted us to 'get'. It is, however, based on a lies, false-flags, inside-jobs, threats, some assassinations, covert operations domestic as much as foreign and universal electronic eavesdropping. 1984.

Answer: They got a hell of a lot of money, power, control, stealth - and we lost democracy, truth, rights, freedom, money, sanity, rule of law, decency.

[David Andrews]

I'd be interested in hearing speculation or informed opinion on this topic:

If OKC was an inside job, what was it all for? What did the Deep State, or even the Executive administration and the law enforcement agencies and intelligence community, get out of perpetrating so much destruction and calamity?

It is easier to see with 911, OKC was practice and to do the same, but at a lesser level and to a lesser degree. 911 was for:
- the Patriot Act and other accompanying legislation that is so secret you don't even know it was passed, but it was and is part now of COG.
- to have an 'state enemy' to replace the Soviet Union' to keep the MIC and associated firms in the money.
- to have a state of perpetual war and an endless war....which we now have...
- to be able to better and further control the US Citizens
- to frighten [to better control] US Citizens - the 'terrorists' are everywhere....

I'm surprised this needs to be spelled out. To me it seems obvious. They got the World they wanted and we got the World they wanted us to 'get'. It is, however, based on a lies, false-flags, inside-jobs, threats, some assassinations, covert operations domestic as much as foreign and universal electronic eavesdropping. 1984.

Answer: They got a hell of a lot of money, power, control, stealth - and we lost democracy, truth, rights, freedom, money, sanity, rule of law, decency.

I take all your points, Peter, except the practice angle. There were a limited number of explosive devices at OKC, and a limited amount of riggers. If all the bombs had gone off, the huge main pillars of the building may have blown and a total collapse ensued - but it's not methodologically the same as WTC. As it was, the conspirators lucked out, as the damage to the Murrah building more accurately resembled an embassy truck bombing than if total collapse happened, which would have looked suspicious. And a second truck bombing could not have been plausibly pulled off at WTC.

I don't know about the state enemy angle, since that was not pursued until years later, when Ramzi Yusuf was linked to the indigenous US cell through the Philippines meeting. We didn't even get a foreign invasion out of OKC.

You may be right about the planning objectives - but the results were not compatible.

You don't have to explain the 9/11 gains to me. I asked about what was hoped for and what was gained through OKC.

[Peter Lemkin]

I'd be interested in hearing speculation or informed opinion on this topic:

If OKC was an inside job, what was it all for? What did the Deep State, or even the Executive administration and the law enforcement agencies and intelligence community, get out of perpetrating so much destruction and calamity?

It is easier to see with 911, OKC was practice and to do the same, but at a lesser level and to a lesser degree. 911 was for:
- the Patriot Act and other accompanying legislation that is so secret you don't even know it was passed, but it was and is part now of COG.
- to have an 'state enemy' to replace the Soviet Union' to keep the MIC and associated firms in the money.
- to have a state of perpetual war and an endless war....which we now have...
- to be able to better and further control the US Citizens
- to frighten [to better control] US Citizens - the 'terrorists' are everywhere....

I'm surprised this needs to be spelled out. To me it seems obvious. They got the World they wanted and we got the World they wanted us to 'get'. It is, however, based on a lies, false-flags, inside-jobs, threats, some assassinations, covert operations domestic as much as foreign and universal electronic eavesdropping. 1984.

Answer: They got a hell of a lot of money, power, control, stealth - and we lost democracy, truth, rights, freedom, money, sanity, rule of law, decency.

I take all your points, Peter, except the practice angle. There were a limited number of explosive devices at OKC, and a limited amount of riggers. If all the bombs had gone off, the huge main pillars of the building may have blown and a total collapse ensued - but it's not methodologically the same as WTC. As it was, the conspirators lucked out, as the damage to the Murrah building more accurately resembled an embassy truck bombing than if total collapse happened, which would have looked suspicious. And a second truck bombing could not have been plausibly pulled off at WTC.

I don't know about the state enemy angle, since that was not pursued until years later, when Ramzi Yusuf was linked to the indigenous US cell through the Philippines meeting. We didn't even get a foreign invasion out of OKC.

You may be right about the planning objectives - but the results were not compatible.

You don't have to explain the 9/11 gains to me. I asked about what was hoped for and what was gained through OKC.

The main explosive forces that took down the OKC building EXACTLY AS PLANNED did NOT come from a truckbomb - which was a 'patsy' truckbomb - even if it had some minor explosive force. There were timed and powerful explosives INSIDE that did the main damage. It raised the terrorist threat, made people afraid and prepared them - even numbed them to future similar events. It was also a try-out for bigger things to come. Also, to see how the American people and the MSM reacted.

[David Andrews]

I'd be interested in hearing speculation or informed opinion on this topic:

If OKC was an inside job, what was it all for? What did the Deep State, or even the Executive administration and the law enforcement agencies and intelligence community, get out of perpetrating so much destruction and calamity?

It is easier to see with 911, OKC was practice and to do the same, but at a lesser level and to a lesser degree. 911 was for:
- the Patriot Act and other accompanying legislation that is so secret you don't even know it was passed, but it was and is part now of COG.
- to have an 'state enemy' to replace the Soviet Union' to keep the MIC and associated firms in the money.
- to have a state of perpetual war and an endless war....which we now have...
- to be able to better and further control the US Citizens
- to frighten [to better control] US Citizens - the 'terrorists' are everywhere....

I'm surprised this needs to be spelled out. To me it seems obvious. They got the World they wanted and we got the World they wanted us to 'get'. It is, however, based on a lies, false-flags, inside-jobs, threats, some assassinations, covert operations domestic as much as foreign and universal electronic eavesdropping. 1984.

Answer: They got a hell of a lot of money, power, control, stealth - and we lost democracy, truth, rights, freedom, money, sanity, rule of law, decency.

I take all your points, Peter, except the practice angle. There were a limited number of explosive devices at OKC, and a limited amount of riggers. If all the bombs had gone off, the huge main pillars of the building may have blown and a total collapse ensued - but it's not methodologically the same as WTC. As it was, the conspirators lucked out, as the damage to the Murrah building more accurately resembled an embassy truck bombing than if total collapse happened, which would have looked suspicious. And a second truck bombing could not have been plausibly pulled off at WTC.

I don't know about the state enemy angle, since that was not pursued until years later, when Ramzi Yusuf was linked to the indigenous US cell through the Philippines meeting. We didn't even get a foreign invasion out of OKC.

You may be right about the planning objectives - but the results were not compatible.

You don't have to explain the 9/11 gains to me. I asked about what was hoped for and what was gained through OKC.

The main explosive forces that took down the OKC building EXACTLY AS PLANNED did NOT come from a truckbomb - which was a 'patsy' truckbomb - even if it had some minor explosive force. There were timed and powerful explosives INSIDE that did the main damage. It raised the terrorist threat, made people afraid and prepared them - even numbed them to future similar events. It was also a try-out for bigger things to come. Also, to see how the American people and the MSM reacted.

I know all that, Peter. But not all the internal devices went off - which is how reports of internal devices leaked in the MSM. It leaked to McVeigh's lawyer, who used it at trial. Even the video Adele Edisen posted says unexploded devices were discovered. Otherwise, the building would have collapsed.

All that chaos for gauging public reaction, Even public reaction to complete destruction by obvious controlled demo, had it succeeded?

Were there not buildings with structural composition more similar to WTC that were scheduled for controlled demolition, and could be studied without subterfuge or loss of life? Were they really thinking of another truck bomb at WTC on 9/11?

[Dawn Meredith]

According to A Noble Lie all the Whitewater records were in that building. Evidence of Mena/cocaine smuggling etc.

[David Andrews]

According to A Noble Lie all the Whitewater records were in that building. Evidence of Mena/cocaine smuggling etc.

I'll check that out, thanks. It's difficult to believe copies weren't kept, and the rumor sounds like those of all the case evidence (supposedly on the Rumsfeld-announced trillion dollar Defense budget losses) that was shoveled into the WTC before it went down.

[David Andrews]

I mean, um, just looking at A Noble Lie, plus taking into account the books and other film I've watched on OKC...this seems like a very elaborate, costly, and wide-ranging operation to take on for informational purposes related to a future 9/11 attack, especially when data was gathered during the WTC truck bombing in February 1993.

I dunno - did I watch Three Days of the Condor too many times, and am brainwashed into looking for purposes? Whatever white supremacist/armed religious cult momentum the Clinton admin DOJ was obsessed with seems to have died out once the Bush regime returned.

So, why OKC? For instance, what did our law enforcement and intelligence agencies get out of it?

I mean, is this a characterological theme thing? Were the Clintons obsessed with internal redneck terror (Waco, Ruby Ridge, OKC) while the Bushes were more internationalist in their pursuit of Iraq and Afghanistan?

Did the Clinton admin studiously avoid international conflict (apart from an aspirin factory missile strike) in order to let the Bushes take the global low road? Or was the internal threat under Clinton a form of time serving that allowed Al Qaeda to "develop" while our law enforcement and intelligence services were "occupied" chasing cornpone bad guys within our shores, throwing a shout-out in passing to the Philippines terror network as a segue into the crimes of the next admin?


Dick: "I dunno, Bob. You might as well ask a popcorn fart if it has a purpose."

Bob: "I can turn that into money, Dick."