JFK, Nasser and Israel

[James Lateer]

This thread is a really good one (IMHO).

Could one compare JFK's attempt to approach Nasser to Jimmy Carter enlisting Anwar Sadat to create at least a partial (and long-lasting) peace movement in the Israeli-Arab eternal feuding?

Another comparison would be the role of Queen Elizabeth portrayed in "The Crown" where she (naively and impulsively) tried to win back the support of (I think) President Nkrumah of Ghana who had strayed from the British orbit (toward the USSR).

If JFK were to have been trying to cozy up to Nasser, I personally don't think that his actions would have been prudent, even regarding potential nuclear war.

It's a little like the situation of Iran and nukes, or NOKO and nukes. I believe Jimmy Carter when he says that the Iranians (and the NOKO's) are not suicidal so they won't use nukes even if they have them.

This is the first I have heard about Golda Meir loading planes with atomic weapons during a war. Same proposition. Basically a suicidal concept. Especially (as mentioned above) since it was fighting over a desert. A DESERT!!!! Too many nut jobs in the Middle East. I'm sorry if that sounds harsh, but it's all too true (IMO) and probably will never change, at least not until the sun burns out (and goes dark) and no sooner.

We probably don't have to worry about use of atomic weapons because (if it happens) almost everybody or maybe everybody will quickly be killed, blinded or both. And I don't think rocking the boat in the Middle East by JFK (if it actually happened) would have been prudent. In fact, it would have been chalked up to JFK's (and RFK's) legendary impulsiveness and shallow (though sincere) judgment.

James Lateer

[Jim DiEugenio]

The more I study this, Sadat was not the equivalent of Nasser. In fact, in some ways, I think he sold Nasser out.

Even Jimmy Carter came to have second thoughts about this.

See Nasser would have not accepted only a partial agreement on the Middle East. And he would not have been interested in a treaty that ignored the plight of the Palestinians. Carter admitted that he should have tried for an overall agreement.

JFK and Nasser both agreed that they would not approach the Palestinian issue in Kennedy's first term. So Kennedy was trying to build his relationship with Nasser first, and in his first term, he only backed the UN proposal for Palestinian repatriation, not a two state agreement.

[James Lateer]

Famous last words---"let's wait until my second term"

James Lateer

[Scott Kaiser]

Famous last words---"let's wait until my second term"

James Lateer

Famous last words, "Don't you worry John, we're gonna kill that motherf@&*er!"

[Jim DiEugenio]

What is something, and I noted this in my article, is that Kennedy was trying to push the UN proposal on the Israelis all the way up to May of 1963.

This allowed for choice of repatriation after the Palestinian Nakba. It would have given them a three option alternative:

stay where you are
move elsewhere
return to Palestine

And the UN would pay all expenses, mostly of course through the USA.

The Israelis really did not like this but they did not want it to blow up in the UN. So Kennedy was pushing them for a number that they would take. And that is where the problems set in. Kennedy wanted them to take something like 150,000 if the Palestinians took that option. The Israelis clearly did not want to take that many. In the discussions, Golda Meir actually says words to the effect, Why that number, why not 149,000?

I mean, really, how do you deal with this stuff?

But to show you what the overall intent was, in the exchange, the Israelis object to America stamping passports with the word Palestine on them.

If you ever wanted to see what the Israeli objective was and is, that would show you.

BTW, you know who joined in the debate about repatriation? Martin Peretz, yep, the guy who bought the New Republic and ran it into the ground. His idea was that Israel should not take any Palestinians back. They should all go to Jordan, you know that Churchill created monarchy carved out of Palestine?

I always wondered why Peretz hated Kennedy so much. Then I read that. No one is more of an ultra Zionist that Peretz. From the last I heard, he spends half the year in Israel now.