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Robert Vinson
#21
Quote:It seems entirely unlikely that a pilot (even from the CIA) would receive some sort of confirmation over the radio about a fact of the Kennedy assassination so quickly.

I disagree strongly. They knew it was to happen; were involved in making it happen and likely signaled, as planned, for the exfiltration portion of the operation to go ahead seconds after JFK was shot from multiple shooter positions.
"Let me issue and control a nation's money and I care not who writes the laws. - Mayer Rothschild
"Civil disobedience is not our problem. Our problem is civil obedience! People are obedient in the face of poverty, starvation, stupidity, war, and cruelty. Our problem is that grand thieves are running the country. That's our problem!" - Howard Zinn
"If there is no struggle there is no progress. Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and never will" - Frederick Douglass
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#22
The faster the pilot reacts, the less likely Vinson's story is to be accurate in travel direction and plane movements.
"All that is necessary for tyranny to succeed is for good men to do nothing." (unknown)

James Tracy: "There is sometimes an undue amount of paranoia among some conspiracy researchers that can contribute to flawed observations and analysis."

Gary Cornwell (Dept. Chief Counsel HSCA): "A fact merely marks the point at which we have agreed to let investigation cease."

Alan Ford: "Just because you believe it, that doesn't make it so."
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#23
Honestly Drew, you have to allow for a little leeway in Vinson's story. I doubt you could take protractor measurements off his story but it is most-likely true in general.


Vinson was monitored and had career problems after his witnessing. He wasn't supposed to be on that plane and was placed there by an unexpected good samaritan dispatcher who wasn't informed it was a CIA coup d'etat black ops flight.


It would make sense that he would stationed at Area 51 because they could then use the classified nature of that site as an excuse for censoring Vinson if necessary.
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#24
Drew Phipps Wrote:The faster the pilot reacts, the less likely Vinson's story is to be accurate in travel direction and plane movements.

If the story has any truth to it at all, the flight wasn't diverted - its only and true mission always was to pick up someone exfiltrating from Dallas - and that message was sent seconds after the shooting - as was planned. It seems simple. You make it sound as if aspects of the intelligence agencies were surprised by the assassination! Nothing was left to chance - it was a near perfectly planned operation.
"Let me issue and control a nation's money and I care not who writes the laws. - Mayer Rothschild
"Civil disobedience is not our problem. Our problem is civil obedience! People are obedient in the face of poverty, starvation, stupidity, war, and cruelty. Our problem is that grand thieves are running the country. That's our problem!" - Howard Zinn
"If there is no struggle there is no progress. Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and never will" - Frederick Douglass
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#25
You're missing my point entirely. Vinson is quite clear that is was 12:29 PM and the plane made a 90 degree turn to the left to head south. Unless Vinson is LYING, this is only possible at 12:29 PM Mountain Standard Time, an hour AFTER the assassination.
"All that is necessary for tyranny to succeed is for good men to do nothing." (unknown)

James Tracy: "There is sometimes an undue amount of paranoia among some conspiracy researchers that can contribute to flawed observations and analysis."

Gary Cornwell (Dept. Chief Counsel HSCA): "A fact merely marks the point at which we have agreed to let investigation cease."

Alan Ford: "Just because you believe it, that doesn't make it so."
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#26
Drew Phipps Wrote:You're missing my point entirely. Vinson is quite clear that is was 12:29 PM and the plane made a 90 degree turn to the left to head south. Unless Vinson is LYING, this is only possible at 12:29 PM Mountain Standard Time, an hour AFTER the assassination.

Well, we have Vinson stating he heard 'the President has been shot', then immediately the plane heads South to what he recognized from the skyline was Dallas. We do not know if this message and turn was just after the shots or sometime after - such as an hour after, and it is IMO not very important. It is where the plane went at about the 'right' time, and what happened to Vinson later that is - not to mention the Oswald look-alike [with a dark-skinned man] getting on - and Roswell being on lockdown, etc. As for the exact times of turning South or arrival in Dallas, we don't know if Vinson remembers these time exactly correctly, if his watch was on PST, CST or EST - and if he accounted for timezone in telling. I think these details are interesting, but doesn't change or really challenge his story. I see no small time window that makes or breaks his credibility.

To me, the fact this was never really investigated, except by private researchers [along with happenings at RedBird and other possible excapes by car and other means] informs more, IMO, than your trying to pick it apart to question his credibility and story. The official apparatus was, in part, involved in the assassination - and then did its level best not to investigate. Its still an open murder case of a President, and when Vinson made his statements and published his book someone on an official level should have investigated - but they did not - which, to me, only shows the cover-up continues and will continue. Ditto with Redbird and hundred of other events, persons, pieces of evidence, strange deaths, etc. They 'closed' the case about an hour after the shooting [actually before the shooting], and have never looked at much real evidence [as little as was possible] since.
"Let me issue and control a nation's money and I care not who writes the laws. - Mayer Rothschild
"Civil disobedience is not our problem. Our problem is civil obedience! People are obedient in the face of poverty, starvation, stupidity, war, and cruelty. Our problem is that grand thieves are running the country. That's our problem!" - Howard Zinn
"If there is no struggle there is no progress. Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and never will" - Frederick Douglass
Reply
#27
"Let me issue and control a nation's money and I care not who writes the laws. - Mayer Rothschild
"Civil disobedience is not our problem. Our problem is civil obedience! People are obedient in the face of poverty, starvation, stupidity, war, and cruelty. Our problem is that grand thieves are running the country. That's our problem!" - Howard Zinn
"If there is no struggle there is no progress. Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and never will" - Frederick Douglass
Reply
#28
The most important reason why his story was never "investigated" is that he waited until 1993 to tell it. He missed Warren, Church, Garrison, House, even Stone's JFK made it into theaters nearly 2 years before Vinson's version.
"All that is necessary for tyranny to succeed is for good men to do nothing." (unknown)

James Tracy: "There is sometimes an undue amount of paranoia among some conspiracy researchers that can contribute to flawed observations and analysis."

Gary Cornwell (Dept. Chief Counsel HSCA): "A fact merely marks the point at which we have agreed to let investigation cease."

Alan Ford: "Just because you believe it, that doesn't make it so."
Reply
#29
That's assuming The Church Committee and HSCA were forthright and honest investigations.


Waiting decades to tell a story can actually be proof of its realness and danger.


There's nothing stopping them from investigating it now.
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#30
Danger maybe, but not truth. There's a wealth of research on memory and the passage of time. Unlike wine, memories don't improve with age.
"All that is necessary for tyranny to succeed is for good men to do nothing." (unknown)

James Tracy: "There is sometimes an undue amount of paranoia among some conspiracy researchers that can contribute to flawed observations and analysis."

Gary Cornwell (Dept. Chief Counsel HSCA): "A fact merely marks the point at which we have agreed to let investigation cease."

Alan Ford: "Just because you believe it, that doesn't make it so."
Reply


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