Jan Klimkowski Wrote:Gore Vidal has uttered very many insightful and important words over the decades. His comments above are not worthy.
A 13-year-old cannot consent to being drugged and then raped, vaginally and anally. Her mother cannot consent on her behalf.
I'm tempted to put Vidal's comments down to the onset of senility.
However, a less benign interpretation is that Vidal speaks as an aristocratic insider. Whilst he has spent most of his life exposing the sins both of his class and of the powerful, his utterances here seem to share Their complete disdain for the humanity and pain of ordinary people.
Vidal: A nasty piece of work whose much exaggerated "dissidence" has long boasted an uncommon ability to serve the interests of the US establishment:
Quote:The Washington Daily News, 7 March 1963, p.27
Bobby Kennedy in ‘68
By Richard Starnes
I am obliged to Gore Vidal, a playwright of considerable talent, a politician of some passing competence, and a philosopher of no account at all, for brushing aside the shadows that obscure the political future and, of course, by extension the future of us all.
Writing in this month’s Esquire, Mr. Vidal quickly disposes of 1964. President Kennedy is home free in ’64 and thus the election next year isn’t worth one of Dr. Gallup’s worn-out clip boards.
But 1968 – now there is a magazine-length essay that is another shade of green. What the ordained soothsayer can descry in that year can scarce bear repeating in the presence of nursing mums, particularly nursing mums.
Mr. Vidal (himself a liberal, altho not lactescent at this time) finds that the Democratic nominee will be Bobby Kennedy. He finds further that the candidacy of Bobby seems doomed to succeed. He isn’t happy about the prospect, altho he appears to believe Mr. Kennedy I (the first) is/was/will be counted a good President. I am inclined to agree with him on that score, just as I tend to share his view that Bobby would be a disaster in the job.
What troubles me, however, is Mr. Vidal’s certitude. He concedes that it is always possible a winter-book candidate might have the poor judgment to die between now and 1968, a misfortune that would probably disqualify anyone. He also suggests the possibility there might be no election in 1968 if, say, all of us let Mr. Kennedy – no, no, not THAT one, THIS one – down and lost a war. But otherwise, if I read Mr. Vidal correctly, Bobby is all but fated to succeed his big brother in the White House.
Mr. Vidal writes, as all good essayists write, in a forceful, not to say headlong, style that admits to no uneasy doubts in the reader’s mind. The trick is to write something like, “in six years Hubert Humphrey will be 57” – a sentence which surely proves the author a man of integrity and some ability to foresee the future – and then to follow it with some assumptions too broad for leaping except by the most sure-footed.
The biggest flaw in Mr. Vidal’s argument is his assumption that John Kennedy will exercise his vast power to install Bobby as his successor.
It is at least debatable. Mr. Vidal cites frailties in Bobby Kennedy that might well disqualify him for the job he seeks (come to think of it, there’s another broad jump; Vidal just THINKS Bobby wants to be top banana).
It is only reasonable to assume that John knows a lot more about Bobby than even Gore Vidal knows. Is he going to risk the place in history he will by then have earned (don’t worry, if we’re still alive, he’ll have earned it) by handing the job on to his pushy kid brother?
If he does, he’ll qualify himself in the history books as a man more interested in creating a family dynasty than in keeping alive our frail experiment in self-government. And there is nothing in his record to date that suggests he is such a person.
01-11-2009, 09:48 AM (This post was last modified: 01-11-2009, 09:59 AM by David Guyatt.)
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The shadow is a moral problem that challenges the whole ego-personality, for no one can become conscious of the shadow without considerable moral effort. To become conscious of it involves recognizing the dark aspects of the personality as present and real. This act is the essential condition for any kind of self-knowledge.
Jan Klimkowski Wrote:[edit] The Conspiracy Theory - Claims in detail
According to these authors, the Vril Society was founded as "The All German Society for Metaphysics" in 1921 to explore the origins of the Aryan race, to seek contact with the "hidden masters" of Ultima Thule, and to practice meditation and other techniques intended to strengthen individual mastery of the divine Vril force itself. It was formed by a group of female psychic mediums led by the Thule Gesellschaft medium Maria Orsitsch (Orsic) of Zagreb, who claimed to have received communication from Aryan aliens living on Alpha Tauri, in the Aldebaran system. Allegedly, these aliens had visited Earth and settled in Sumeria, and the word Vril was allegedly formed from the ancient Sumerian word Vri-Il, "like god" (In fact, Vri-Il means nothing in Sumerian, and could not even be a Sumerian word, as Sumerian had no /v/ phoneme, nor does Sumerian allow consonant clusters at the beginning of words. While the Akkadian word for "deity" is indeed ilum, the Sumerian word is dingir.). A second medium was known only as Sigrun, a name etymologically related to Sigrune, a Valkyrie and one of Wotan's nine daughters in Norse legend. Other sources[who?] state that the Vril Society was founded by an ill-defined group of Rosicrucians in Berlin before the end of the 19th century, while still others[who?] state that it was founded by Karl Haushofer in Berlin in 1918. Some sources state that the Vril Society was also known as the Luminous Lodge, or the Lodge of Light,[20] though others claim that it was originally called the Brothers of the Light.[21]
The Society allegedly not only taught concentration exercises designed to awaken the forces of Vril, their main goal was to achieve Raumflug (Spaceflight) to reach Aldebaran. To achieve this, the Vril Society joined the Thule Gesellschaft and the alleged DHvSS (Die Herren des schwarzen Steins, The Masters of the Black Stone) to fund an ambitious program involving an inter-dimensional flight machine based on psychic revelations from the Aldebaran aliens.
(my bolding)
I see a real conflict in the mind of the writer of this Wiki piece. Concentration exercises (i.e., focused meditation) to awaken Vril in order to achieve space-flight to reach Aldebaran is a little barmy (as you indicated Jan).
A more accurate description I think would be "inner travel to reach Aldebaran" which is far more consisten with, for example, the "Die Herren des Schwarzen Steins", "Masters of the Black Stone" - the latter being a description of the Alchemical process of nigredo - the blackening. It is not customary to "master" the Black Stone (much later in the alchemical process to become the "Stone of the Wise" or the "Lapis Philosophorum") but to endure it. Mastery to my mind suggests something altogether more purposefully sinister - which of course fits the Himmlerian vision far more accurately.
The following article may be of interest. Although I have some reservations about some of the more sweeping claims made by the author (particularly the psycho-physical raising of Kundalini being the object of the Grail mysteries -- in the sense it is portrayed anyway) the general drift non-the-less seems to fit the SS Schwarze Sonne pattern rather well.
Note the apparent dimensional shift in reality caused by the Pineal substance DMT.
The shadow is a moral problem that challenges the whole ego-personality, for no one can become conscious of the shadow without considerable moral effort. To become conscious of it involves recognizing the dark aspects of the personality as present and real. This act is the essential condition for any kind of self-knowledge.
The conflations of literal and spiritual journeys, substances, and objects are both functions of untrained, limited minds and intentional acts of misdirection in service to the maintenance and expansion of power -- material and otherwise.
02-11-2009, 11:47 PM (This post was last modified: 02-11-2009, 11:51 PM by David Guyatt.)
I've tried a little snopping around to find out more on the "Masters of the Black Stone" and it seems to be a fictional construct masquerading as a fact that probably originated HERE, that in turn derives from a French website.
However, the quoted name does have a certain resonance and the apparent French origin may be a key. There is French a game site that features a game entitled: "Maître de guerre Rochenoire" or Battle Master of the Black Rock (http://fr.wowhead.com/?npc=7029).
Not-with-standing this "Roche Noire" (and "Roche Blanc") featured quite prominently in the Rennes le Chateau puzzle - more accurately described as the Priory of Sion fiction (but a fiction with great meaning and purpose I warrant) --- which includes the even more cloaked alegorical mystery of Le Serpent Rouge (and not too dissimilar, I imagine, to the warring Welsh Red Dragon and White Dragon, or the colours of battling Tudor roses or the principal colours highlighted in the story of the Chemical Wedding of Christian Rosenkreutz.
In other words the Rubedo or reddening and the Albedo or whitening of the Alchemical process.
It therefore strikes me that the statement that the Thule Gesellschaft derived from the Rosicrucian order is probably correct and, if that is the case, the title "Masters of the Black Stone" is very likely an initiated grade of the Rosicrucians.
The shadow is a moral problem that challenges the whole ego-personality, for no one can become conscious of the shadow without considerable moral effort. To become conscious of it involves recognizing the dark aspects of the personality as present and real. This act is the essential condition for any kind of self-knowledge.
Charles Drago Wrote:The conflations of literal and spiritual journeys, substances, and objects are both functions of untrained, limited minds and intentional acts of misdirection in service to the maintenance and expansion of power -- material and otherwise.
Agreed Charlie.
At least up to a significant deep point anyway.
The so called Mysteries absolutely need to be mysterious and I imagine that stating all the secrets overtly and openly steals the thunder and plunders the Soul of future Grail knights - and causes boredom, belligerence and bedlam amongst all the in-training squires, who would not then wish to bother to become knights in their own right.
And where would Arthur and Camelot be then?
Having said that of course, all the great secrets are writ large and hid in plain sight anyway - but our eyes do not behold what the mind is, as yet, unable to fathom.
Imo anyway.
The shadow is a moral problem that challenges the whole ego-personality, for no one can become conscious of the shadow without considerable moral effort. To become conscious of it involves recognizing the dark aspects of the personality as present and real. This act is the essential condition for any kind of self-knowledge.
David Guyatt Wrote:Having said that of course, all the great secrets are writ large and hid in plain sight anyway - but our eyes do not behold what the mind is, as yet, unable to fathom.
The shadow is a moral problem that challenges the whole ego-personality, for no one can become conscious of the shadow without considerable moral effort. To become conscious of it involves recognizing the dark aspects of the personality as present and real. This act is the essential condition for any kind of self-knowledge.
03-11-2009, 01:14 PM (This post was last modified: 03-11-2009, 01:56 PM by Helen Reyes.)
FWIW,
Rene Guenon in Le Roi du Monde conflates the Grail and Satan's third eye. He says tradition has it that the bowl used at the Last Supper was carved from a black meteor reputed to have fallen from Satan's third eye, and associates it with the Kaaba (cube) in Mecca.
(the English translation of this book, long in the public domain, was published in the UK in 1974, then disappeared for a few decades to be republished by an American enterprise that changed the title from Lord of the World to King of the World and slapped a copyright on it.)
Coincidentally, one of the American explorers of Perry Land in Greenland made it a point to steal a meteor the Inuit had possessed for centuries, which is now in some museum in New York.
Also, the Tunguska (Tungus) event was said by some witnesses to have begun as a black sphere moving across the sky. Coincidentally and concurrently Nikola Tesla claimed to have discovered the secret of manufacturing ball lightning, and told a confidant that certain species were highly explosive/implosive, and could be used as a new kind of weapon.
Further, the Simon Necronomicon contains a section about an acolyte stumbling upon an ancient rite in which a large black stone levitates. The Simon edition is a continuation of the fictional sources Lovecraft cites, a project to make the possibility of the Necronomicon's existence more plausible to keep the joke going, drawing on Crowley, Sumerian, Akkadian/Babylonian, Yezidi and Mandaean sources. One source Lovecraft cites among the fictional works and scholars is not fictional: Wormius. Wormius is the Latin name of Wormskiold or Wormskold, a Norwegian (or Danish?) scholar who wrote about the lost Norse colonies in Greenland, among other things. As far as I know the only Lovecraft story to mention Greenland is The Call of Cthulhu, and then only in passing, something about degenerate Satanic angekut mesmerizing a strange band of Eskimo living high up on the icecap.
The Priory of Sion and related hoaxes were perpetrated from what I understand by depositing spurious folios in the Bibliotheque Nationale in Paris, also a favorite of Lovecraft.
If you're interested in Vril and Nazi occultism, the following sites have some interesting primary sources:
Quote:Professor Webb had been engaged, forty-eight years before, in a tour of Greenland and Iceland in search of some Runic inscriptions which he failed to unearth; and whilst high up on the West Greenland coast had encountered a singular tribe or cult of degenerate Eskimos whose religion, a curious form of devil-worship, chilled him with its deliberate bloodthirstiness and repulsiveness. It was a faith of which other Eskimos knew little, and which they mentioned only with shudders, saying that it had come down from horribly ancient aeons before ever the world was made. Besides nameless rites and human sacrifices there were certain queer hereditary rituals addressed to a supreme elder devil or tornasuk; and of this Professor Webb had taken a careful phonetic copy from an aged angekok or wizard-priest, expressing the sounds in Roman letters as best he knew how. But just now of prime significance was the fetish which this cult had cherished, and around which they danced when the aurora leaped high over the ice cliffs. It was, the professor stated, a very crude bas-relief of stone, comprising a hideous picture and some cryptic writing. And as far as he could tell, it was a rough parallel in all essential features of the bestial thing now lying before the meeting.
These data, received with suspense and astonishment by the assembled members, proved doubly exciting to Inspector Legrasse; and he began at once to ply his informant with questions. Having noted and copied an oral ritual among the swamp cult-worshippers his men had arrested, he besought the professor to remember as best he might the syllables taken down amongst the diabolist Eskimos. There then followed an exhaustive comparison of details, and a moment of really awed silence when both detective and scientist agreed on the virtual identity of the phrase common to two hellish rituals so many worlds of distance apart. What, in substance, both the Eskimo wizards and the Louisiana swamp-priests had chanted to their kindred idols was something very like this—the word-divisions being guessed at from traditional breaks in the phrase as chanted aloud;
Tornasuk is a power Greenlandic shamans called on, neither God nor Devil, and together with his sometimes-consort the Mother of All Sea-Animals made up the entire pantheon for some Inuit there.
A nearly 20 ton iron meteorite that fell nearly 10,000 years ago. It was found in 1963 by V.F. Buchwald near Agpalilik. This is a piece of the larger Cape York meteorite found in the same region by Robert Perry in 1894. The larger Cape York piece is in the American Museum of Natural History in New York.
(from http://thulegreenlandsite.com/thule_summer.html)
![[Image: meteorb.jpg]](http://thulegreenlandsite.com/meteorb.jpg)