05-04-2023, 11:11 AM
Brian, you are basing your reconstruction on faulty evidence, namely, Frazier's 2002 Sixth Floor Museum interview alleging that he saw Oswald leave the building via the rear loading dock.
This ignores Frazier's 1977 HSCA interview, in which he recounted he'd been "standing out on the curb... standing out with the police" after the shooting sequence, where there was a military man he'd seen the day before. This 1977 transcript used to be posted at ROKC; I haven't visited there in several years and have no idea if it is still available.
WESLEY FRAZIER TAPE 2, p. 1:
MORIARTY: You were saying- where you were when you saw the police and the military person? While you were just standing out on the curb somewhere?
FRAZIER: In the area there while we was standing, out on the curb and saw the military guy that was standing on the curb before. And i knew this guy was the person that they- but, uh, what I seen on the curb was what I had seen before. And I knew that they would- that they would come there- come around for a period of time and then the, uh, person that appeared yesterday- they appeared right away. But, I know that they were right there- they would come there. I knew they would come there.
MORIARTY: And where you're going with this, uh- you, I understand- but, uh- but you had seen- had seen and heard from some person you witnessed there. And then by virtue of, uh, some talk with people, I guess, standing out in the street. And then the extortion or some sort of danger. And you were kind of standing- standing around just looking at things. So we could appreciate it a little better.
FRAZIER: OK, sir, out in the main street, we was actually where was, uh- we was standing out with the police and we- I'm sure that some people were completely with, uh- on the curb there where the assassination occurred. So it looked like a circle, you know, where all these people were- they were around or was either there or was trying to make them so that- to make them lose their expressions so to make the President's assassination had no explanation for them.
Frazier later recounts (TAPE 3, p. 4) that "And I went on down to the basement. Set down and make my (parking) there and sat there and eat my lunch." His 1964 testimony put him there at 12:35.
I recorded this at the Archives when I visited in 2011. This particular cassette was among the clearest of the worn white-noise laden recordings. A few months later, in winter, I acquired a free 30-day trial of professional sound-editing software and painstakingly retrieved what excerpts from 1977 that I could salvage. About 2 hours of the 4-hour interview were beyond repair. And I wrote about this on p. 50 of my 2015 essay Inside Job. Although the HSCA's Jack Moriarty mentioned giving the 4-hour Frazier interview to a secretary for transcription, no transcript has ever been made public by the Archives.
Frazier didn't say anything about this loading-dock sighting in 1977. He is an admitted amateur researcher, and in 2002 added a piece of disinformation onto the Oswald narrative that no one will ever be able to corroborate. He did this in order to get himself in the good graces of conspiracy researchers; by doing so he deflected attention away from Eddie Shields' HSCA allegation that Frazier had dropped Oswald off at the building that morning (which meant his testimony about Oswald carrying a package ahead of him through the railyards was a complete fabrication) and away from his being alone in the basement when the elevators lost their power, during the 1st minute of the police search (meaning that Frazier was the one who cut off the elevator power). Neither Shields' allegation nor the elevator power shutoff were mentioned in Frazier's 2021 book Steering Truth.
Brian, your entire reconstruction for how the two Oswalds crossed paths in the lobby is based upon Frazier's faulty 2002 allegation, and Armstrong's mistaken interpretation of Mrs. Reid's clothing description.
As far as your reluctance to admit that Adams & Styles couldn't have made it from their 4th-floor office window to the 4th-floor staircase in 10 seconds- did you even bother to look at my diagram on p. 20 of Two Big Problems with the Passenger Elevator? They traveled twice as far as you have imagined ( a bee-line) and they did this in 3-inch high heels, not Nike track shoes.
It is ludicrous to thereby maintain that they made it downstairs in 50 seconds... (in which case, by the way, they would have been seen across the warehouse floor by Truly & Baker at the will-call counter) ... and were what drew Oswald to the vestibule window, where he was soon seen "slack-jawed" by Officer Baker.
On the contrary, Oswald may have been right at the vestibule window as part of his post-assassination assignment. Or he may have heard Truly yelling for the elevator or thumping up the wooden stairway.
Mark Twain observed that it is easier to fool someone than to get them to admit that they have been fooled. And it may take years to get you away from this line of thinking that has Frazier's disinformation and a faulty Adams/Styles timeline at its heart.
My own opinion as to why Oswald was assigned to the 2nd-floor lunchroom was to play his role in the plot- to intentionally divert Officer Baker's attention from the descending west freight elevator. Oswald wasn't "slack-jawed" at all- on cue, he flinched away from the window suspiciously, and drew Baker into the lunchroom.
It made for a more effective patsy, to give him a critical role in the plot.
This ignores Frazier's 1977 HSCA interview, in which he recounted he'd been "standing out on the curb... standing out with the police" after the shooting sequence, where there was a military man he'd seen the day before. This 1977 transcript used to be posted at ROKC; I haven't visited there in several years and have no idea if it is still available.
WESLEY FRAZIER TAPE 2, p. 1:
MORIARTY: You were saying- where you were when you saw the police and the military person? While you were just standing out on the curb somewhere?
FRAZIER: In the area there while we was standing, out on the curb and saw the military guy that was standing on the curb before. And i knew this guy was the person that they- but, uh, what I seen on the curb was what I had seen before. And I knew that they would- that they would come there- come around for a period of time and then the, uh, person that appeared yesterday- they appeared right away. But, I know that they were right there- they would come there. I knew they would come there.
MORIARTY: And where you're going with this, uh- you, I understand- but, uh- but you had seen- had seen and heard from some person you witnessed there. And then by virtue of, uh, some talk with people, I guess, standing out in the street. And then the extortion or some sort of danger. And you were kind of standing- standing around just looking at things. So we could appreciate it a little better.
FRAZIER: OK, sir, out in the main street, we was actually where was, uh- we was standing out with the police and we- I'm sure that some people were completely with, uh- on the curb there where the assassination occurred. So it looked like a circle, you know, where all these people were- they were around or was either there or was trying to make them so that- to make them lose their expressions so to make the President's assassination had no explanation for them.
Frazier later recounts (TAPE 3, p. 4) that "And I went on down to the basement. Set down and make my (parking) there and sat there and eat my lunch." His 1964 testimony put him there at 12:35.
I recorded this at the Archives when I visited in 2011. This particular cassette was among the clearest of the worn white-noise laden recordings. A few months later, in winter, I acquired a free 30-day trial of professional sound-editing software and painstakingly retrieved what excerpts from 1977 that I could salvage. About 2 hours of the 4-hour interview were beyond repair. And I wrote about this on p. 50 of my 2015 essay Inside Job. Although the HSCA's Jack Moriarty mentioned giving the 4-hour Frazier interview to a secretary for transcription, no transcript has ever been made public by the Archives.
Frazier didn't say anything about this loading-dock sighting in 1977. He is an admitted amateur researcher, and in 2002 added a piece of disinformation onto the Oswald narrative that no one will ever be able to corroborate. He did this in order to get himself in the good graces of conspiracy researchers; by doing so he deflected attention away from Eddie Shields' HSCA allegation that Frazier had dropped Oswald off at the building that morning (which meant his testimony about Oswald carrying a package ahead of him through the railyards was a complete fabrication) and away from his being alone in the basement when the elevators lost their power, during the 1st minute of the police search (meaning that Frazier was the one who cut off the elevator power). Neither Shields' allegation nor the elevator power shutoff were mentioned in Frazier's 2021 book Steering Truth.
Brian, your entire reconstruction for how the two Oswalds crossed paths in the lobby is based upon Frazier's faulty 2002 allegation, and Armstrong's mistaken interpretation of Mrs. Reid's clothing description.
As far as your reluctance to admit that Adams & Styles couldn't have made it from their 4th-floor office window to the 4th-floor staircase in 10 seconds- did you even bother to look at my diagram on p. 20 of Two Big Problems with the Passenger Elevator? They traveled twice as far as you have imagined ( a bee-line) and they did this in 3-inch high heels, not Nike track shoes.
It is ludicrous to thereby maintain that they made it downstairs in 50 seconds... (in which case, by the way, they would have been seen across the warehouse floor by Truly & Baker at the will-call counter) ... and were what drew Oswald to the vestibule window, where he was soon seen "slack-jawed" by Officer Baker.
On the contrary, Oswald may have been right at the vestibule window as part of his post-assassination assignment. Or he may have heard Truly yelling for the elevator or thumping up the wooden stairway.
Mark Twain observed that it is easier to fool someone than to get them to admit that they have been fooled. And it may take years to get you away from this line of thinking that has Frazier's disinformation and a faulty Adams/Styles timeline at its heart.
My own opinion as to why Oswald was assigned to the 2nd-floor lunchroom was to play his role in the plot- to intentionally divert Officer Baker's attention from the descending west freight elevator. Oswald wasn't "slack-jawed" at all- on cue, he flinched away from the window suspiciously, and drew Baker into the lunchroom.
It made for a more effective patsy, to give him a critical role in the plot.