Scotish independence

[Malcolm John]

And you don't think its accurate to say there is no or negligible democratic deficit in England? England, as an entity, almost always gets the government it votes for, and has never in history had a government it overwhelmingly voted against. Wales usually doesn't get the government it voted for, Scotland usually doesn't, Northern Ireland never does, and all three regularly get governments they overwhelmingly rejected at the ballot box. I don't think people outside the UK actually understand what the UK is and how politics works, thats why you get attitudes like yours whenever this issue is raised. The UK is not one country, it is four countries or three and a territory joined together in political union, one of those countries has democracy, the other three do not.

Again, IMO, an oversimplistic and naive political view - and nothing of Deep Political nor historical reality woven in. As I said before, I don't think the UK as a whole, nor its constituent parts - any of them - have nor will have much democracy. You seem to think the system 'works' as the propaganda states. I'm not interested in debating such a completely alien idea. You may have fallen for their lies and propaganda - or have not fully analyzed history and political events. The elites in England [and elsewhere] call the shots [sometimes literally] and the populace's voting get them a sham democracy, a very partial faux democracy at best - really an Oligarchic system with voting to fool the people. I'd suggest you look at the archived posts on this forum on topics of interest....

I don't agree at all thats its overly simplistic, I agree there are powerful forces at work etc, and they effect everything, but nations and countries are empowered to determine within certain parameters their own foreign, social and economic policy, that is true, that is what we want in Scotland and that is what we don't currently have and never could as part of the UK.

I think you need to give up your obsession with deep politics and elites as far as this issue is concerned cause its totally unrelated, and if you believe in that stuff it should be the most obvious thing in the world to support Scottish independence as that was a movement opposed to these forces it was a working class, left-leaning, liberal revolution that was quashed by the elites, I simply think its a case of people outside the UK having no understanding of it at all, thats why you get people saying things like have been said to me on this thread, you just don't get it and aren't in an informed enough position to comment.