Anthony Summers

[Jim DiEugenio]

Well I guess no one here has read Reclaiming Parkland.

Which kind of hurts really. I mean discussing a 30 year old museum piece instead of a brand new book?

Peter Scott was wrong when he said the first intimation of LHO and the Walker shooting came from the West German paper.

The first person to hint at this was Michael Paine.

I could not fit everything about the Paines into Destiny Betrayed. So I added about six more pages, most of it concerning the Walker shooting, into RP. I think this stuff has never appeared in book form before. Certainly not in any version of Summers' book. When you combine Paine's comments for a newspaper with RUth Paine's production of the so called Walker note, I mean how can anyone not think they are as fishy as two trouts? Especially since there is no way in the world Oswald shot at Walker. To believe that one has to think that 1.) The bullet changed color and calibre en route to the target, or 2.) Oswald had a rifle which fired 30.06 ammo. Sorry, no sale. And Marina has as much credibility as Brennan.

BTW, Martino's stuff is essentially all second and third hand. And it is not nearly as specific as Nagell's. Who I think is a much better witness.

[Vasilios Vazakas]

Well I guess no one here has read Reclaiming Parkland.

Which kind of hurts really. I mean discussing a 30 year old museum piece instead of a brand new book?

Peter Scott was wrong when he said the first intimation of LHO and the Walker shooting came from the West German paper.

The first person to hint at this was Michael Paine.

I could not fit everything about the Paines into Destiny Betrayed. So I added about six more pages, most of it concerning the Walker shooting, into RP. I think this stuff has never appeared in book form before. Certainly not in any version of Summers' book. When you combine Paine's comments for a newspaper with RUth Paine's production of the so called Walker note, I mean how can anyone not think they are as fishy as two trouts? Especially since there is no way in the world Oswald shot at Walker. To believe that one has to think that 1.) The bullet changed color and calibre en route to the target, or 2.) Oswald had a rifle which fired 30.06 ammo. Sorry, no sale. And Marina has as much credibility as Brennan.

BTW, Martino's stuff is essentially all second and third hand. And it is not nearly as specific as Nagell's. Who I think is a much better witness.

I have just received it so i have not read it yet, but i will soon. I will add it to my list of books for Marc Ellis.

[Vasilios Vazakas]

Marc

While discussing Summer's book you refer to Destiny Betrayed and McAdams site.
Now, someone who does not know much about the research community might think
that Summers, McAdams and DiEugenio have the same value, that they are of equal importance.
Which clearly is not the case. McAdams is a waste of time and you have to listen to the experienced
members of this site and stop reading him, is full of disinfo. If you want to learn more about McAdams
visit http://www.ctka.net/2013/mcadams.html and http://www.ctka.net/2013/mcadams_2.html.
So if you want to learn more about the JFK assassination drop McAdams, Summers book is nothing great either (apart what is based in Bill Kelly's work which is good) and read some good books. I can propose some of them which is i have read. There are other great books which i have not read. You have already read Destiny Betrayed, so:

Oswald and the CIA by John Newman
JFK and Vietnam by John Newman
A Certain Arrogance by G.M. Evica
Deep Politics I & II by Peter Dale Scott
The Man who Knew too Much by Dick Russell
Harvey and Lee by John Armostrong
Battling Wall Street by Donald Gibson
A Breach of Trust by Gerald McKnight
JFK and the Unspeakable by Jim Douglass
The Last Investigation by Gaeton Fonzi

it was never my intention to imply they were equal. McAdams' style is to argue a point
and then do a victory dance whether he has proven his point or not.

But my question about Walker came from reading Summers', not McAdams.

Marc, you did exactly that. Instead of writing in bold the following
Now, someone who does not know much about the research community might think
that Summers, McAdams and DiEugenio have the same value, that they are of equal importance. Which clearly is not the case.

you should have done it this way: Now, someone who does not know much about the research community might think that Summers, McAdams and DiEugenio have the same value, that they are of equal importance. Which clearly is not the case.

[Marc Ellis]

Well I guess no one here has read Reclaiming Parkland.

Which kind of hurts really. I mean discussing a 30 year old museum piece instead of a brand new book?

Peter Scott was wrong when he said the first intimation of LHO and the Walker shooting came from the West German paper.

The first person to hint at this was Michael Paine.

I could not fit everything about the Paines into Destiny Betrayed. So I added about six more pages, most of it concerning the Walker shooting, into RP. I think this stuff has never appeared in book form before. Certainly not in any version of Summers' book. When you combine Paine's comments for a newspaper with RUth Paine's production of the so called Walker note, I mean how can anyone not think they are as fishy as two trouts? Especially since there is no way in the world Oswald shot at Walker. To believe that one has to think that 1.) The bullet changed color and calibre en route to the target, or 2.) Oswald had a rifle which fired 30.06 ammo. Sorry, no sale. And Marina has as much credibility as Brennan.

BTW, Martino's stuff is essentially all second and third hand. And it is not nearly as specific as Nagell's. Who I think is a much better witness.

I have just received it so i have not read it yet, but i will soon. I will add it to my list of books for Marc Ellis.

No need thanks. I just bought it.

I hadn't been interested because I thought it was about the movie & post-assassination events at the hospital. I'm more interested in the events leading to the assassination. I just read the review on CTKA. And I have been interested in a detailed rebuttal to Bugliosi, which apparently what 'Reclaiming Parkland' is in part. So it's next up after I re-read Summers' section I* again.

I'm impressed with Summers' opening section* and the chapters in it about Oswald in the TSBD. He has me thinking Oswald wasn't even on the 6th floor. Maybe that's old stuff. But it's a new angle for me.

(*I. Dallas - Open and Shut Case)

[Tracy Riddle]

Sorry, Jim, between a full time job and other responsibilities I only have so much time to read. I also have a lot of other subjects I'm interested in besides the JFK assassination.

[Tracy Riddle]

Ok, reviewing my notes I see in the Houston Chronicle on 11/24/1963: "....Mrs. Paine said she had never heard Oswald speak harshly of either Kennedy or Gov. John Connally. Marina once told me she liked the President very much - thought he was a very fine and wonderful person. She said nothing Lee had ever said was derogatory. He expressed some dissatisfaction with Gen. (Edwin A.) Walker, which would be more in keeping with his left-wing views.'"

This was after Walker's phone interview with the German newspaper on 11/23. I'm not aware of any story in the press where Michael Paine talked about Walker.

[Jim DiEugenio]

Tracy, the West German article was printed on November 29th and the date I found for the actual interview was the 24th. THis is important since Walker disputed what he said to the reporter.

Further, Carol Hewitt found a comment on November 23rd in the Houston Post b Michael Paine about Oswald and the Walker murder. (RP, p. 83)

[Dawn Meredith]

Marc,

Remember, the allegation that Oswald shot at Walker comes exclusively from Marina. Despite this, much of the research community now believes Oswald was the shooter. There is no "evidence" that connects Oswald to the shooting, outside of the fact that Marina said he did it. Oswald didn't shoot JFK, he didn't shoot Tippit, and he didn't attempt to shoot Walker.

Can this possibly be true? That much of the research community believes this? I don't even trust that Marina really said it. Then again she changed her story a lot, and was also mistranslated a lot.

Dawn

[Don Jeffries]

Dawn,

I guess that's just my impression, from years of reading posts on Lancer, the EF, etc. Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems like a lot of posters just accept that he shot at Walker, just like they accept that he ordered the Carcano as Hidell, or that the backyard photos are legitimate. Marina still has a lot of support in the research community.

Then again, I'm often known to be too cynical....

[Peter Lemkin]

Dawn,

I guess that's just my impression, from years of reading posts on Lancer, the EF, etc. Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems like a lot of posters just accept that he shot at Walker, just like they accept that he ordered the Carcano as Hidell, or that the backyard photos are legitimate. Marina still has a lot of support in the research community.

Then again, I'm often known to be too cynical....

Don't count me in that 'lot of posters'. I don't think that Oswald [the one we saw silenced by Ruby with the help of the DPD] shot at any human to harm them - at anytime....
As a human who's been through 'a hell of a LOT', I feel for Marina, and even consider her a friend, with whom I've exchanged letters and had conversations in person. That said, I do NOT believe all she has said over time - especially in the first years after Dallas... She has even hinted to me (and others) that she said many things 'under duress' and 'in a state of confusion'...but she won't speak directly to which things, or what the truth she knows would be. Sadly. We can hope she will. I think she's still afraid of what would happen to her and her daughters if she spoke the truth and corrected the record of her wrongful statements of 'fact'.