What part of the evidence persuades you that William Pitzer was murdered?
Allan
According to Kim Reinholt back in 2004, Dennis David describes what he saw and how he saw it... and then fills out a face sheet related to the injuries he says he saw...
Given that he did NOT see the body... and is able to describe pretty well what he saw and how it matched the Dallas description... I guess the question is
Where did the 16mm film come from? Hand held ? (re:CCTV - According to Dr. Joseph Humes, Pitzer was not present at the autopsy. However, he admitted that the Bethesda Naval Hospital was equipped with closed-circuit television. This was the responsibility of Pitzer and over the years had used these facilities to make instructional movies. It is therefore possible that Pitzer had secretly made a 16-mm movie film of the autopsy on President Kennedy's body, without being present in the autopsy room when it was carried out.)
A fixed position camera above the autopsy tables SHOULd assist with the teaching school aspect of Bethesda... and would be turned on with the flick of a switch...
I've read and enjoyed both men's contributions to our understanding... but to say that Pitzer committed suicide seems to me a bit naive.
===========
(an interesting note from which Allen starts his paper on "Murder of Suicide" is the statement from the autopsy doctor #1... "No autopsy report has been prepared and one will not be prepared for at least a week, as it will be that long BEFORE THE BRAINWILL HARDEN ENOUGH FOR A COMPLETE EXAMINATION." (my emphasis)
Didn't they find that the brain examined appeared as if it had been in formalin for 2 weeks? )
===========
So this is you concluding it was MURDER? or SUICIDE?
DJ
TO CONCLUDE
As described in detail before (1), physical evidence relating to the death of Lt. Cmdr. William B. Pitzer is consistent with homicide and inconsistent with suicide. The Cold Case Squad of the NCIS will review the case in the near future. In his testimony for the ARRB, Dr. Humes stated that the autopsy room at the Bethesda Naval Hospital was equipped with closed-circuit television. Pitzer's specialty was closed-circuit television and its applications, and he collaborated with Dr. Humes in the production of instructional movies that were made on videotape then transferred to movie film. Therefore, the facilities were available and Lt. Cmdr. Pitzer had the expertise to produce a 16-mm movie film of the autopsy on President Kennedy's body, without being present in the autopsy room, on the evening of 11/22/63. This may be as close as Dennis David will come to having his story corroborated.
And from the "Murder or Suicide" paper you compiled:
The technician summarized her/his findings as, "Examination of (the) paraffin cast(s) reflected no substance characteristic of, or which could be associated with, gunpowder or gunshot residue."
However, the back of the right hand had "large amounts of blood, skin and hair."
No additional wounds are noted on the right side of the head and no powder burns of the skinsurrounding the area are noted.
[ATTACH=CONFIG]4935[/ATTACH]
[ATTACH=CONFIG]4936[/ATTACH]
Once in a while you get shown the light
in the strangest of places if you look at it right..... R. Hunter
What part of the evidence persuades you that William Pitzer was murdered?
Allan
"Reasonable minds can differ" but its still a fact that the earth is not flat.
There is no credible evidence that Pitzer was murdered.
There is no credible evidence that Pitzer was in the autopsy room on the night of the autopsy. He was not there.
There is no credible evidence that he filmed the Bethesda autopsy with 16mm motion picture camera.
There is no credible evidence that there was a video hookup to the autopsy room, or that a secret film was made of the autopsy; or that Pitzer had access to some secret film.
Thanks to the FOIA docs, there is credible evidence that this was --unfortunately--a suicide, and quite unrelated to anything having to do with the events of 11/22/63.
There are, apparently,a lot of people who have more invested in urban myths than in facing the sad truth about Pitzer, his state of mind at the end of his life, and his death. . .
. . and that includes his son, with whom I was in communication back in the 90s, and who dearly wanted to believe his father was murdered.
I agree with your stipulations regarding evidence of homicide.
The "government" has been extraordinarily helpful in providing "credible evidence" Lee Harvey Oswald fired at General Edwin Walker (though the target protested the bullet had been switched and Oswald was neither two men nor able to drive two vehicles;
that Lee Harvey Oswald killed President Kennedy with a CGI weapon firing projectiles from Dreamworks having been elsewhere than the "lair" and presenting negative for barium and antimony (no matter AEC Oak Ridge tested seven shooters of the famous fascist-killing Mannlicher Carcano, all seven presenting as positive);
that Lee Harvey Oswald killed Officer J.D. Tippit, though the "killer" was again absent, yet fired automatic shells from a revolver with a defective firing pin he never received.
It is therefore patently obvious that what Dennis David saw was not a hand cranked 16mm editor nor black and white photos of JFK's autopsy but souvenirs of Paramount Studios, not in the office of Commander William Pitzer but in some broom closet huffing ammonia from a bucket.
I submit that when documents and evidence are held by a government agency in matters relating to The Crime of the Twentieth Century out of the public's sight for decades, what is produced in the fashion of deus ex machina is every bit as "credible" as the rest of the Big Lie, Lone Gunman, Magic Bullet bull.
Credible as an adjective repeated a thousand thousand times is a hobgoblin of a nothing-to-see-here blinkering.
There's no "credible evidence" of a shooter anywhere but the official location in the Potemkin Confusatory.
"Credible Evidence" pertaining to that which is compiled and presented by the investigative bodies of the US government, is a pure oxymoron right up there with "Military Intelligence"
or the "credible evidence" that the hole in the windshield was not a hole and here is the proof... right there... in the can... see it??
Goes with that other credible evidence there was no hole... the FBI and SS said so...
Who you gonna believe... us or your lying eyes.... :banghead:
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Mr. DULLES - You don't have the windshield here today, though?
Mr. SPECTER - No, we do not.
Mr. DULLES - It would be the same windshield that the Commission saw.
Mr. SPECTER - We can establish it through the witness, too. Mr. Frazier, for that purpose can you identify what is depicted in a
photograph heretofore identified as Commission Exhibit 351?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir; this is a photograph of the very small pattern of cracks in
the windshield which was on the Presidential limousine at the time I examined
it, and which I also later examined in the FBI laboratory.
(Discussion off the record.) you think they talked about where the windshiled was/is and whether Frazier was there when the glass was removed and cracked more....
and this one... yet the one above is from one side while this one here is from the other... (I had to reverse the one below to match it to the linked one)
From this CREDIBLE EVIDENCE we get an ID of the windshield...
nice.
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Once in a while you get shown the light
in the strangest of places if you look at it right..... R. Hunter
What part of the evidence persuades you that William Pitzer was murdered?
Allan
"Reasonable minds can differ" but its still a fact that the earth is not flat.
There is no credible evidence that Pitzer was murdered.
There is no credible evidence that Pitzer was in the autopsy room on the night of the autopsy. He was not there.
There is no credible evidence that he filmed the Bethesda autopsy with 16mm motion picture camera.
There is no credible evidence that there was a video hookup to the autopsy room, or that a secret film was made of the autopsy; or that Pitzer had access to some secret film.
Thanks to the FOIA docs, there is credible evidence that this was --unfortunately--a suicide, and quite unrelated to anything having to do with the events of 11/22/63.
There are, apparently,a lot of people who have more invested in urban myths than in facing the sad truth about Pitzer, his state of mind at the end of his life, and his death. . .
. . and that includes his son, with whom I was in communication back in the 90s, and who dearly wanted to believe his father was murdered.
DSL
7/2/13; 3:40 PM PDT
Los Angeles, California
Hi David,
I remain agnostic on the Pitzer cause-of-death issue. If you haven't done so already, could you please reconcile Dennis David's claim of viewing 16 mm film of the autopsy in Pitzer's office with your "suicide" conclusion?
What part of the evidence persuades you that William Pitzer was murdered?
Allan
"Reasonable minds can differ" but its still a fact that the earth is not flat.
There is no credible evidence that Pitzer was murdered.
There is no credible evidence that Pitzer was in the autopsy room on the night of the autopsy. He was not there.
There is no credible evidence that he filmed the Bethesda autopsy with 16mm motion picture camera.
There is no credible evidence that there was a video hookup to the autopsy room, or that a secret film was made of the autopsy; or that Pitzer had access to some secret film.
Thanks to the FOIA docs, there is credible evidence that this was --unfortunately--a suicide, and quite unrelated to anything having to do with the events of 11/22/63.
There are, apparently,a lot of people who have more invested in urban myths than in facing the sad truth about Pitzer, his state of mind at the end of his life, and his death. . .
. . and that includes his son, with whom I was in communication back in the 90s, and who dearly wanted to believe his father was murdered.
DSL
7/2/13; 3:40 PM PDT
Los Angeles, California
Hi David,
I remain agnostic on the Pitzer cause-of-death issue. If you haven't done so already, could you please reconcile Dennis David's claim of viewing 16 mm film of the autopsy in Pitzer's office with your "suicide" conclusion?
Many thanks.
David (DSL) - as you know from our discussions at the EF that I think very highly of Best Evidence, so I hope you won't be offended if I ask how you can disregard the testimony of Dennis David in regard to the Pitzer case, when his testimony was so important in the development of Best Evidence?
Charles - can we separate the question of whether or not DD viewed 16mm film of the autopsy, from the question of Pitzer's death? I realise that obviously they are related questions, but you almost seem to make them mutually exclusive in your question to DSL.
Martin White Wrote:Charles - can we separate the question of whether or not DD viewed 16mm film of the autopsy, from the question of Pitzer's death? I realise that obviously they are related questions, but you almost seem to make them mutually exclusive in your question to DSL.
Martin
Hi Martin,
I'll agree that my question was other than artfully posed. Perhaps I can do better.
If we are able to conclude that DD in fact viewed a 16 mm JFK autopsy film in Pitzer's presence with the understanding that Pitzer had shot the footage, then we move closer toward the establishment of a motive for Pitzer's murder.
If we are able to conclude that DD was lying about his experience and knowledge of the film and its origin, then our understanding of the circumstances of Pitzer's death is neither enhanced nor diminished.
Pitzer very well could have shot the film, showed it to DD, and later committed suicide.
DD very well could have been lying through his teeth, and Pitzer nonetheless was murdered.
At this stage of the game, it's all about discovering and evaluating evidence.
03-12-2013, 06:09 PM (This post was last modified: 03-12-2013, 06:35 PM by Albert Doyle.)
Quote: " World renowned forensics expert Professor Herbert L. MacDonnell wrote a detailed report which concluded, "Based upon the agreement of the four above points, I conclude that William Bruce Pitzer's death was the result of a self-inflected gunshot wound. It is almost impossible that someone could have shot him and accidentally done so within the above considerations." "
This statement is meaningless when one considers that a CIA "suicide" would produce the exact same results. We have evidence to believe this was so through Dan Marvin. As David Josephs pointed out, the exact same thing could be said of the Warren Commission evidence of Lee Harvey Oswald's guilt. I'm surprised a person who calls themselves a Commission critic would enter such a loose proposition without recognizing this.
Quote:You know, MacDonnel does know his stuff. Seriously. As does Dr. Cyril Wecht who said "...this has all the characteristics of a suicidal wound." I'm not gonna question these two men who are both brilliant at what they do and both extremely independent minded. There is no known forensic evidence of murder. Period.
Again, this is so loose as to be unenterable. I'm sure if you approached Wecht with all the information he would reconsider and say the evidence also allows a CIA "suicide". I think the overt bias of this argument excludes it alone. Again, the simple answer to this is expert CIA "suicide" would produce the suicide wounds Wecht identified. These comments are only effective if you pose them in a way that is trying to force a suicide result. Otherwise they are easily gotten around by the greater evidence. They are, basically, reasonable doubt defense lawyer arguments that are noticeably unseeking.
[B]
Quote:Go ahead. Find credible witness testimony to place him there. Find a single document that places him at Bethesda that night. Then find evidence that he was filming the autopsy.
This is ridiculous because we know Pitzer was called in. I think we can pull the curtain back from the man behind the curtain here by asking Martin to show us one witness or any evidence that places Pitzer anywhere else. This strict proof argument gets a little ridiculous when you consider how much circumstantial evidence and witnessing puts him there. To argue otherwise is to take the denier position that everybody else is lying. What Martin never stops to realize is that this lack of evidence for a man who was there perfectly matches other cases of evidence where FBI erased things that were damaging to them. Does Martin ever stop to consider that this lack of witnessing for Pitzer makes it more likely he was in his office filming remotely?
[B]
Quote:Harold Rydberg wrote: [B]"His wife stated "he loved the military, and would never think of committing suicideon a military base, that would be embarrassing to the military and to his career." However, I stand by my theory of loss of identity with upcoming retirement fromthe military, and complications of his making. He was a walking poster for themilitary. He was looked up to all who knew him. There were signs of suicide: on the evening he was last seen he was not neat andtidy; shooting the pistol after a class, even though they were blanks, was irrational;and having a .38 cartridge for the pistol (having signed out blanks), indicatespremeditation."
Ask Mr Hay to put the character defamation against Roger Craig and his alleged suicidal tendencies next to the statement above. In my mind this advantage-taking description of Pitzer is no different than that of Oswald getting a hand gun because he knew the situation in front of him was going to be dangerous. Commander Pitzer was no fool and probably knew witnesses were being killed. He was a dangerous witness, so if he practiced with a gun prior to coming out with government-destroying evidence that is no anomaly. Ask Mr Hay, exactly what practice Pitzer would need to do with a gun in order to shoot himself? What is most obvious here is Mr Hay doesn't practice the same level of scrutiny towards these reckless dismissals as he does the real evidence. Again, I'm surprised any Commission critic would offer such material. Furthermore Dan Marvin's description shows CIA was on to Pitzer before his liquidation. It would be no surprise for Pitzer to be driven to distraction and guns by CIA's usual dirty Gestapo tricks prior to his death like many others. Again, more of a sign of his credibility than anything else when viewed properly.
Quote:You wrote: "In this case we have a man KNOWN to have CCTV in the morgue"
Known how? What documentation do we have of this claim?
Humes referred to it. We have to figure how Dennis David's witnessing a 16mm film works out with that? There is more witnessing here to confirm the CCTV than blindly dismiss it. You have a witness saying it was routinely used for instructional purposes for remote viewers. What right do you have to challenge that otherwise innocuous statement? Humes was also known for letting out guilt-motivated clues like the surgery to the head. Was his mention of the CCTV similar to his protest "Who is in charge here?"
Quote:You wrote: "If you are going to say Pitzer was Suicide, in the face of evidence against such a conclusion if reviewed in the REAL world of cause and effect, I think you must also be calling DD a liar about where Pitzer was that night..."
David could be lying. Or he could be mistaken. It was a very long time before he was asked what he saw that night. Human memory is easily influenced and confused.
Unlikely considering David spoke of Pitzer excitedly pulling him in out of the hallway in order to show him film evidence he was preparing to show the wounds were radically different than those described by the Warren Commission. If indeed Pitzer had films of the covert pre-autopsy he would have a bonanza of evidence of a government crime. But he must have because the covert pre-autopsy is the only place where he could have filmed those wounds. My answer to this is place Mr Hay next to Dennis David and let him explain his problems with him. I think those viewing this event would soon see who had credibility and who didn't. Mr Hay's entry is very weak. There's little possibility that David could 'confuse' such an event.
Quote:You wrote: "Can you point to any questions asked of any of the Bethesda witnesses about whether Pitzer WAS there...
in all my reading I cannot remember anyone being asked about Pitzer"
Which to any sensible detective would raise questions as to why Pitzer was erased? This is actually stronger evidence of Pitzer's credibility than anything else. Mr Hay suggests the Bethesda A/V chief, who was called to the hospital for its most important autopsy, was hiding in the bathroom. From all the evidence it is more likely he either hand-filmed the pre-autopsy with a 16mm camera, or did it remotely from his office without the knowledge of the participants. Either one explains his absence from the attendance roles. We have witnesses who said they were told not to talk about the autopsy proceedings.
Quote:Already addressed this point. The Parkland descriptions were published in numerous books before Dennis David told his story.
So, Dennis David told the truth about the 18:35 delivery of the aluminum shipping casket but then decided to go tripping with a fantastic tale about imaginary wounds in the case of Pitzer? Did friends of Dennis David say he was the kind of person to do this? I know Martin will say the 18:35 delivery was of another veteran, but then he violates his own rule of having evidence for it. In my opinion, at the very minimum Martin has only reinforced the evidence for Pitzer's murder by being unable to refute it with this reckless doubt.
You wrote: "Step one of this evidence is whether the autopsy reveals thetelltale signs of suicide... close contact marks on the skin at the entry pointand powder burns on the hand which fired the pistol..."
World renowned forensics expert Professor Herbert L. MacDonnell wrote adetailed report which concluded, "Based upon the agreement of the four above points, I conclude that William Bruce Pitzer's death was the result of aself-inflected gunshot wound. It is almost impossible that someone could haveshot him and accidentally done so within the above considerations."
1) location of the wound: a shot in the head counts for 25% of this conclusion
2) powder burns around the wound as ascertained from photos... (except the test showed there were no burns there...) The technician summarized her/his findings as, "Examination of (the)paraffin cast(s) reflected nosubstance characteristic of, or which could be associated with,gunpowder or gunshot residue." However, the back of the right hand had "large amounts of blood, skin and hair." [size=12]
3)Trajectory: backward and upward counts for yet another 25%? so 50% of his EXPERT CONCLUSION involves a shot to the head and it rising from front to back.. damn near IMPOSSIBLE to replicate other than suicide, right?
4) a "comfortable" holding angle: here is yet another 25% of the verdict based on how a person WOULD hold a gun most comfortably to kill themselves...
So basically Martin, a shot to the head, from the front, moving upwards from a comfortable hand held position... WITHOUT residue from the shot being either on his right hand or his head is the basis for CONCLUDING that this MUST be suicide rather than murder....
... I've got some real valuable land in Florida... it's undeveloped, unencumbered, completely accessible and ready to be bought... you buying this based on these 4 things?[/SIZE]
I also just found this about MacDonnell... only goes to the potential conclusion that his PAPER in 2008, at the age of 80, may not have been all that supportive of anything.
Sunday,July 7, 2013Herb MacDonnell, Founder of Bloodstain Institute, Convicted http://forensicfraud.blogspot.com/2013/07/herb-macdonnell-founder-of-bloodstain.html This case involves apparent forensic fraud as Dr. MacDonell threatened to disseminate false information (based on a non-existent forensic test) about the second victim using his position of trust and authority as a forensic scientist
You know, MacDonnel does know his stuff. Seriously. As does Dr. Cyril Wechtwho said "...this has all the characteristics of a suicidal wound." I'm not gonna question these two men who are both brilliant atwhat they do and both extremely independent minded. There is no known forensicevidence of murder. Period.
I see that he is very well regarded and very close to the legal profession. If one were to only look at the WCR one can conclude that the assassination has all the characteristics of one man shooting from behind and above...
but we know better now, don't we.Let's see Martin… if the "evil men" were to perform a "murder that looks like suicide"… what evidence would you expect to find?
Can you say Marilyn Monroe or Dorothy Kilgallen?
please address why the 2 tell-tale signs of suicide are not present in this case… NO gunshot residue around the wound OR on his hand. Or whythe pistol is found to the left and rear of the body if he shot himself withhis right hand… Telling me what a doctor said is fine and all…would youlike me to cart out the EXPERTS from the WCR or HSCA who also told us many "truths"that weren't.
You wrote: "Step two of this evidence is tocorroborate that Pitzer did indeed film the autopsy room PRIOR to 8pm"
Go ahead. Find credible witness testimony to place him there. Find a singledocument that places him at Bethesda that night. Then find evidence that he wasfilming the autopsy.
Sorry you feel Dennis David is not credible. Suggesting he learned this via thedescriptions of the wound from Parkland when there is not a singledescription of a gunshot wound to the right temple.. unless you can post one. There was a LEFT TEMPLE HOLE McClellanddescribes… how come DD does not place the hole over the LEFT temple?
Mr. SPECTER - Will you continue, then, Dr. Perry, as to whatyou observed of his condition?
Dr. PERRY - Yes, there was blood noted on the carriage and a large avulsivewound on the right posterior cranium.
I cannot state the size, I did not examine it at all. I just noted the presenceof lacerated brain tissue. In the lower part of the neck below the Adams applewas a small, roughly circular wound of perhaps 5 mm. in diameter from whichblood was exuding slowly. I did not see any other wounds.
You wrote: "Fromwhat I read Pitzer was getting ready to embark on aprivate career and gave no indication of suicidal tendencies."
Harold Rydberg wrote: "His wife stated "he loved the military, andwould never think of committing suicide on a military base, that would beembarrassing to the military and to his career." However, I stand by my theoryof loss of identity with upcoming retirement from the military, andcomplications of his making. He was a walking poster for the military. He waslooked up to all who knew him. There were signs of suicide: on the evening hewas last seen he was not neat and tidy; shooting the pistol after a class, eventhough they were blanks, was irrational; and having a .38 cartridge for thepistol (having signed out blanks), indicates premeditation."
And an interesting THEORY it is…as told by a 3[SUP]rd[/SUP] party.. kinda like DD's words. A 3[SUP]rd[/SUP]party describing a situation that requires Pitzer to have filmed/photographedthe body prior to alteration of the skull… it's good we get to pick and choose who we believe. You wrote:"Martin... we have Benavidas' brother being shot, thinking it was him,cause he SAW someone yet could not be identified as our OSWALD"
Irrelevant. Has nothing to do with the Pitzer suicide. I am sorry the simile was lost on you there Martin. A man known to have seen the Tippit killer has his look alike brother shot for not identifying Oswald (along with a great many other witnesses) while the man who filmed the pre-autopsy surgery tothe top of the skull is "suicided"…
You wrote:"In this case we have a man KNOWN to have CCTV in the morgue"
Known how? What documentation do we have of this claim?
How about the man who performed the autopsy? Gunn: Could you describe in a general waywhat the autopsy room looked like? HUMES: Routinely, at the end of a week, wewould retain the organs from the autopsies of the week. In fact, not only didwe review them there, but there was aclosed-circuit television. They went to Andrews Air Force Base, NIH, and itwas a closed-circuit instruction program.
Humes goes on to tell us that he wishes there was CCTV broadcasting that night… this is the same man who revises the time he first sees JFK from just before 8pm back to 6:45… no CHANCE he is not being truthful about the CCTV that night... You wrote: "who shows the results to his friend DD who in turndescribes the pre-altered wounds exactly."
Years later, after many books have been published on the subject claimingthere was a big difference between what was seen at Parkland and Bethesda.
You wrote: "Why DD has not been removed from the equation has always puzzled me"
It doesn't puzzle me in the slightest. Even about the point he saw and helped deliver the 6:35 metal casket? ok
You wrote: "If you are going to say Pitzer was Suicide, in the face of evidence against such a conclusion if reviewed in the REAL world of cause and effect, I think you must also be calling DD a liar about where Pitzer was thatnight..."
David could be lying. Or he could be mistaken. It was a very long timebefore he was asked what he saw that night. Human memory is easily influencedand confused.
OR, he could be telling the truth. But since everything about this case is on the up-and-up, no reason to think Pitzer was killed… and that "Human memory" BS is just that…voodoo BS. How many movies of dead president's autopsies do you think DD saw in his life Martin? McClelland was mistaken too about the left temple wound? A man 1 foot from thewounds… but since we have no physical evidence, he too is lying along with the Father who delivered last rites?
Next you'll tell us Sirhan did it too ?? does the fact that MacDonnell did not see any of this evidence until 2001 and the rpoert is dated 2008 make a difference to you? He wasn't even there.
You wrote: "Can you point to any questions asked of any of the Bethesdawitnesses about whether Pitzer WAS there...
in all my reading I cannot remember anyone being asked about Pitzer"
IIRC William Matson Law asked some of those interviewed for his book.
So give Martin… what did they say? They don't remember? Did Pitzer even need to be in the room to turn the CCTV camera on or retrieve its output?
Here is what Douglass wrote and his sources: http://www.ratical.org/ratville/JFK/Unspeakable/LtCmdrPitzer.html
You wrote: "Finally - since DD was not in the autopsy room... any idea why he would make this part up about Pitzer?
Or how he would know about the exact location of the wounds?"
Already addressed this point. The Parkland descriptions were published innumerous books before Dennis David told his story.
And as before you will need to offer any evidence that offer PARKLAND descriptions of the wounds other than McClelland's left temple reference. NONE of the other people in Parkland saw a bullet hole in the right temple area…NONE. So please qualify your comment.... See quotes from Nurses in contact with the body below
(Martin, please tell me who saw Dr George Bakeman USN... as he is listed as an attendee of the autopsy... any references to him by anyone else in that room would go a long way to prove how everyone was accounted for... or not. thanks.)
Mr. SPECTER - Did you see any wound anywhere on his body?
Miss HENCHLIFFE - Yes; he was very bloody, his head was very bloody when I sawhim at the time.
Mr. SPECTER - Did you ever see any wound in any other part of his body?
Miss HENCHLIFFE - When I first saw him---except his head.
Mr. SPECTER - Did you see any wound on any other part of his body?
Miss HENCHLIFFE - Yes; in the neck
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Once in a while you get shown the light
in the strangest of places if you look at it right..... R. Hunter
