19-01-2017, 09:10 AM
Tracy Riddle Wrote:David Guyatt Wrote:Tracy Riddle Wrote:David Guyatt Wrote:Given the known quality of the numerous and highly respected independent journalists who have reported on how the IC have tried to smear Trump with false Russian hacking stories and/or gone to war against him using the fabricated MI6 report --- many of them have their articles present in this thread: Chris Hedges, Robert Parry, Glen Greenwald, Patrick Cockburn, Peter Hitchins and Peter Oborne amongst them, and given that the nature of the reporting some are relying on - the now thoroughly discredited partisan group-think NYT's and WaPo for example - then it is exceedingly evident that some of us have shut of their minds and are stubbornly sitting in their ideological sandboxes.
Allow me also to add to the foregoing partial list almost every single intelligence whistleblower I can think of-- Annie Machon's article above being typical I should say.
Altogether it is an array of independent free-thinkers versus the established media and the existing order. So far as I can tell not one of them like or wanted Trump - but they recognise he won the election, and they all also recognise that the US neocon faction (both Democrats and Republicans) want rid of him at any cost, including all the usual intelligence community bag of dirty tricks.
I think for myself, David. I've read these articles, and so far I haven't been overly impressed with their arguments. The basic problem is, you've got a guy (Trump) who is so far up Putin's ass, you'd have to be blind not to see it. But apparently a lot of very smart people are not able or willing to see it.
Has it ever occurred to you that maybe all those smart people are seeing it but you're not, Tracy.
Then, by all means, explain it to this simpleton, David.
Again?
Quote:I haven't heard any real analysis from you - only references to other peoples' articles. I've repeatedly asked people on this forum for some independent thinking and discussion about this subject, but all I get is shallow analysis and "CIA lies! Media lies! USA lies! Julian Assange said it was a leak!" That's it. Very disappointing.
It seems to me you're not actually reading the various reports posted here. You clearly don't much care for the collective views by all the journalists, whistleblowers and former intelligence operatives and experts like William Binney, Ray McGovern, Craig Murray et al - all of whom are well regarded as being independent and objective and some of whom are award winning.
When an important allegation is made it has to be established with evidence or be shot down in flames --- as this one has been shot down in flames countless times: there is no evidence... zilch, nada - that parrot is gone.
Bad milk apart, you ask for my analysis and this is it (and not for the first time either), if you're going to accuse a person, or a nation, of something heinous like this then it is incumbent upon the accusers to support it with clear and tangible evidence.
If you can't do that, then all it's just empty spite - a loser's trick to avoid taking responsibility for running the poorest political campaign in history (so far as I can see, anyway).
So let me ask you again (as I believe I have asked before several times and been ignored):
Provide to this forum now evidence that supports the reports that Russia hacked the DNC. Evidence Tracy, not allegations, not hyperbole and exaggerated partisan rhetoric, not the political spite and deceit we've hitherto seen?
Meanwhile, watch and note the silence deepen as no response to the VIPS call for evidence of Russian interference that Paul posted above yesterday.
The shadow is a moral problem that challenges the whole ego-personality, for no one can become conscious of the shadow without considerable moral effort. To become conscious of it involves recognizing the dark aspects of the personality as present and real. This act is the essential condition for any kind of self-knowledge.
Carl Jung - Aion (1951). CW 9, Part II: P.14