Some Misunderstandings Related to WTC Collapse Analysis

[Jim Hackett II]

The presented tale of the fall of the towers is bogus.

Two reasons present.
First the things I was told by Ironworkers and Operating Engineers that went to NYC on the afternoon of the 11th.
Second, my own observation of the towers fall that day.

Not enough thermal energy was ever available to soften the steel as the fable is told.
I know how much heat and pressure it takes to "rebend" structural steel.
Misfabrication at the shop occurs, it is then the job of the Ironworker to apply the heat and pressure to bend the beam into the proper shape/alignment in the field.

So it is the old Richard Pryor thing, who ya gonna believe "Me or your lying eyes?"

No other story building ever collapsed from internal and sustained fires of paper and wood. Ignited by kerosine quickly consumed.
Not even buildings that burned for DAYS.

So someone rewrote the laws of physics for just that one day.
Or WE WUZ HAD like we were in Sept. 1964 when the WC published their bullcrap.

After these issues came forth I don't pay much attention to 911.
I know when I am being LIED to by my Government.
It has become easier to detect after years of deception.

[Lauren Johnson]

First the things I was told by Ironworkers and Operating Engineers that went to NYC on the afternoon of the 11th.

Hey, Jim. You aren't going to just leave it that are you? What did they say? How did you happen to talk with them?

[Jeffrey Orling]

The presented tale of the fall of the towers is bogus.

Two reasons present.
First the things I was told by Ironworkers and Operating Engineers that went to NYC on the afternoon of the 11th.
Second, my own observation of the towers fall that day.

Not enough thermal energy was ever available to soften the steel as the fable is told.
I know how much heat and pressure it takes to "rebend" structural steel.
Misfabrication at the shop occurs, it is then the job of the Ironworker to apply the heat and pressure to bend the beam into the proper shape/alignment in the field.

So it is the old Richard Pryor thing, who ya gonna believe "Me or your lying eyes?"

No other story building ever collapsed from internal and sustained fires of paper and wood. Ignited by kerosine quickly consumed.
Not even buildings that burned for DAYS.

So someone rewrote the laws of physics for just that one day.
Or WE WUZ HAD like we were in Sept. 1964 when the WC published their bullcrap.

After these issues came forth I don't pay much attention to 911.
I know when I am being LIED to by my Government.
It has become easier to detect after years of deception.

I think you are neither familiar with the design nor understanding where the possible failures may have been. First, there were no columns which were melted or even heated hot enough to bend them. Heat weakens steel and if it weakens it below the service load it buckles and bends from BUCKLING not from plastic deformation. Second the failures in the frame were more likely the CONNECTIONS and they were not as strong as the sections themselves.

I have studied this in great detail for over 4 years and others much longer who are much smarter than I am. The NIST reports for the buildings were wrong... but that does not mean that the correct explanation was CD or placed devices.

I suggest you spend some time here:

http://the911forum.freeforums.org/index....1d9c6a662f

and if you do you'll have a different perspective about the destruction. This is not a site of government shills and apologists for NIST. NIST takes it pretty hard... but not as hard as the CD and truther nonsense. It's a science based site and above the level of most but not always and if you invest the time you will learn something. Even Tony used to post there until his own work was heavily critiqued.

I have produced many slides some of which I have posted here... which I used to think and express my understanding. I am looking for understanding and not to publish or lead a movement... I do not accept the official explanations and I do not accept the CD one and therefore I do not accept the inside job or MIHOP. I don't know who flew the planes, or who put them up to it.. but I believe there were fuel ladened planes which it the towers... and they eventually came down when the aggregate column strength dropped below service load and delivered the huge mass of floors above which flowed down through the towers... leaving the columns below unbraced and unstable and they toppled because of that. I've explained this in the Where did the Towers Go? thread now in the bear pit.

And I've spoken with Ed Depaola who is a partner in the engineering firm Severud who examined the steel in the week after the collapse at the site. His assessment was that the steel suffered fatal loss of strength from heat. Perhaps he was gotten to and he's a liar and now part of the plot. Who knows? He seems like a stand up guy to me.

[Albert Doyle]

military intelligence is a contradiction. The clowns at the top couldn't shoot straight... you give them way way more credit for intelligence and vision than they deserve or have.

You sound as if you aren't aware of the men who act as gods.

[Albert Doyle]

I do not accept the official explanations and I do not accept the CD one and therefore I do not accept the inside job or MIHOP.

You commit a logical flaw because A plus B does not equal C as you contend. You can have an inside job without controlled demolition.

[Jeffrey Orling]

I do not accept the official explanations and I do not accept the CD one and therefore I do not accept the inside job or MIHOP.

You commit a logical flaw because A plus B does not equal C as you contend. You can have an inside job without controlled demolition.

Correct... but not the one the truth movement is pushing.

Would you elaborate on your non CD conception of the inside job?

[Jim Hackett II]

I was a Union Journeyman Ironworker (International Brotherhood of Bridge, Structural and Ornamental Ironworkers)
By Apprenticeship not born into the trade.

That is how I came to know and be part of their experiences.
Operators (Crane) and Ironworkers are thicker than most
as the Operator hold lives in hands, most often Ironworker lives.
They are the best and Ironworkers are the best.

WTC was a war zone in all it's horror.
Not without permission would I talk for them, I did not go to NYC they did.
As heartbreaking as their experiences are (not were).
Suffice to say their observations agree in my opinions above.
And the workers of Steel know steel and its' behavior, we have to.

I have never ever been as proud to be "A Cowboy Of The Sky" as I was on 9-11.
A decade after I quit and fell, still proud not vain.

The Workers that were needed were driving to NYC,
unbidden and UNPAID and
endangered by GWBu$h's EPA LIES.
Consider this point. Above and below.

But they were coming to NYC by the hundreds the same damn day.
Load the truck and git...
they knew who was needed and what was to be done.
Grab the torch and do it. Bring in the main line and lower the boom a taste.
Jargonese for "Get 'er done Can Do".

I will leave it right there.
As the Song says,
More than Nuff Said.
If you ain't walked the high steel, I feel sorry for your ignorance.

[Jeffrey Orling]

I was a Union Journeyman Ironworker (International Brotherhood of Bridge, Structural and Ornamental Ironworkers)
By Apprenticeship not born into the trade.

That is how I came to know and be part of their experiences.
Operators (Crane) and Ironworkers are thicker than most
as the Operator hold lives in hands, most often Ironworker lives.
They are the best and Ironworkers are the best.

WTC was a war zone in all it's horror.
Not without permission would I talk for them, I did not go to NYC they did.
As heartbreaking as their experiences are (not were).
Suffice to say their observations agree in my opinions above.
And the workers of Steel know steel and its' behavior, we have to.

I have never ever been as proud to be "A Cowboy Of The Sky" as I was on 9-11.
A decade after I quit and fell, still proud not vain.

The Workers that were needed were driving to NYC,
unbidden and UNPAID and
endangered by GWBu$h's EPA LIES.
Consider this point. Above and below.

But they were coming to NYC by the hundreds the same damn day.
Load the truck and git...
they knew who was needed and what was to be done.
Grab the torch and do it. Bring in the main line and lower the boom a taste.
Jargonese for "Get 'er done Can Do".

I will leave it right there.
As the Song says,
More than Nuff Said.

Very moving tribute but not grounded in facts or data derived from observation. I was in the WTC hundreds of times, operated a business in their shadow for 6 years and worked for the architects who designed them in 1970... and none of this has anything to do with the facts related to how they collapsed.

[Jim Hackett II]

I prefer the company of my Brothers and Sisters.
Those that can do, do.
Those that can't do bloviate, pontificate and or BS.

Moving tribute that

[Jeffrey Orling]

I prefer the company of my Brothers and Sisters.
Those that can do, do.
Those that can't do bloviate, pontificate and or BS.

Moving tribute that

"Out, out, brief candle! Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player that struts and frets his hour upon the stage and then is heard no more: it is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.... MacBeth