This doesn't mean the limo stopped, since I hit my brakes and the car does not immediately stop. So if they were only on a few frames then the car did not necessarily stop.
But boy, what the heck was Greer doing touching the brakes at a moment like that?
If I have any reason to look back over my right shoulder while I'm driving (as Greer did), I'll hit the brakes. Normally, it's the smart thing to do. I think in this case, Greer just did the "normal" thing instead of following his training.
Whether or not it was intentional, there are a lot of witnesses (see Palamara's article) that speak of a drastic slowdown, near-stop, etc., and they are spread out all over Dealey Plaza. There aren't that many who speak of a full stop. It's hard to know just how hard the braking was. But it certainly looks more accentuated in Muchmore and Nix than in Zapruder -- FWIW.
John Mooney Wrote:Yes, regardless of intention, it does beg the question as to why the limo doesn't appear to slow down in Zapruder.
Maybe that's an illusion? Are there enough background tracking elements to measure speed against?
Well, Alvarez's analysis claims the car slows to 8-10 MPH in the Z film.
Of course, it has been argued that if there were frames removed, then that measurement is invalidated.
I personally have difficulty seeing discontinuity in the car's motion.
But Martin Hay has pointed out that at the point where the brakes are probably engaged, all the occupants of the car actually do move foreward (http://themysteriesofdealeyplaza.blogspot.co.uk), which certainly confirms slowdown, even if not apparent to the naked eye.
With a plan this involved, this intricate, with so much to lose if JFK were to survive the Dealey Plaza ambush, I have difficult time believing Greer was not informed of an alternate duty that day. Carefully trained for it, in fact.
Would the plotters really risk the chance of President Kennedy surviving Dallas by having one Secret Service man doing his job? If Greer speeds out of the Plaza after the first shot, if Kellerman got off his ass and into the back seat to protect his President, JFK survives and the entire world is a different place. (Of course, there were likely alternative scenarios to ensure his death, including agents at Parkland Hospital)
I think it is possible key members of the SS were notified of a threat President Kennedy represented to national security, complete with files and documentation. "It is your duty to country to eliminate this threat to the safety of the United States." The back channel communications with the USSR and Cuba gave the plotters a lot of ammunition to execute their plan and compromise key elements of government in accomplishing their goals.
Did the Sponsors actually believe President Kennedy was a threat to security? That I do not believe.
20-08-2013, 05:47 PM (This post was last modified: 20-08-2013, 08:33 PM by David Josephs.)
There are a number of different clues as to the speed of the limo and the reality of frames being removed from this sequence which actually results in the limo appearing to be going FASTER than it really was...
#1 is the ability of Hill to get from the Queen Mary to the limo in the number of steps and time he does...
with both vehicles traveling at this supposed 8-10 mph... in this composite of frames starting at z316, Hill is about 8 feet from the MOVING limo....
He catches the limo at 337 or just over a second later.
Greer does not break AFTER the shot, but well before the headshot.... the hitting of the brakes was not a result of a shot within a few seconds of z313... nor a result of the shots at 210-224
Here is Greeer starting at z302.. making a physically impossible turn of the head to be facing JFK by 304. The slowing of the limo has already begun...
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We see the same 2 frame head turn after 316 as well - to remove the debris flying back and to the left hitting Hargis.
Yes Albert - frames were removed.. and I have some definite ideas on how and when it was done...
Now back to Hill. Basic Math shows that if the Queen Mary and Limo were moving at 9mph without slowing further...
Hill needs to hit the ground running at 14mph to accomplish catching the limo in the 1.1 seconds, 21 frames offered
Now looking carefully at Muchmore... Hill takes ONE LARGE STEP and gets from the Queen Mary to the Limo.. as if the Limo barely moves at all...
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BREHM expressed his opinion that between the first and third shots, the President's car only seemed to move 10 or 12 feet. It seemed to him that the automobile almost came to a halt after the first shot, but of this he is not certain. After the third shot, the car in which the President was riding increased its speed and went under the freeway overpass and out of his sight.
#2 - If you have or can find the .mov version of the Stable Zfilm (or can run it backwards) go from z425 BACK to Z313 and see the tremendous difference in speed and the slowing/stop from a different POV.
There was no reason for Greer to have slowed once he finished the turn onto Elm... with no one in front of him the limo could have been at z425 speed by z225 or earlier and OUT of the way.
Greer's behavior was not just some reaction to a stimulus... to have slowed to make the wide turn onto Elm and speed up again from 133 thru 220, only to drastically slow again between 220 and the headshot is IMO one of the most obvious signs of SS complicity.
An explanation was offered that he slowed due to the awareness of shots coming from the front... yet once again the role of the SS is to put themselves between the POTUS and harms way.
While we can chalk it up to gut reactions... there was no reason for him to have stared at JFK for almost a full second, until the shot hits him. And then lie about it.
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IMO the limo was not moving more than 2-3 mph... which from many angles would appear as if it was standing still.... a slow walk is 2-3 mph. And since I believe frames were removed, a complete stop (Given what we know about sequential frames showing both fore and back ground in focus) is very likely.
Mr. SPECTER. Now, to the best of your ability to recollect, exactly when did your automobile first accelerate?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Our car accelerated immediately on the time-at the time--this flurry of shots came into it.
Mr. SPECTER. Would you say the acceleration--
Mr. KELLERMAN. Between the second and third shot.
And the FBI model of the shot sequence does indeed show z313 as the SECOND shot... which again suggests they were correct about a shot as late as z375.
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Once in a while you get shown the light
in the strangest of places if you look at it right..... R. Hunter
The much missed Jack White did some work years ago about the yellow stripes that were painted on the curb on the driver's side of Elm Street. The "Kill Zone" for Greer?
So, David, the inevitable question ... but we risk turning this into yet another Z-film thread. I know others have proposed answers to this. Just curious how you would answer it:
If there were frames removed, how do you account for the inter-sprocket-hole images?
(P.S., I've read the Fetzer volumes, including the third, and Horne, so no need to refer me there ...).
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