Is Russia Really The Baddie?

[Lauren Johnson]

Walking away from the addictive illusions of righteous violence can be devastating. I was in Nicaragua 25 years ago on a church mission to help rebuild from Hurricane Mitch devastation. We were working in a small village building cement block houses. We were certainly on the latafundia from the Somoza years. These were Sandinista families that benefited from land reforms. One woman had torn open a bag of USAID corn that had to last her and her children for 2 months. It was wet and it had worms in it. She was drying it out and picking out the worms. These were the people we were trying to kill -- subsistence peasants.

Thanks for your story. BTW did your job keep you busy rigging parachutes? I mean you weren't supporting the airborne invasion of Normandy.

[Fred Steeves]

Walking away from the addictive illusions of righteous violence can be devastating.

It's been a drawn out Saul of Tarsus moment so to speak, and it was certainly traumatic at first. Over the course of 16 years now, I've ever so gradually gone from being a John Bolton type of neocon, yet one who also had a hippie side that liked to dabble in psychedelics, to where now I put myself in the anti war socialist camp. LOL guess which wolf pup ultimately wound up getting fed?


" I was in Nicaragua 25 years ago on a church mission to help rebuild from Hurricane Mitch devastation. We were working in a small village building cement block houses. We were certainly on the latafundia from the Somoza years. These were Sandinista families that benefited from land reforms. One woman had torn open a bag of USAID corn that had to last her and her children for 2 months. It was wet and it had worms in it. She was drying it out and picking out the worms. These were the people we were trying to kill -- subsistence peasants."

OMG I well remember Hurricane Mitch, that thing was a monster! Those poor people, that's awesome you were there to help, you must have many stories. If you like start a new thread, I'd love to hear more of your experience there and learn some things through your eyes. Seriously, first hand experience is invaluable.

Whew... that must give one such a clear eyed look at a besieged people when you're working and living amongst them. What the US did to that country, in the name of defeating the "bad guy commies", is unspeakable. I've never seen the level of poverty you describe.



"Thanks for your story. BTW did your job keep you busy rigging parachutes? I mean you weren't supporting the airborne invasion of Normandy."

Ha, good question. Actually that rating has two names, the full definition is "Aircrew Survival Equipmentman (PR)". The "PR" standing for parachute Rigger". Everybody just used PR for short.
Job Title

While I did learn how to pack parachutes in sport skydiving back in the day, and we also learned the navy way for aircraft parachutes in A school for the rating, the packing duties were/are actually done by a different branch of the same rating. They work at a land based shop, and were technically above us. My branch was out in the field as described, maintaining and inspecting pilot and air crew survival equipment that they wore on them on an ongoing daily basis. The pilots came through our shop coming and going during flight ops, or if they needed something or had a question. The closest my field branch came to the actual parachutes, was making sure on an ongoing basis that the apparatus was properly hooked up to the ejection seat. The ejection seats, whose responsibility beyond that of the parachute apparatus, was of an entirely different shop but with whom we worked closely.

[Fred Steeves]

So here's my problem. After re-watching this year or so old clip of Prof. John Mearsheimer speaking to the history of Russia/Ukraine/NATO tensions and red lines, I've yet to find an information source that can refute his statements beyond the rich resources of western talking points. The narrative machine along with its usual cliche catch phrases like "unprovoked aggression", "Putin's war", "fighting to save democracy" etc.,.

And believe me if there's something staring me right in the face here like the proverbial elephant in the room and I'm somehow missing it, I darn well nearly beg people to show me what and where it is, but nobody has yet to be able to demonstrate a darn thing save for leaning back on those talking points.

The pattern is the same, just expressing itself in a couple or so different ways. Once I challenge any given individual parroting the usual talking points to show me something beyond that, something concrete, the reactions come in three basic forms:

1) Ridicule with nothing to back it up.

2) Ignoring the unanswered questions, move on to a new set of western talking points, while ridiculing the questioner.

3) Just disappear and leave the discussion. Usually after one last point of baseless ridicule, but also often times not as well it just depends.


I've already long decided that the reason for this is there is no solid evidence to put up as a reasoned argument against the points Prof. Mearsheimer puts forth, but the person looking to refute it have leaned so long on these relentless talking points to back their case, that they've come to see these talking points AS the evidence.

And hell man, often enough just the insults alone suffices as the evidence, which happened last evening with one of those old navy pals from 30 years ago I was earlier pointing to. The best evidence he could put forth to prove his 100% support for indefinitely continuing the war was that "I'm one of those that just can't see the forest through the trees", and "if I want to live under Putin's authoritarian regime then I should move to Russia".

Well again, that doesn't tell me a god damn thing, and why is a contrary view of something from an old buddy you haven't talked to in 30 years so triggering that he's compelled to immediately set sail with the personal insults? I even asked him please, do enlighten me and show me something that might make me see the error of my ways.

And that was the end of it, yet again, radio silence when all he had to do was set ole Fred straight on some true facts of this matter. But there we go again, I can only surmise that he's got nothing, otherwise why not proudly lay it out on the table for all to see... And I'd be happy with that, no problemo not even the least bit embarrassed, because I would have learned something in the process.

So anyway, I'm not posting Mearsheimer as actual evidence, just that I've yet to find for myself, nor from anyone else, credible information refuting him.

(6:30 long)

[Lauren Johnson]

Here's another version of Ukraine as a western project:

If you still believe that Russia started this conflict in 2022, then you are either corrupt, ignorant, or brainwashed.

If you don’t know who Victoria Nuland is, or what she was doing in Ukraine in 2014, then you have no idea what’s going on.

The Deep State started this war. It was the Obama CIA/State Dept that funded Nazi militant groups to start a civil war in Ukraine, and initiated regime change to a CIA/State Dept puppet, Yatseniuk.

This was all revealed in the leaked phone call between State Dept diplomats and Deep State agents, Victoria Nuland and Geoffrey Pyatt (link in next post).

After the Maidan coup in February 2014, the US CIA/State Dept owned Ukraine via proxy, and the CIA began using Ukraine as a giant offshore playground for criminal racketeering and money laundering. Ukraine became one giant CIA base, directly on Russia’s border.

Then the US/NATO began building up Ukraine’s army for the sole purpose of one day fighting Russia. The US/NATO began supplying Ukraine with weapons, equipment, missiles, training, intelligence, etc.

Covert elements within the US government, along with their European partners in NATO, used espionage to overthrow and take control of the nation of Ukraine, then built a massive standing army on Russia’s border, then tried to bring Ukraine into NATO, and thus start WW3.

If you are still buying the official MSM narrative about this conflict, you should not be engaged in conversations.

Everything the MSM told you about Ukraine/Russia has been a lie, and in many cases, the inverse of the truth.

[Fred Steeves]

Once upon a time, I steadfastly believed that at some point, desperate people in the west would unite to fend off a common foe. The deep state of course. Now, unfortunately, I no longer harbor such pipe dreams. Not that this is any kind of sudden revelation no, it's been years in the making, all really I'm making mention of is that even though for some time I've realized this was one of the delusions that I've been forced to release to the four winds as the journey continued.

And since that time of release, real world evidence only continues to mount in favor of that life altering, moment in time decision. You know once I had gotten a good long look at what Zionism really is post October 7 and how that sickness permeates our culture, I was (yet again) mistaken in assuming I was beholding our lowest of lows.

But no, almost like witnessing the opening of Pandora's Box, the hits just keep on coming. Now I'm seeing large swats of my home culture recoil in horror over an attempt to end a horrible war in Ukraine. It's like we just can't get enough of seeing other people's children die on the altar of us feeling better about ourselves. It truly sickens me all over again, the old one two punch.

Was a time when the (so called) left in this country protested against war, now its protesting for it. There's a quote by the self educated former slave Fredrick Douglas that I like:

"I would unite with anybody to do right and nobody to do wrong"

Look I don't harbor any illusions that Trump is somehow being altruistic in trying to wind this thing down, in fact I feel fairly certain that the only real reason is the leadership of this new faction in charge has made the final assessment that this attempt to weaken a rival great power has failed, that continuing on will only make matters worse, and they're cutting their losses. It's a business decision. Obviously this faction has an even bigger hate boner for China than the preceding faction had, and they're looking to truly pivot there, but Russia still stands in the way, and I fully expect them to re-address this loose end at the earliest opportunity. Just not now, as their figurehead states "they don't have the cards". 

But for now, whether for the wrong reasons or not, and coming from an administration I despise just as much as the last one, a broken clock is still right twice a day and I'll fully support an end to the carnage if we can get there. 



So coming back full circle on how this post began. If we can never even agree to basic facts about a terrible war, much less never agree that it needs to end like 5 minutes ago, then I see no hope for us. We have the MAGA cult on one side cheering on anything dear leader does even when it's not in their own interest, and a resistance cult on the other side so full of blind rage that they'd just assume see a terrible war kept going, just because their enemy wants it to end.

Never the two shall meet, and between them that makes up just about all of us. And I believe that's by design, but knowing about it does nothing to change it. Just like watching a slow motion train wreck.

[Lauren Johnson]

Sen. Chris Murphy (D-Connecticut, 2014)

In 2014, Senator Chris Murphy bragged about the United States successfully overthrowing Ukraine's government:

"I think it was our role, including sanctions and threats of sanctions, that forced, in part, Yanukovych from office."

"We have not sat on the sidelines. We have been very much involved. Members of the Senate have been there. Members of the State Department have been on the Square."

"The Obama administration passed sanctions. The Senate was prepared to pass its own set of sanctions, and as I've said, I think that the clear position of the United States has, in part, been what has helped lead to this change in regime."

"If, ultimately, this is a peaceful transition to a new government in Ukraine, it will be the U.S. on the streets of Ukraine who will be seen as a great friend in helping make that transition happen."

"There is a U.S. interest here. We are in the middle of negotiating a new trade agreement with Europe. To my state, it's enormously important. We do 40% of our trade in Connecticut with Europe."

"If Ukraine is part of the EU and thus is part of this new trade agreement with the United States, that could result in billions of dollars in new economic opportunities for the U.S."

"So, we do have an economic interest in Ukraine being a part of the EU, and we shouldn't be shy about making that interest clear."

[Peter Lemkin]

Once upon a time, I steadfastly believed that at some point, desperate people in the west would unite to fend off a common foe. The deep state of course. Now, unfortunately, I no longer harbor such pipe dreams. Not that this is any kind of sudden revelation no, it's been years in the making, all really I'm making mention of is that even though for some time I've realized this was one of the delusions that I've been forced to release to the four winds as the journey continued.

And since that time of release, real world evidence only continues to mount in favor of that life altering, moment in time decision. You know once I had gotten a good long look at what Zionism really is post October 7 and how that sickness permeates our culture, I was (yet again) mistaken in assuming I was beholding our lowest of lows.

But no, almost like witnessing the opening of Pandora's Box, the hits just keep on coming. Now I'm seeing large swats of my home culture recoil in horror over an attempt to end a horrible war in Ukraine. It's like we just can't get enough of seeing other people's children die on the altar of us feeling better about ourselves. It truly sickens me all over again, the old one two punch.

Was a time when the (so called) left in this country protested against war, now its protesting for it. There's a quote by the self educated former slave Fredrick Douglas that I like:

"I would unite with anybody to do right and nobody to do wrong"

Look I don't harbor any illusions that Trump is somehow being altruistic in trying to wind this thing down, in fact I feel fairly certain that the only real reason is the leadership of this new faction in charge has made the final assessment that this attempt to weaken a rival great power has failed, that continuing on will only make matters worse, and they're cutting their losses. It's a business decision. Obviously this faction has an even bigger hate boner for China than the preceding faction had, and they're looking to truly pivot there, but Russia still stands in the way, and I fully expect them to re-address this loose end at the earliest opportunity. Just not now, as their figurehead states "they don't have the cards". 

But for now, whether for the wrong reasons or not, and coming from an administration I despise just as much as the last one, a broken clock is still right twice a day and I'll fully support an end to the carnage if we can get there. 



So coming back full circle on how this post began. If we can never even agree to basic facts about a terrible war, much less never agree that it needs to end like 5 minutes ago, then I see no hope for us. We have the MAGA cult on one side cheering on anything dear leader does even when it's not in their own interest, and a resistance cult on the other side so full of blind rage that they'd just assume see a terrible war kept going, just because their enemy wants it to end.

Never the two shall meet, and between them that makes up just about all of us. And I believe that's by design, but knowing about it does nothing to change it. Just like watching a slow motion train wreck.

What a sickening and disingenuous thread and post - misleading and anti-peace, anti-justice, anti-international law, anti-logic. The 'quote' function on this newly reopened Forum is not working. My reply should be above and your post below - but I can't get that to function, so my reply is here below. Everyone wants the War in Ukraine to end (except Putin who only wants it to perhaps pause only until they can regroup and complete their assimilation of a sovereign country). To mislead and hint incorrectly that Democrats or other non-fascist elements of our polity in the US 'don't want the War to end' is a knowing deceptive lie. They desperately want it to end, they ONLY don't want it on Trump's terms, which are the same a Putin's terms - and would not bring peace nor an end to the War - and likely leave Ukraine with 20% of its territory occupied, with the rest of the occupation to be completed soon after Russia recovers from its losses and military break down. No one but the writer or such bull as this is fooled. The idea here that Democrats or 'Democrats-adjacent' don't want an end to the War in Ukraine because they perceive that Trump's Coup Cabal do not is not born out by any evidence. They simply don't want Putin's version of a 'Peace agreement', which seems to be indistinguishable from Trump's Coup Cabal's version of a 'Peace agreement' - as it gives the People of Ukraine and Ukraine nothing and likely tries to make the illegal Russian incursion permanent and Trump moving in to get valuable natural assets in exchange for nothing.
Is Russia the 'Baddie' - hell, yes! To his own people who don't get to vote (for real), are denied democratic freedoms and privileges; where no one can protest in written, spoken, organized or protest form - or they get beaten, arrested, gulaged, poisoned or fall out of windows. Stating that Russia (really Putin and his Oligarchs) are bad actors does NOT make the USA a perfect actor, who has not done its own bad deeds. Most of my own posts on this Forum are critical of US actions or cover-up, covet operations or wars. That said, here at least there is [or at least until Trump 2.0 was] capable of reform within the system or with public protest - even if it is suppressed and has not been much taken advantage of, sadly. We mostly have crap for House and Senate and certainly now, more than even is usual crap for the Executive and Supreme Court, as a whole. No Duma member can bring up a proposal that Putin will not like. Russia illegally [by international law and signed agreements with Ukraine] invaded and is occupying 20% and wanting to occupy 100%. Did the US Intelligence and State Dept. help with the Maidan Protests? I think yes. That was wrong; however, the desire to overthrow one way or another the then pro-Russian President was widely shared in Ukraine, except some Ukrainians in the region that borders Russia. I always thought that internationally monitored plebiscites by small regions of Ukraine bordering Russia, might have been a viable idea - no longer viable. And any nation has the right to maintain its integrity and it could have paid for the moving of those who wanted to be part of Russia, rather than be in a Democratic Ukraine. Perfect Democracy in Ukraine? No! But an almost immeasurably better and reformable one than in Russia at the moment. Putin is a dictator. I live in Prague though am from the US and here have met many Russians who got out recently. Putin kills his opponents and suppresses free expression of political and social views. He back the ultra-conservative Russian Orthodox Church which in turn backs him, so it is also a theocracy of sorts. He wants to re-create a 'greater Russian' something along the lines of the USSR - which is fine if other nations want to and choose to join; but not OK if they are forced by military means or propaganda ops to join against their will. The premise of this thread is, to me, totally off the mark.
Also in this post [the author of which told me in a PM was a critique from the 'Left' [which I see no evidence of - in fact the opposite] there is also some mention of how 'Zionism' has permeates or culture. What is meant is not clear, but I can find no benign or non-sinister way to untangle that paragraph. I happen to be Jewish and am anti-Zionist and Pro-Palestinian, but while the Zionist Colonial Project is widely accepted by both main political party's elites, sadly, most American Jews and I think most Americans are not in favor of 'Zionism' - which is confused and conflated with Israel and Jews in misleading and/or uninformed ways. I'm not going to go into it further here, now. Does the pro-Isreal lobby have undue influence on Congress? Hell, yes! Sadly. Jews both in Israel and especially in the US and elsewhere are primarily anti-'Zionist' in the form you, I think, are using the term [only for Jews - not for Palestinians]. The term used to mean only the right of Jews to return, but was turned into something ugly by the Stern Gang and others, which pushed out the occupants and stole their homes and land - and do so a little more each day (much like Russia is doing in Ukraine now).

[Fred Steeves]

"What a sickening and disingenuous thread and post - misleading and anti-peace, anti-justice, anti-international law, anti-logic."

" Also in this post [the author of which told me in a PM was a critique from the 'Left' [which I see no evidence of - in fact the opposite] there is also some mention of how 'Zionism' has permeates or culture. What is meant is not clear, but I can find no benign or non-sinister way to untangle that paragraph."

You again...

FFS Peter, either learn, or more likely re-learn, how to read a room. you're doing nothing but embarrassing yourself, and this forum. Whether it be deleting threads you happen not to agree with, repeatedly threatening me with the big bad ban hammer via PM, or baselessly demeaning my character on public threads, on any forum I've ever been on you yourself would have been banned by this point with all the ad hominems and harassment.

Come back when you're ready to show a little common courtesy, and base your argument on some actual facts for a change without the constant character assassination. Then we can discuss like rational adults.



Maybe split up your paragraphs just a bit as well, it's not easy reading one big block like that. You should know better.

[Lauren Johnson]

Ukrainian "recruitment" teams indicate strong support for the war effort. To show high motivation is, there are killing teams in the rear for take care of cowards. Summary executions also helps with keeping cowering soldiers in their trenches waiting for a certain death.

https://x.com/GeromanAT/status/1896942032427561064

[Fred Steeves]

An oldie but goodie.

Senators Graham, McCain and Klobuchar taking the fight to Putin, more than 5 years before he (supposedly) just got up one day feeling Hitleresque and with a hunger to take Europe.