Interview with Peter Levenda October 9, 2009 Sinister Forces

[Magda Hassan]

interview w/ peter levenda of 'sinister forces' (October 9, 2009)

1interview w/ peter levenda of 'sinister forces'

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media monarchy: interview w/ peter levenda of 'sinister forces'
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for the last couple of years, the three volume set of 'sinister forces: a grimoire of american political witchcraft' has always been within arm's reach. i've learned that whenever something in the news has reverberations back through the history/mystery of 20th century america, i can just jump to the indices & start to see some of the dots connect...

during the last weekend of september '09, there was a strange confluence of news stories concerning the death of a manson family murderer, the revelations about disturbing sexcrimes in the occult california music scene & then the seemingly sudden arrest of roman polanski for his own infamous sexcrime.

now the polanski polemic, as i've called it, has become perfect fodder for the culture wars: it's middle america vs hollywood. and while the average person may know the water cooler talking points, most of these discussions are long on moralizing & short on the shadowy substance... those "names to conjure with", the "dates that have resonance" & the things "that scream out for an explanation where none can be provided."

one of the most incredible examples: on june 5, 1968, roman polanski & sharon tate attended a dinner party at director john frankenheimer's house where the guest of honor would have his last supper. that guest was robert francis kennedy & he was driven to the ambassador hotel later that night by the director of 'the manchurian candidate'... and, did you know that polanski had john phillips, of the mamas & the papas, investigated for his possible involvement in the murder of sharon tate? ... add to this mix squeaky fromme, scientology, robert evans, west virginia, aleister crowley, disneyland, and of course, the specter that haunts this american house: charles manson.

when i began to see these red flags, i immediately reached out to our guest & author of the amazing 'sinister forces': peter levenda. he has written numerous other books on our hidden history, like his recent 'secret temple: masons, mysteries & the founding of america'. levenda is an authority on these subjects & has also been featured in numerous documentaries concerning the 'unholy alliance' of nazis, the occult & US.

this latest special interview episode from media monarchy - the ninth one, appropriately enough - is a quick, yet fascinating look behind the media mask... behind they face that they present & a glimpse into what it really represents... all this & so much more - just in time for crowley's birthday, the bombing of the moon & halloween.

(featuring intro/outro music by charles manson/beach boys & bed music by bill laswell)


This audio is part of the collection: Open Source Audio

Artist/Composer: media monarchy
Date: 2009-10-09
Source: mediamonarchy.com

[Keith Millea]

Thanks for that Magda.Great interview!I also like the Mediamonarchy page.Many links to other media formats....:tee:

[Jan Klimkowski]

Peter Levenda is very good. Shame about the interviewer, who frequently tosses in red herrings....

Some interesting info about Manson and Scientology, including the claim that Manson's auditor later became a "friend" of Manson Family member, Lynette "Squeaky" Fromme. Fromme of course later achieved additional notoriety as the manchurian patsy failed assassin of President Gerald Ford.

Hmmm.

According to Bugliosi (I know, I know, but his source appears to be prison records so the info may be accurate):

From HELTER SKELTER by Vincent T. Bugliosi:

A staff evaluation written in 1961 mentions that

Manson gave as his claimed religion `Scientologist,' stating that he `has never settled upon a religious formula for his beliefs and is presently seeking an answer to his question in the new mental health cult known as Scientology.'

Scientology, an outgrowth of science-fiction writer L. Ron Hubbard's Dianetics, was just coming into vogue at this time. Manson's teacher, i.e. `auditor', was another convict, Lanier Rayner. Manson would later claim that while in prison he achieved Scientology's highest level, `theta clear'. (ep. 240)

Meanwhile, according to the, ahem, Church of Scientology:

From a Scientology compliance report investigating Manson's possible involvement in Scientology in the wake of the Tate-LaBianca murders. (These were part of documents seized by the FBI from the Church of Scientology in 1977 and subsequently made available through the Freedom of Information act):

GS-C Comm GS-G 22 June 70 D/G Intell U.S.

Dear Mary Sue, COMPLIANCE REPORT

RE: MANSON, BRUCE DAVIS

There have been numerous new developments on this case and they are as follows.

An individual by the name of Steve Grogen appeared on our lines (PM). I received word that he had made statements that he was a member of Mansons family and therefore started some intell. action, which at first consisted of talking to the girls he had been in contact with. By the time I had finished talking to them Grogen had been put away in jail for car theft. In spite of numerous efforts on our part it was impossible to get together with him. I had the girl he seemed to be most in comm with, journey out to the valley on four different occasions to talk to him and in spite of our best efforts he was never made available. He was either "in court" or the jail was undergoing extensive re- decoration. Of course we did not want it known that a member of The Church was trying to see him. At the same time this was going on we received word that two members of the Manson Family "squeeky Frome" and "Sandy Goode" were staying at the Viking Motel on 3rd and Alverado which is in close proximity to the org. We made no efforts to contactthem.

On 18 June 80 the following report was received by me.

Report of interview with Raul Morales, Re: Charles Manson.

According to Raul: Raul arrived in prison on McNeil Island, Washington in 1962 and became a cell mate of Lafayette Raimer allegedly a trained Scientology auditor (about Level I in Raul's estimation) and was introduced to Scientology at that time. Raimer was auditing in prison at that time and in one 10 man cell had managed to gather a group of about 7, all in Scientology. Charles Manson entered later and studied, did TRO etc. along with his cell-mates and received approximately 150 hours of auditing from Raimer. Processes used were CCH's, Help processes (Who have you helped-Who have you not helped) and other Dichotomy processes (Rauls terms, such as What can you confront, what would you rather not confront), Havingness (Such as "What can you have?" "Look around and find something you can have. Look around and find something you're not in." Rainer kept recor records of his auditing. Manson got super-energetic & flipped out when he'd been audited and would, for a time, talk about nothing but Scientology to the extent that people avoided his company. After a while, however, Manson was screaming to get away from his auditor (in Raul's opinion, he'd been severely over-run or something). He eventually managed to get put in solitary confi- nement to get away from his auditor. Eventually prison officials got suspicious of the groups strange activities and broke up the group. Subsequently, Raul was released from the prison in 1965. Raimer's wife was in training here at the L.A. Org in 1965-66; she had disconnected from Raimer. Raul just found out yesterday that another friend, Marvin White, later sent Manson books (after the Scientology group was broken up) on hypnotism and black magic,

http://bernie.cncfamily.com/sc/Manson_Scientology.htm

So, Lanier Rayner? Or Lafayette Raimer? My suspicion is that the former is the correct form, and the latter is a misspelling based on oral intelligence recieved by the Scientologists. I can't immediately find any reference to the involvement of such a person with Fromme, but it would be provocative.

Levenda also mentions that, whilst in prison, after becoming a "Theta clear", Manson begged to be separated from his auditor, which is also suggested in the material above. Charlie Manson in too deep..... :bandit:

Plus, of course, there are the Manson Family members Bruce Davis and Charles "Tex" Watson connections to Scientology's bastard sprogs, The Process Church of the Final Judgement, and to Scientology in the UK. And those "unofficial" Manson Family murders....

The Bug again:

On November 21, 1969, the bodies of James Sharp, fiften, and Dorren
Gaul, nineteen, were found in an alley in downtown Los Angeles. The
two teen-agers had been killed elsewhere with a long-bladed kniife or
bayonet, then dumped there. Each had been stabbed over fifty times.

Ramparts division Leiutenant Earl Deemer investigated the Sharp-Gaul
murders, as did Los Angeles Times reporter Cohen. Although the two men
felt there was a good possibility that a Familty member was involved
in the slayings, the murders remain unsolved.

Both James Sharp and Doreen Gaul were Scientologists, the latter a
Scientology "clear" who had been residing in a Church of Scientology
house. According to unconfirmed reports, Doreen Gaul was a former girl
friend of Manson Family member Bruce Davis, himself an
ex-Scientologist.

Davis' whereabouts at the times of the murders of Sharp, Gaul and Jane
Doe 59 are not known. He disappeared shortly after being questioned in
connection with the death of Zero.

On December 1, 1969, Joel Dean Pugh, husband of Family member Sandy
Good, was found with his throat slit in a London hotel room. As noted,
local police ruled the death a suicide. On learning of Pugh's demise,
Inyo County DA Frank Fowles made official inquiries, specifically
asking Interpol to check visas to detrmine if one Bruce Davis was in
England at the time.

Scotland Yard replied as follows: "It has been established that Davis
is recorded as embarking at London airport for the United States of
America on 25th April 1969 while holding United States passport 612
2568. At this time he gave his address as Dormer Cottage, Felbridge,
Surrey. This address is owned by the Scientology Movement and houses
followers of this organization."

-- HELTER SKELTER by Vincent T. Bugliosi, page 647

http://www.freedominion.com.pa/phpBB2/vi...p?p=885483

[Helen Reyes]

Good interview, listened to it multiple times now. The interviewer doesn't seem to be throwing red herrings in to me, he just seems significantly younger than Levenda and not really sure what's significant and what's not.

Maybe someone can help me out a little here. I've been listening to Levenda interviews and reading them all over the place, and downloaded his free excerpts from Sinister Forces Vol One The Nine as a pdf from sinisterforces.info, but I can't find the names of more than half the Nine. This is what I've got so far:

Dec 31, 1952 Seance with Dr. Vinod

The Nine: Astor, DuPont, Forbes families (and Bronfmon?); 1. Arthur Middleton Young 2. Andrija Puharich 3. Ruth Forbes Paine Young (husband Arthur Young) 4. Alice Astor (Bouverie) 5. Marcella DuPont 6. Mary Astor? 7. Michael Paine? 8. John Treat Williams?

Thanks for any help. Also, wasn't the helicopter basically stolen Nazi tech? And Ampex tape, which somebody involved in the Puharich projects used rather exclusively before it was widely available...

PS Didn't the John Profumo affair Levenda talks about actually involve L. Ron Hubbard trying to sell a minister's pillow talk to the KGB, or was that later? I believe Hubbard became persona non grata in the UK following that. And that reminds me, is there any evidence Ingo Swann was a scientologist OT?

[Jan Klimkowski]

On p244 of Vol 1, Levenda lists a gathering of The Nine:

Henry Jackson
Georgia Jackson
Alice Bouverie
Marcella Du Pont
Carl Betz
Vonnie Beck
Arthur Young
Ruth Young
Andrija Puharich

With Dr Vinod acting as medium.

The interviewer doesn't seem to be throwing red herrings in to me, he just seems significantly younger than Levenda and not really sure what's significant and what's not.

Fair enough. My use of "red herring" may be inappropriate. I do suspect it was the interviewer's lack of knowledge rather than deliberate misdirection.

That said, it's the very inability of the interviewer to distinguish between significant and insignificant that so irritated me.

It would have been wonderful to hear Levenda interviewed by the late and much lamented Mae Brussell.

Or Mae Brussell by John Judge.

PS Didn't the John Profumo affair Levenda talks about actually involve L. Ron Hubbard trying to sell a minister's pillow talk to the KGB, or was that later? I believe Hubbard became persona non grata in the UK following that. And that reminds me, is there any evidence Ingo Swann was a scientologist OT?

I believe there are Profumo and Scientology links. Linda Minor may very well have posted some of the evidence.

I'm told that Swann was an Operant Thetan of very high grade. As were other "pioneer" remote viewers. Indeed, it's been claimed that they were NSA assets sent to steal the "high secrets" of the Church of Scientology. :call2:

[Jan Klimkowski]

The link below is to a site which attempts to construct a history of the relationship between remote viewing and Operating Thetan level scientology, ie L Ron Hubbard's inner sanctum.

It is clearly not entirely reliable. However, individual elements within the whole may contain some truth.

http://www.sc-i-r-s-ology.pair.com/rvtim...index.html

[Jan Klimkowski]

A related document, presumably from the same source, regarding self-proclaimed remote viewer, and limited hangout asset, Major Ed Dames.

CIA-Scientology Conspiracy:Remote Viewing Ed Dames
by http://WWW.SC-I-R-S-OLOGY.PAIR.COM

It was a balmy August/September-cusp night, and the Art Bell

Coast-to-Coast show--the Number One overnight talk show in major markets across the nation, including New York and Los Angeles--was, as usual, holding its listeners enthralled.



From long-haul truckers to long-hair intellectuals, the millions who make up Art's eclectic collection of devoted, insomniac fans were welded to their radios as Art interviewed a guest who seems to be a favorite with the wide-spectrum audience.

But on this particular night, something odd happened. Of course, saying "something odd" happened on the Art Bell show is like saying something edible was found in a supermarket. But even for Art's show, this was something that-- Well, read on.

The guest was "remote viewer" and former(?) CIA officer Major Ed Dames, founder of PSI Tech--a for-profit company specializing in "remote viewing."

[Editor's note: We put that (?) in there because, as one wag once put it, "the only 'former' spook is a dead spook.



" Being neither former spooks nor dead, we wouldn't know.]

Dames claims that by using the "remote viewing" technology he exported with him from CIA, he is able to perform super-human feats of perception, both in space and in time, and can teach others to do the same--for a price.

One basis for his popularity is the uncanny accuracy of some of his remote-viewed predictions about world events. And what, you might ask, does all this have to do with Scientology's Church of Spiritual Technology (CST) - the powerful corporation that controls all of Scientology, and which is embroiled in the $190-million libel suit Veritas is covering? Well, you'll have to get there by the same route we did. If you're rash and reckless enough to follow along...

On the night in question, things didn't go quite as they usually do with Major Ed Dames. There was a wrinkle in the fabric of space and time, a wrinkle that, apparently, he hadn't "remote viewed" as looming in his own future.

Oh, there were the usual questions by fax and phone from listeners who wanted to know more about remote viewing, and discussions about cataclysms and catastrophes that Dames sees lurking in the future for us mortals here on earth. And Major Ed handled them with his usual glib aplomb. Art was conducting a friendly, interested interview, and Major Ed had lots of intriguing tidbits to share.

But then, a seemingly incongruous question from Art: "You never did anything on L. Ron Hubbard, did you?"

A heartbeat. Major Ed, flatly: "No."

Why Art asked the question at all, we don't know. But it didn't seem to go over very well with the Major; there was an edge. Art accepted the answer at face value, and that would have been that. Would have been--except for a pesky fold-back on that bothersome wrinkle in space-time...

L. RON HUBBARD, ANCHOR POINTS, AND THE MILITARY
INTELLIGENCE COMMUNITY

As the next break neared, Major Ed confided to Art something about personal "anchor points" that he, Dames, uses in his remote viewing, and the beginnings of a warp seemed to materialize, just for a moment. But it was only after the news break, after the usual spate of survivalist-gear and natural-remedy ads, that the weird warp appeared, wavered, flickered, and then formed fully in the late-night radio waves:


ART BELL: Ed, are you there?

ED DAMES: I'm here.

ART BELL: All right, here's a pretty rough fax, and let's
see how you handle it, all right?

ED DAMES: Okay.

ART BELL: (reading): "Art, Ed Dames knows damn well that
Hal Puthoff, Ingo Swann and Pat Price--all key players in the
remote viewing program--were Scientologists, and that the
military intelligence community were dogging L. Ron Hubbard
for decades. Remote viewing came from Hubbard's discoveries
and Dames KNOWS IT"--underlined. "Why did he lie or
'play dumb' when you mentioned Hubbard? For instance, the
term 'anchor points' is ONLY a Hubbard discovery"--"only"
underlined. Any comment?

ED DAMES: Bunk. All bunk.

ART BELL: All bunk?

ED DAMES: Yep. Every single bit of that is bunk.

ART BELL: Okay--

ED DAMES: And, by the way, if there's anybody out there with
a voice stress analyzer or any other type of lie machine (sic), put
it on! And I'll say it again: it's bunk! Total bunk.

My, my, but the smooth and suave Major Ed suddenly sounded downright testy! We thought that perhaps the Major didth protesteth too much. He almost sounded like Clinton denying having sexual relations with Monica. And so we decided to step through that odd, warped little wrinkle that had appeared in space-time. And what did we find? Well, as Art Bell might say: "Oh-h-h-h, my!"

HELLO, CIA. WELCOME TO PLANET VERITAS.

Whatta' warp! Welcome to what Canadian writer Kady O'Malley has dubbed "Planet Veritas," where the strangest things find a way of coming together, like some alien, sci-fi Wonderland.

We started out innocently following a white-rabbit story about a $190-million libel suit involving Scientology's secretive--but most powerful--corporation, the Church of Spiritual Technology (CST).

So far, our wide-eyed wanderings through the endlessly-connecting corridors leading off from that lawsuit have taken us to places we never imagined. We found connecting crawlways to IRS. We found hidden passageways to Congressional Committees. We found buried treasure troves of hard evidence supporting Plaintiffs' allegations of fraud. We found a dumpy, hidden little P.O. box as the "primary business address" for the most powerful corporation in all of Scientologydom. We found an "L. Ron Hubbard Library" that exists only on paper. We found a Chart of Power that, for the first time, laid out exactly how CST secretly weilded power over all of Scientology. But no matter where we turned, all corridors led somehow, ultimately, back to CST. And then, in the unlikeliest place of all, on the Art Bell show, we found this little weird warp that said "Open Me," and there, lo-and-behold, was the CIA--linked up to a bevy of "former Scientologists" (anything like "former spooks"?), and to mental technologies that trace directly back to the copyrighted works of L. Ron Hubbard. And those works are now owned by--guess who.

If you said "CST," you just might want to apply for permanent citizenship on Planet Veritas.

"BUNK," MAJOR DAMES? DID YOU SAY, "BUNK?"

No, Major Ed, not bunk. Hal Puthoff was *INDEED* a key player in the CIA's Remote Viewing Program. In fact, Major (and Art--are *you* tuned in?), Hal Puthoff was the HEAD of that program--at Stanford Research Institute (SRI)--from 1972 to 1985. [Editor's note: 1972 is the year in which L. Ron Hubbard mysteriously disappeard for ten months, accompanied only by a former Green Beret and a male nurse--a developing story soon to appear here in the pages of Veritas.]

And, yes, Major Ed, Hal Puthoff was *INDEED* a Scientologist when he entered the CIA-spawned Remote-Viewing Program. In fact, Puthoff had only recently completed Scientology's super-secret "Operating Thetan, Level III" (OT III), placing him in the rarified inner circles of Scientology's "Advanced Technology" knowledge.

But there's more: prior to entering Scientology in the late '60's and working his way up through the ranks to access Scientology's secret levels, Puthoff had been with the National Security Administration (NSA). [Editor's note: Like Major Ed, it looks like we have another "former spook" here, but this one going almost directly from Scientology's secret levels straight into CIA's Remote Viewing Program--which bears an uncanny resemblance to parts of Scientology itself!]

We've also found and interviewed two people who were in Scientology in Los Angeles in the early '70's, and who personally knew Puthoff when he was there.

(For those wanting to know more about Puthoff and his connections, we suggest you start at http://www.io.com/~hambone/web/puthoff.html. That's a brief bio on Puthoff, with numerous links to other information on him, and on the Remote Viewing Program and its players.)

So, no, Major Ed: THAT part of the fax that Art Bell read certainly wasn't "bunk." And you said, "Every single bit of that is bunk." Oops. Well, then, how about the rest of it?

Let's take Ingo Swann.

Ingo Swann was a pioneer in the CIA's Remote Viewing Project WITH Hal Puthoff. In fact, they are the team who were in at its outset. And, surprise, surprise: Swann was a Scientology OT VII--which, at the time, was the highest secret level attainable in Scientology!

We even found and interviewed someone who had once helped set up Ingo Swann's art exhibits for him at Scientology's Celebrity Centre in Los Angeles, on West 8th Street.

But, Ed, here's what REALLY surprised us. Look what we found in YOUR OWN press release, entitled "Ed Dames Sets the Record Straight."

"Ingo Swann, under the direction of Dr. Harold Puthoff at SRI, realized a breakthrough, i.e., he developed an accurate model of how the collective unconscious communicates (target) information to conscious awareness. Swann believed that the ability to remote view, like language, is an innate faculty--a birthright--but must be learned to be effective. Swann's model provided a rigid set of instructions which theoretically allowed anyone to actually be trained to produce accurate, detailed target data. To test the model, the Army sent Major Dames and five others to Swann as a prototype trainee group.

"The results were more than anyone, even Swann, had anticipated. In six months, Major Dames' (sic) team members were producing psychically derived data with more consistency and accuracy than the most renown natural (untrained) psychics alive."

Are we supposed to believe, Major Ed, that you never knew anything about Ingo Swann's high-level involvement in Scientology? Or Hal Puthoff's? [Editor's note: Well, even Monica Lewinsky was able to get a top-secret clearance. Guess things are pretty sloppy with those "intelligence" boys these days. Budget cut-backs?]

Or were you, Major Ed, just cut out of the "need to know" loop regarding Swann's "OT VII" rating? Could be. If that's the case, maybe we here at Veritas ought to let you in on something else about Swann: his OWN intelligence background, his own TOP SECRET clearance with the military PRIOR to getting access to Scientology's secret upper levels.

That's right, Major Ed: there's yet another "former spook" in the woodpile.

(For those wanting to know learn more about Ingo Swann and his connections, we suggest you start at http://www.io.com/~hambone/web/swann.html.)

Two strikes, Major Ed. So what about Pat Price?

It's quite curious that Pat Price, who has been described as being "widely considered to be the best of the remote viewers," was a Scientology OT IV, and was very instrumental in the early success of the CIA's Remote Viewing Project. An unconfirmed report says that Price went on from there to work directly for the CIA, with one Ken Kress as his handler. Then when Price decided to return to SRI, he stopped over in Las Vegas, and died of a purported heart attack in his hotel room. There was no autopsy peformed, allegedly due to the persuasion of an unknown individual with a briefcase full of Price's medical records.

(For those wanting to know learn more about Pat Price and his connections, we suggest you start at http://www.io.com/~hambone/web/price.html.)

But you don't know anything about any of this, do you, Major Ed? No, you said-- Let's see, what were your words? Oh, yes--"bunk," you called it. Is that correct? Yes, that's what you said: "Bunk."

The only slight problem is that Veritas has inarguably, uncontestably, and verifiably confirmed that Puthoff, Swann, and Price all WERE key players in the CIA's Remote Viewing Program, and that they all WERE high-level Scientologists when they entered that program at its inception.

Two of those Scientologists--Puthoff and Swann--had intelligence backgrounds BEFORE they penetrated Scientology's super-secret "OT Levels," then turned right around and set up the Remote Viewing Program for CIA. Probably just coincidence, right Major Ed?

Just to tie the bundle up with a neat ribbon (and 14 Scientology "Clears"), here's a quote from "The Constantine Report":

"Many of the SRI [Stanford Research Institute--where the early remote viewing program was originally set up] 'empaths' were mustered from L. Ron Hubbard's Church of Scientology. Harold Puthoff, the Institute's senior researcher, is a leading Scientologist. Two 'remote viewers' from SRI have also held rank in the Church: Ingo Swann, a Class VII Operating Thetan, a founder of the Scientology [Celebrity] Center in Los Angeles, and the late Pat Price. Puthoff['s]...lab assistant was a Scientologist married to a minister of the church. When Swann joined SRI, he stated openly that fourteen 'Clears' participated in the experiments."

Unfortunately, Major Ed, that's strike three. You ought to be outta here. But we haven't even GOTTEN to the "anchor points" part yet!

IS MAJOR ED DAMES A CLOSET SCIENTOLOGIST?

Where else would Ed Dames have learned about "anchor points?" Of course, Major Ed swore on national radio that the claim about "anchor points" being an L. Ron Hubbard discovery was-- Let's see, what were his words? Oh, yes. He called it "bunk." In fact, Major Ed said, "Every single bit of that is bunk."

So we, being frustratingly from Planet Veritas, of course had to check it out--thoroughly. And here is what we found.

First, we learned that there are at least 706 references to the term "anchor points" in the body of L. Ron Hubbard's works. Second, we found that Hubbard's use of the term dates back at least as early as 4 December 1952--predating the CIA's Remote Viewing Program by 20 years--in a lecture where he defined the term:

"[A]n anchor point is that point which origin 'I' assigns so that he can have dimension and motion. ...[T]hese anchor points actually assign dimension or boundary to space. ...Whenever there is motion, one holds the anchor point and perceives the motion. It's very simple. He also perceives the anchor point, holds and perceives the anchor point and then sees something changing without those anchor points moving."
L. Ron Hubbard
Taped lecture, "Spacation: Anchor Points, Origin"
Philadelphia Doctorate Course
4 December 1952

We then searched in vain for any earlier mention of "anchor points," anywhere at all, in any literature having anything whatsoever to do with the mind or things spiritual. Zero. Zip. Nada, Major Ed.

Other Hubbard references to "anchor points" go hand-in-hand with Ed Dames's "Technical Remote Viewing" technology, which includes locating and viewing objects and events that are distant from the viewer in space and time. For instance:

"Space is a viewpoint of dimension. The points which mark an area of space are called anchor points, and these, with the viewpoint, alone are responsible for space. ...The essential in any object is the space which it occupies. Thus, the ability to be an object first depends upon the ability to be the space which it occupies."
L. Ron Hubbard
The Journal of Scientology, Issue 14-G,
c. late April 1953

And how about the very concept of "remote"--as in distant from, or away from, one's physical location--and the concept of "anchor points":

"It is usually better to run things away from the body, as this has the effect of putting out anchor points. ...Thus these concepts should be run at a distance from the body."
L. Ron Hubbard
Professional Auditor's Bulletin No. 2
c. end May 1953

Bunk, huh, Major Ed? Hmmm.

EVEN MORE SCIENTOLOGY IN CIA/DAMES "REMOTE VIEWING"?

Major Ed Dames sells CIA-developed "Technical Remote Viewing" through his company, PSI Tech. His 9-day courses once sold for--as he put it--"Forty-five hundred dollars ($4,500.00) a pop." Estimated revenues from that mount into the millions. Now he hawks sets of videotapes, the full set selling for $299.90. Given Dames's own current estimate of 10,000 students, that alone rounds out to a cool $3-million.

Major Ed freely--if arrogantly--admits in one of his own video tapes that "tax dollars paid for the research."

We'll let others consider the ethics of personal fortunes being made off of CIA-funded programs by "former" intelligence officers. We wondered how much Scientology was contained in that multi-million-dollar enterprise. So we looked into it.

In addition to the incontrovertible "anchor points" technology, we found other interesting references in some of Ed Dames's video tapes.

In one "module" (as he markets them), Dames is overseeing a student's remote viewing "session." Dames instructs her to "Go through all those diminsion points."

"Dimension points?" Anything like "anchor points?"

Checking our sources, we learned that there were at least 110 references in L. Ron Hubbard's works to "dimension points," and that these "dimension points" are central to Scientology's concept of the universe--particularly (pun intended) as it relates to time. In fact, the term "dimension points" is one of the most important themes in L. Ron Hubbard's seminal work called "The Factors," which he signed: "Humbly tendered as a gift to Man by L.Ron Hubbard, April 23, 1953."

Dames's CIA-created version of remote viewing includes claims of being able to "remote view" people, objects, places and events in past, present, and future, and obviously includes "dimension points" in the process. So let's look at a few selections from "The Factors" in relationship to such forms, to viewing, and to time:

"[T]he many viewpoints, interacting, become dependent upon one another's forms and do not choose to distinguish completely the ownership of dimension points, and so comes about a dependency upon the dimension points and upon the other viewpoints. ...From this comes a consistency of viewpoint of the interaction of dimension points and this, regulated, is TIME."
L. Ron Hubbard
"The Factors"
23 April 1953

So important did Hubbard consider "dimension points" and "viewpoints' that he says:

"The resolution of any problem posed hereby is the establishment of viewpoints and dimension points, the betterment of condition and concourse amongst dimension points, and, thereby, viewpoints... ."
L. Ron Hubbard
"The Factors"
23 April 1953

But the Scientology connections don't stop there. In the same "module," when the student has made a comment about the remote viewing session being a little rough, Dames laughs and says, "Wait till I put you in the center of the sun."

Blink.

"WAIT TILL I PUT YOU IN THE CENTER OF THE SUN."

How many times have YOU heard someone say they would "put you in the center of the sun"? Not often, we'd guess. The only small problem we see with with CIA's Major Ed using this particular language is that it comes almost verbatim out of a famous Scientology "OT"-type process called "Grand Tour," which was developed and released by L. Ron Hubbard at least as early as 1954.

In a lecture given on 10 October 1954, entitled "Route 1, Step 9," L. Ron Hubbard is describing his "Grand Tour" process to Scientology students:

"So we say, 'Be near Earth. Be near the Moon. Be near the Sun. Be near Earth.' And we could keep on doing this, and would keep on doing this for some time. ...And you'll find out that he will start doing it much more rapidly than he was doing it before."

If that doesn't describe what the term "remote viewing" conjures up, we don't know what would. And though Hubbard starts his "Grand Tour" process putting people "near' these heavenly bodies, he soon, in the same lecture, graduates up to putting the subject IN them:

"So you want him to be 'Center of Earth. Outside Earth. Inside Earth. Outside Earth. Inside Earth. Outside Earth. Inside Earth. Outside Earth. Eight anchor points and pull them in. Eight anchor points and pull them in. Eight anchor points and pull them in. Inside the Moon. Outside the Moon. Inside the Moon. Outside the Moon. Inside the Moon. Outside of the Moon. Eight anchor points and pull them in. Eight anchor points and pull them in. Eight anchor points and pull them in. Inside the Sun. Outside the Sun. Inside the Sun. Outside the Sun.'"

Need we go on?

Oh, Major Ed--look! There are those pesky "anchor points" again.

"Bunk," huh? Right, Major Ed.

(Say, Art Bell--would this be worth an, "Oh-h-h-h, my"? We just love it when you do that.)

DO ED DAMES AND THE CIA HAVE A LICENSE FROM CST TO USE L. RON HUBBARD'S WORKS?

The Church of Spiritual Technology--doing business as the "L. Ron Hubbard Library," and currently the defendant in the $190-million libel suit that we set out several centuries ago (in Planet Veritas time) to cover--owns all the copyrights to all of L. Ron Hubbard's works. Anchor points. Dimension points. "The Grand Tour." The works.

That's the same Church of Spiritual Technology who has weird ties to IRS, leading to the tax-exempt status which helped get them ownership of those copyrights.

That's the same Church of Spiritual Technology that is defendant in a libel suit whose judge has ties to government intelligence-agency oversight commitees.

That's the same Church of Spiritual Technology who has spent, or allowed to be spent, countless millions of dollars tracking down and prosecuting--some would say "persecuting"--people that they scathingly describe as "copyright terrorists"--which means, as well as we can determine, people who use or distribute CST-owned copyrighted material improperly or without a license. Of course, CST--who, like the proverbial elephant with red-painted toenails hiding in a cherry tree, is always trying to remain invisible--hasn't been SEEN going after their nemesis "copyright terrorists." They use their yard-dog, the Religious Technology Center (RTC), to do the down-and-dirty courtroom ankle-gnawing. But RTC is just another licensee of the Church of Spiritual Technology, and so is merely fronting for the real copyright owners--CST.

So why is CIA's Major Ed Dames allowed to rake in millions using technology that demonstrably derives from these copyrighted materials, while CST sits by quietly?

Why did the CIA use Scientology OTs to create remote viewing?

How did "former" intelligence people like Puthoff and Swann get onto the Scientology OT Levels in the first place--since Hubbard had forbidden such people to be allowed on Scientology courses?

"BUNK," MAJOR ED? WE'LL TELL YOU ABOUT "BUNK"

Major Ed Dames created his money-making venture using technology that HE claims was developed by the CIA in research (using millions of tax dollars), and in which he was the Training and Operations Officer for "a new psychic intelligence community."

Well, we think that's just ducky.

Yet he vigorously denies that Hal Puthoff, Ingo Swann, and Pat Price were Scientologists; he vigorously denies that they were key players in the development of "remote viewing;" and he vigorously denies that "anchor points" are a discovery of L. Ron Hubbard.

Well, we say, "bunk" to your denials, Major Ed.

We think you have a damn good reason for trying to downplay and hide the Scientology-CIA-remote-viewing connections.

We think there's a damn good reason why Puthoff and Swann had intelligence backgrounds before getting into Scientology.

We think there's a damn good reason why they had no sooner reached the secret upper levels of Scientology, than they were back under the wing of CIA developing remote viewing for the "new psychic intelligence community."

We think there's a damn good reason why psychiatrist Dr. Louis Jolyn "Jolly" West--a brainwashing specialist with CIA ties going back to the early '50's, when L. Ron Hubbard first exposed government brainwashing techniques and mind-control experiments--was also connected with the CIA's Remote Viewing Program.

We think there's a damn good reason why the judge in the instant case involving CST--Judge Frances Rothschild--has well-documented ties both to IRS/Treasury, and to Intelligence Oversight committees in the federal government, and why Rothschild got put onto the case through the expedient of the first judge recusing herself.

We think there's a damn good reason why CST was co-founded by a former Assistant to the Commissioner of IRS, who just happened to be there at IRS while an IRS employee was feeding government documents to senior Scientology officials--which ultimately got those officials jailed, and made it possible for CST to get possession of all the copyrights containing the technology that CIA appropriated for its own use.

And we think any effort to cover all this stinking rot up is BUNK, Major Ed. Or worse.

We think the evidence of connections between federal government agencies and CST is now overwhelming, Major Ed, and that only a real idiot could ignore it. We think that there's even a possibility that Dr. "Jolly" West helped mix Scientology technology with Jungian psychology so that it could be slickly packaged up and sold off as "remote viewing" to the gullible public--pretending that it's exactly what the government is using (yeah, right), while, in fact, CIA (and DIA, and NSA, and the alphabet soup group) keep the real stuff for themselves.

We also think that CST is packaging altered versions of the original Hubbard works, and selling those off disguised as the real thing, too.

But that's just what WE think, Major Ed. What do YOU think?

Oh, that's right. We remember now. You say it's all "bunk." And you wouldn't lie, would you Major Ed? Why, hell--you're a "former" United States intelligence officer.

Using the RealPlayer, you can hear the full Art Bell August 31/September 1 interview with Major Ed Dames at:

http://www.trv-psitech.com/media.htm

The full program is nearly five hours long. Here are some approximate time markers for relevant sections:

Art Bell asks about L. Ron Hubbard: 03:43:25
Dames mentions "anchor points": 03:50:09
Art Bell reads the fax to Ed Dames: 04:07:00


ORIGINALLY PUBLISHED
http://www.sc-i-r-s-ology.pair.com/verit...st-cia.htm

http://theuniversalseduction.com/article...g-ed-dames

[Jan Klimkowski]

I've long assumed that the claims that L Ron Hubbard was privy to secret esoteric knowledge, which was then further developed by his most intutive or "psychic" disciples - aka the Operant Thetans (allegedly including Ingo Swann et al) - were based on the occult history sketched, for example, here:

What Grant is speaking of is a form of ritual magic(k) practiced by such groups as the Golden Dawn, and the Ordo Templi Orientis(O.T.O.). "Sigils" are line drawings and diagrams that serve as signatures of entities accessible to a trained magician familiar with "Enochian calls" and other methods of summoning "spirits". A grimoire is a directory of such sigils, and a manual for their use.
A noted disciple of Crowley's, Jack Parsons — one time head of the California branch of the O.T.O., and renowned rocket scientist — carried on this tradition of interdimensional contact when, in 1946 — with the aid of "Frater H." — he made contact with some sort of entities not at all unlike Crowley's "Lam". This all took place during a series of magic rituals deemed the Babalon Workings. What makes this story all the more bizarre is that Parson's accomplice in this endeavor — the aforementioned Frater H. — became more commonly known afterwards as the charismatic cult leader L.Ron Hubbard, the founder of Scientology.
Apparently, Hubbard played a role similar to that of Edward Kelly, "scryer" for the aforementioned Dr. John Dee, of whom Crowley was an ardent admirer. A scryer works as a receptor of otherworldly communications, often using a crystal ball or similar device in conjunction with the magician's rituals and ceremonies to summon beings from other dimensions. Together magician and scryer work hand-in-hand in summoning these otherworldly beings: be they angels, demons or spirits of the dead. Crowley's Scarlet Woman, in many instances, performed this same function; for instance Crowley's first wife, Rose Kelly — while in a magical trance — received the first three chapters of the infamous Book of the Law, the manuscript that laid the foundation for Crowley's "religion", Thelema. Furthermore, the portal of entry for the extraterrestrial beings that Crowley theoretically opened (when he invoked the entity "Lam") may have been further enlarged by Parsons and Hubbard with the commencement of the Babalon Working, thus facilitating a monumental paradigm shift in human consciousness. As Kenneth Grant wrote, "The [Babalon] Working began... just prior to the wave of unexplained ariel phenomena now recalled as the 'Great Flying Saucer Flap!' Parsons opened a door and something flew in." Such researchers as John Carter suggest that the detonation of atomic bombs over Japan — during the latter part of World War II — may have also played a part in opening this door between dimensions or, at least, attracted the curiosity of our intergalactic neighbors.
As Thelemic history instructs, 1947 ended the first stage of the Babalon Working, as Parsons and Hubbard parted ways amid a cloud of turmoil.(Apparently, Hubbard split with Parsons wife and a large part of his fortune.) It was the same year the Modern Age of UFOs flew into view with the Kenneth Arnold sightings over Mt. Rainer in Washington state, followed not long after by the legendary saucer crash in Roswell, New Mexico.

http://www.deeppoliticsforum.com/forums/...=26&page=6

In other words, according to this version of events, Hubbard had stolen OTO magickal workings.

One particular prism through which to view this whole scenario is provided by the work of Jung.

[Keith Millea]

In other words, according to this version of events, Hubbard had stolen OTO magickal workings.

And the CIA took it from Hubbard,and locked it away.:listen:
Some good stuff Jan!:top:

[Helen Reyes]

On p244 of Vol 1, Levenda lists a gathering of The Nine:

Henry Jackson
Georgia Jackson
Alice Bouverie
Marcella Du Pont
Carl Betz
Vonnie Beck
Arthur Young
Ruth Young
Andrija Puharich

With Dr Vinod acting as medium.

Thank you Jan. I really couldn't find them on search engines.

I do suspect it was the interviewer's lack of knowledge rather than deliberate misdirection.

That said, it's the very inability of the interviewer to distinguish between significant and insignificant that so irritated me.

It would have been wonderful to hear Levenda interviewed by the late and much lamented Mae Brussell.

Yeah, it sure would have. A lot of times it's hard on radio to balance between letting the guest blab on and trying to steer the conversation into a coherent thing for listeners. Obviously the media monarchy man was out of his depth and should have let Levenda blab on a bit more.

On the other hand Levenda seems to suffer from the same thing, the inability to make sense of it. In part he's a victim of his methodology, which is drawing lines between characters in a data base, but he forgets that the statistical probablities become skewed in a small circle of rich elites. I guess he's never lived in a Ukrainian village. The effect is as occluding as it is elucidating, sometimes he just raises a sandstorm impossible to penetrate, but I do like what I've heard and read from him. I need to read more of his stuff and just shut up with the analysis of him for now. He does seem to have a standard interview format, he says the exact same things and steers the interview himself, which is not good or bad. He also seems to be distancing himself from his occult affiliations, probably for consumption by the "patriot" community, or maybe he's just being occult-neutral, but I suspect it's for the same reason. Not that I think he was the author of the Simon Necronomicon, he was just some kind of contact or organizer to get it published as far as I can tell.

I'm told that Swann was an Operant Thetan of very high grade. As were other "pioneer" remote viewers. Indeed, it's been claimed that they were NSA assets sent to steal the "high secrets" of the Church of Scientology. :call2:

Yes, the Planet Veritas article is right about the terminology. I noticed that in Swann and Dame's stuff before, although different terms caught my eye.

Hubbard tried to sell his "technology" to the US government when Kennedy announced the Moon program. Hubbard also counterfeited a book about mind control purporting it to be by Beria, the founder of the NKVD, and tried to turn it in to the US intelligence agencies, who quickly determined it was bogus.