Will WikiLeaks unravel the American 'secret government'?

[Peter Lemkin]

German minister of economics, Brüderle, has said the following words, probably in an effort to criticize Wikileaks:
"Manches, was ich bei WikiLeaks da entnehme, erinnert mich an die Sammelwut, die früher Institutionen im Osten hatten, die Stasi dabei."
(Something that I gather from Wikileaks reminds me to the collection rage that institutions in the east had, Stasi included.)
The cables were indeed collected by the US State Department, not by Wikileaks.

From http://www.spiegel.de/netzwelt/netzpolit...71,00.html
(in German)

What makes you think that is a criticism of Wikileaks, then?

[David Guyatt]

t seems to have escaped notice that one of the cables indicates that Sweden is secretly in NATO...and this might be bothering the Swedes now.....they may also worry that some info on the US-Swedish Assassination of Palme may surface in all this. Kill the messenger quick!

I think Sweden being a secret member of NATO is, indeed a bigger story than has been realized yet.

Not just because of the Palme murder, but because the Swedish grovelment has kept this hidden from their citizens - I imagine because the Swedes strongly believe in the dignity of their neutrality. They have been sold out.

But there maybe others nations that are also secret members of NATO. Switzerland perhaps? What about Austria? Is the Vatican City a secret non-military, intelligence gathering member maybe?

Are there other secret categories of membership we know nothing about yet?

[Magda Hassan]

Yes. I was wondering the same thing David. I don't think this is going to go down well with most Swedes. I think this need a lot more sunshine on it.

[David Guyatt]

Julian Assange wrote this Op-Ed for The Australian today:
WikiLeaks is not the only publisher of the US embassy cables. Other media outlets, including Britain ‘s The Guardian, The New York Times, El Pais in Spain and Der Spiegel in Germany have published the same redacted cables.

Yet it is WikiLeaks, as the co-ordinator of these other groups, that has copped the most vicious attacks and accusations from the US government and its acolytes. I have been accused of treason, even though I am an Australian, not a US, citizen. There have been dozens of serious calls in the US for me to be “taken out” by US special forces. Sarah Palin says I should be “hunted down like Osama bin Laden”, a Republican bill sits before the US Senate seeking to have me declared a “transnational threat” and disposed of accordingly. An adviser to the Canadian Prime Minister’s office has called on national television for me to be assassinated. An American blogger has called for my 20-year-old son, here in Australia, to be kidnapped and harmed for no other reason than to get at me.

And Australians should observe with no pride the disgraceful pandering to these sentiments by Prime Minister Gillard and US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton have not had a word of criticism for the other media organisations. That is because The Guardian, The New York Times and Der Spiegel are old and large, while WikiLeaks is as yet young and small.

A "transnational threat" eh.

This will be mighty serious stuff if it is passed.

Btw, I thought Assenge summed up the case extremely well in the above article. I watched the toadying of Gillard on TV yesterday and it was deplorable to watch her uttering her weasel words.

I was never a fan of Rudd but at least he is prepared to make a fight of it:

Wikileaks: Australia FM says US to blame, not Assange

Kevin Rudd said he "didn't give a damn" about criticism of him in the cables

Australia's foreign minister has said the US is to blame for the release of thousands of diplomatic cables on Wikileaks, not its Australian founder, Julian Assange.

Kevin Rudd said the release raised questions about US security.

Mr Rudd said he did not "give a damn" about criticism of him in the cables.

Snip...

[Peter Lemkin]

t seems to have escaped notice that one of the cables indicates that Sweden is secretly in NATO...and this might be bothering the Swedes now.....they may also worry that some info on the US-Swedish Assassination of Palme may surface in all this. Kill the messenger quick!

I think Sweden being a secret member of NATO is, indeed a bigger story than has been realized yet.

Not just because of the Palme murder, but because the Swedish grovelment has kept this hidden from their citizens - I imagine because the Swedes strongly believe in the dignity of their neutrality. They have been sold out.

But there maybe others nations that are also secret members of NATO. Switzerland perhaps? What about Austria? Is the Vatican City a secret non-military, intelligence gathering member maybe?

Are there other secret categories of membership we know nothing about yet?

For the Vatican, why 'non-military'? After all, they have all those Swiss Guards in their brightly colored pantaloons - complete with long-handled blades! A formidable fighting force - with God [and God's bankers] on their side, no doubt.

[Peter Lemkin]

What the SD Cables are doing, more than anything else, IMO, is showing up ALL nations to be liars and doing backroom deals as normal operational procedure. It is not just the US that is angry at Wikileaks and Assange. He had best retire to a small and secure south sea nation or take up the offer in Ecuador sooner than later! I think that is the reason he was denied bail....they though he'd go to the Ecuadorian embassy and ask for asylum. I begin to fear for his winding up in Guantanamo, or worse.....on a 'broken condom' charge....go figure! I think it was the State Dept.'s 'security condom' that broke.....By the way, I don't believe I've heard I'll Bomb Ya say peep about the whole matter yet......loose lips sink ships!

[David Guyatt]

We hate to say we told you so, but...

We told you so:

• Could Assange face an espionage trial in the US?

The Independent thinks so. "Informal discussions have already taken place between US and Swedish officials over the possibility of the WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange being delivered into American custody," according to its diplomatic sources. It adds: "The US Justice Department is considering charging Mr Assange with espionage offences over his website's unprecedented release of classified US diplomatic files."

See HERE.

Might this be (no!) a "conspiracy fact"?

[Peter Lemkin]

We hate to say we told you so, but...

We told you so:

• Could Assange face an espionage trial in the US?

The Independent thinks so. "Informal discussions have already taken place between US and Swedish officials over the possibility of the WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange being delivered into American custody," according to its diplomatic sources. It adds: "The US Justice Department is considering charging Mr Assange with espionage offences over his website's unprecedented release of classified US diplomatic files."

See HERE.

Might this be (no!) a "conspiracy fact"?

Well, IF this IS a conspiracy, it will certain be the first one I've ever contemplated the USG involved in! mokin: Somehow I sense the 'insurance' files will see the light of day sooner, rather than later....I only hope they blow the whole fucking edifice of lies, that make up the US (and most other nations), away....far away and forever! At least hurt where the condoms break! I'm sure should this now virtual fait accompli should happen, he'll get a very fair trial :proud: [even if the conclusion and verdict/sentence has already been determined]!

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe Swedish law prohibits extradition to any nation with the death penalty, when the crime could engender the death penalty....but a legal triviality, I'm sure they are working furiously to overcome now.

[David Guyatt]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe Swedish law prohibits extradition to any nation with the death penalty, when the crime could engender the death penalty....but a legal triviality, I'm sure they are working furiously to overcome now.

I don't know Pete. But it should be a simple job for the US and Sweden to sign a diplomatic understanding where the US unequivocally states the US will not execute Assange if extradited.

Not only could we later read that diplomatic understanding on Wikileaks, but cynics like me would simply ask just how many inmates in the US prison system die from preventable deaths each year?

The answer is somewhere under 7000 per year.

Compare that to the number of executions in the year 2009: 52.

[Carsten Wiethoff]

German minister of economics, Brüderle, has said the following words, probably in an effort to criticize Wikileaks:
"Manches, was ich bei WikiLeaks da entnehme, erinnert mich an die Sammelwut, die früher Institutionen im Osten hatten, die Stasi dabei."
(Something that I gather from Wikileaks reminds me to the collection rage that institutions in the east had, Stasi included.)
The cables were indeed collected by the US State Department, not by Wikileaks.

From http://www.spiegel.de/netzwelt/netzpolit...71,00.html
(in German)

What makes you think that is a criticism of Wikileaks, then?

I should not have speculated about the intentions of Mr. Brüderle. I formally apologize for that.
I even can understand his impression, if you take for example the cable ordering diplomats to collect genetic material on the UN Secretary. Change a few names and places and it sounds exactly like Erich Mielke speaking.
But then Mr. Brüderle must surely clarify, if he is opposed or in favor of making public this huge intelligence collection.

But I am not alone. See this journalistic low-point (in German):
http://www.bild.de/BILD/politik/2010/12/...stasi.html