Marked for Assassination

[Seamus Coogan]

Zionists are not nice guys. In fact they suck!

But so do any group of religious quasi facists.

But don't tell me this bull that your mentioning Zionists and not Jewish people.
It's an old trick and about as dumb as saying Israel were the biggest benefactors from the assassination. It's silly.

But this is not the 'big white elephant in the room' either it's just anti Jewish paranoia. You can dress it up as much as you want. Anybody naive enough to think that one religious group or some country outside of the United States were the prime movers of the assassination cannot be taken seriously. I'm not going to bother replying too this thread again!

[Albert Doyle]

Zionists are not nice guys. In fact they suck!

But so do any group of religious quasi facists.

But don't tell me this bull that your mentioning Zionists and not Jewish people.
It's an old trick and about as dumb as saying Israel were the biggest benefactors from the assassination. It's silly.

But this is not the 'big white elephant in the room' either it's just anti Jewish paranoia. You can dress it up as much as you want. Anybody naive enough to think that one religious group or some country outside of the United States were the prime movers of the assassination cannot be taken seriously. I'm not going to bother replying too this thread again!

You have to be kidding me Seamus. This is all easily provable with simple research. Your last entry just flies straight in the face of the known and open relationship the US and its AIPAC lobby has with Israel. This is something that grew directly from Lyndon Johnson's economic, political, and military support of Israel. A documentable event as shown in Piper's book. The origins of the US's gigantic funding of Israel is directly traceable in reality and firm figures to the pivot point of the Kennedy Assassination. It's all shown in hard facts in Piper's 'Final Judgment'. It is factually accurate to say Israel was the biggest benefactor of the assassination because the present state between the US and Israel, with our huge government-dominating AIPAC lobby and its pursuant US policy towards Israel, all directly originate from Johnson's reversals of Kennedy's policies.

Frankly I'm surprised you would try to get away with what you wrote above. A simple look at 'Final Judgment' would give all the proof you need. Unfortunately, Seamus, your reaction is the typical reaction of those who don't want to admit the truth and once again pull-out the racist card in order to avoid having to discuss the facts. Some might even accuse you of cow-towing to the controlling group in order to gain favor - despite the researched facts. A simple way to show the mistake you make is to point out that you never once touch Piper's thesis, or, more importantly, his evidence. This tactic has been successfully used to prevent 'Final Judgment' from being publicly discussed.

In my opinion the naivete here is trying to get away with using accusations of racism to ignore the most powerful lobby in the universe and the US's relationship to it. Surely you are not trying to get away with ignoring the political dimensions of the US's relationship to Israel and how it is currently being used as a wedge in the Middle East. You're not trying to ignore, right in the middle of the room, books like Mearsheimer and Walt's, or even president Carter's open acknowledgement of the detrimental affect of the Israel lobby? There's too many mainstream publications like Finkelstein etc to try to suggest this entire world-dominating political relationship could be ignored by simply accusing people who expose it of racism?


The reason this is totally invalid is because it serves as an excuse to not discuss what Piper exposes in his book. He exposes a very real underground political power directly connected to the worst doings of the same covert underground that killed Kennedy. He exposes a shadow government run by CIA and Mossad in the Mediterranean that became a rogue CIA alternate government which could be depended on to back the JFK coup. If you try to ignore all this with claims of racism you fail to see that CIA very much does operate this way and the fact that the supporting power was overseas only helped them get out from underneath the control of the American government. To ignore all this is to ignore the very means by which CIA carried-out this operation. And to pretend the US doesn't have a very powerful relationship to Israel that has now usurped the Constitution and become our new national theme is to just deny reality. We are not over in the Middle East carrying-out the Project For A New American Century for no reason.


The reason Piper is critical to understanding the Kennedy Assassination is because he shows, beyond a doubt, that a mainline funding source had developed between the CIA and the American Syndicate that Israel was the main recipient of through Tibor Rosenbaum's Swiss Banque Du Credit Internacional. To ignore this is to ignore a prime motivation in the assassination that flourished and grew into the CONTRA cocaine economy and beyond. To try to ignore this with accusations of racism is just an excuse to not discuss Piper's evidence of Ben Gurion being forced-out of office because of a state of mental instability directly related to Kennedy's private negotiations with him. These letters are still classified. Hmm. Why would these political negotiations still be classified? Why are they in the same secret category as other highly sensitive documents related to the Assassination?


There's simple way to show who is right here. Ask Seamus to disprove anything Piper wrote. He won't be able to do it. No, if there's anything that flashing the racism card won't cover this is most certainly it! Why do you think his book is being attacked? I'm shocked that Kennedy researchers would practice the exact same methods as Warren Report defenders!

[Seamus Coogan]

Zionists are not nice guys. In fact they suck!

But so do any group of religious quasi facists.

But don't tell me this bull that your mentioning Zionists and not Jewish people.
It's an old trick and about as dumb as saying Israel were the biggest benefactors from the assassination. It's silly.

But this is not the 'big white elephant in the room' either it's just anti Jewish paranoia. You can dress it up as much as you want. Anybody naive enough to think that one religious group or some country outside of the United States were the prime movers of the assassination cannot be taken seriously. I'm not going to bother replying too this thread again!

You have to be kidding me Seamus. This is all easily provable with simple research. Your last entry just flies straight in the face of the known and open relationship the US and its AIPAC lobby has with Israel. This is something that grew directly from Lyndon Johnson's economic, political, and military support of Israel. A documentable event as shown in Piper's book. The origins of the US's gigantic funding of Israel is directly traceable in reality and firm figures to the pivot point of the Kennedy Assassination. It's all shown in hard facts in Piper's 'Final Judgment'. It is factually accurate to say Israel was the biggest benefactor of the assassination because the present state between the US and Israel, with our huge government-dominating AIPAC lobby and its pursuant US policy towards Israel, all directly originate from Johnson's reversals of Kennedy's policies.

Frankly I'm surprised you would try to get away with what you wrote above. A simple look at 'Final Judgment' would give all the proof you need. Unfortunately, Seamus, your reaction is the typical reaction of those who don't want to admit the truth and once again pull-out the racist card in order to avoid having to discuss the facts. Some might even accuse you of cow-towing to the controlling group in order to gain favor - despite the researched facts. A simple way to show the mistake you make is to point out that you never once touch Piper's thesis, or, more importantly, his evidence. This tactic has been successfully used to prevent 'Final Judgment' from being publicly discussed.

In my opinion the naivete here is trying to get away with using accusations of racism to ignore the most powerful lobby in the universe and the US's relationship to it. Surely you are not trying to get away with ignoring the political dimensions of the US's relationship to Israel and how it is currently being used as a wedge in the Middle East. You're not trying to ignore, right in the middle of the room, books like Mearsheimer and Walt's, or even president Carter's open acknowledgement of the detrimental affect of the Israel lobby? There's too many mainstream publications like Finkelstein etc to try to suggest this entire world-dominating political relationship could be ignored by simply accusing people who expose it of racism?


The reason this is totally invalid is because it serves as an excuse to not discuss what Piper exposes in his book. He exposes a very real underground political power directly connected to the worst doings of the same covert underground that killed Kennedy. He exposes a shadow government run by CIA and Mossad in the Mediterranean that became a rogue CIA alternate government which could be depended on to back the JFK coup. If you try to ignore all this with claims of racism you fail to see that CIA very much does operate this way and the fact that the supporting power was overseas only helped them get out from underneath the control of the American government. To ignore all this is to ignore the very means by which CIA carried-out this operation. And to pretend the US doesn't have a very powerful relationship to Israel that has now usurped the Constitution and become our new national theme is to just deny reality. We are not over in the Middle East carrying-out the Project For A New American Century for no reason.


The reason Piper is critical to understanding the Kennedy Assassination is because he shows, beyond a doubt, that a mainline funding source had developed between the CIA and the American Syndicate that Israel was the main recipient of through Tibor Rosenbaum's Swiss Banque Du Credit Internacional. To ignore this is to ignore a prime motivation in the assassination that flourished and grew into the CONTRA cocaine economy and beyond. To try to ignore this with accusations of racism is just an excuse to not discuss Piper's evidence of Ben Gurion being forced-out of office because of a state of mental instability directly related to Kennedy's private negotiations with him. These letters are still classified. Hmm. Why would these political negotiations still be classified? Why are they in the same secret category as other highly sensitive documents related to the Assassination?


There's simple way to show who is right here. Ask Seamus to disprove anything Piper wrote. He won't be able to do it. No, if there's anything that flashing the racism card won't cover this is most certainly it! Why do you think his book is being attacked? I'm shocked that Kennedy researchers would practice the exact same methods as Warren Report defenders!

Albert I understand your frustrations. Yes, I agree and its one point I should have added to the points that I have made that far to often accusations of Anti Semitism and racism are thrown at people in the research field often on account of nothing said.

However a number of regimes benefited after he Kennedy assassination. Tell me how over joyed the Shah of Iran was to hear the news of the Pres's death how much did he go on to benefit look at Dudes like Mobutu. As for the crazy Christian and Jewish lobbies and so fourth I see no pattern but zealots and hardened capitalist neophytes like Crystal. The pattern is right wing paranoia and insanity.

This has reversed itself and come full circle in conspiratorial ramblings sadly.

[Albert Doyle]

I'm not sure what is really being said there. Piper does a good job showing that CIA developed an international alternative government in the form of the CIA/mob underground with its own financing structure. These people have successfully used the political objectives of a foreign country to justify a new mindset that has nothing to do with the original terms of our democracy and has effectively placed a military government on the people in replacement of our previous Constitutional definition. I think the argument that other powers may have benefited from Kennedy's assassination doesn't answer the main point. Very clearly there was a group with a mainline political connection to Israel that served to facilitate and cover-up the assassination. These groups, that is, both CIA and Israel, directly benefited from their assassinating president Kennedy. So much so that they owe their present power directly to the event. Zionism and the Cold War were used to form a rogue CIA government that used Israel's interests as an excuse for the creation of a shadow power that has been able to conceal this relationship ever since. Democracy ceased to be the main influence of this group, being replaced by the protection of Israel and defense against communism, all directly justifying the increasing power and dominance of this extra-democratic alliance and its covert methods. Israel was used as an outside base and firm backing by which to wedge against American democracy to its own interest. The restriction against passionate attachment to a foreign country was something that was directly spelled-out by our founding fathers for a reason. This new CIA government has put themselves above that however simply because they need to take power over the Constitution and its restraints against their shadow power. There's no doubt CIA used divide and conquer tactics against its own country and offered AIPAC and the zionists an opportunity to advance their power by means of Kennedy's assassination. They simply sold out America and its democracy, and the Israelis accepted the deal. Because of this we are now a country that commits war crimes and torture in open contempt while doing Israel's dirty work to the benefit of our CIA-connected Military Industrial Complex.

[Phil Dragoo]

This thread arose out of Stan's question:

1. I'd be interested to hear from members of the forum as to when you think the order came to assassinate President Kennedy was given. And, why at that time?
   

Though Angleton was on Oswald's file in the DDE2 Admin, and Helms-Scott et al were shoveling Cuba and Kostikov into the boiler prior, and the Alvarez fairy tale was dangled after, I find personal resonance in the statements of two friends regarding the time:


Our friend the Boston and New York financial adviser who reported in a two-page letter in 1998 to Robert Caro that in the summer of 1963 LBJ's financial advisor dropped into the Boston house as though part of a tour of Boston for a brief, rehearsed, hissed warning of what a "dangerous man this Kennedy is."


Our friend from Army intelligence tasked to establish the Chinese order of battle in the aftermath of the 1953 armistice who in reply to assassinations queries noted "what a dangerous president Kennedy wascaused a great deal of damage."


Hence my sense it was a decision of the powerful that they would not have the Fed tampered with, would not have the war industry disrupted, and would use clever cutouts to publicy demonstrate what the all-seeing eye at the top of the pyramid means.


It's clear it was a regime correction, expelling the rebel, installing the terra cotta Texan.


All are terra-cotta, none too big to fail. A movement so far above political, religious, national interest as to make lesser sponsor assertions bottle rockets bound for Mars.

[LR Trotter]

I recall as a 10th grade student, being allowed, as a group, to leave class to witness a presidential motorcade that passed 2 blocks from the school. And, after waiting a few minutes, the motorcade passed by. Amazingly different from Dallas, as no first lady, and no governor and his wife were in the car. Just President John F Kennedy sitting on the top of the back seat/trunk area as I remember. As they passed along Main Street in Houston, after leaving Rice University Stadium enroute to the Rice Hotel, I was on the right side about 12 feet from the car. We were about 2/3 of the approximate 3 mile distance, but 14 months and 10 days away from history. It's long been my opinion, that the assassination was successful because it was, very successful. Everything just occured just right. It could easily have been an attempt, but enough of an opportunity presented itself to a well prepared plan. That plan had not been finalized in '62. Or, at least all of the pieces were not in place and the time not yet right. Another difference from Dallas, I did not notice a vast number of cameras for the Houston motorcade, which still seems a little strange for so many films and photographs available for the assassination.

[Robert Morrow]

I'm beginning to sense this foreign source so tightly connected to the interests of the US government was the last straw that broke the resistance to commit treason within the US government.

Israel liaison Angleton had helped form Mossad and was actively bypassing Kennedy's prohibition of nuclear weapons for Israel by supplying Dimona with blueprints and materials behind Kennedy's back. This covert relationship and concomitant interests then backfilled through the French Connection 'trade' route eventually entering the US through Meyer Lansky who was pretty much synonymous with the US syndicate. I don't know who gave the orders but I have to imagine that once those inside the US realized they had reached equilibrium with this foreign power, that would make sure there were no international financial repercussions for killing Kennedy, this gave confidence to the CIA renegades that they now constituted a stronger 'government' than the formal one Kennedy embodied.

As politically sensitive as this is, if you are looking for the initiating cause of Kennedy's assassination you can't ignore this cabal. They had already enforced old world military order through the OAS by trying to take a shot at DeGaulle with their jackals.


.

Far and away the most likely answer.

"The Jews are our new backers" said Homer Echevarria on November 21, 1963. Homer then promptly dropped off the radar--nearly.

Judging by LBJ's frenetic behaviour in the preceeding 6 or 7 weeks I think Homer was a little behind the game but he was right nonetheless.

Israel (and its partners in the weapons manufacturing cabal) was the only party which made a tangible gain from JFK's murder.

Today we see Israel's psychopathy in full bloom but in 1963 no one would have suggested their involvement, let alone their sponsorship of this crime.

Israel was the prime mover in JFK's assassination, beyond reasonable doubt.

Zionists and Israel benefited greatly from the JFK assassination. Lyndon Johnson was very pro Zionist and pro Israel.

That does NOT mean that Israel or the Mossad had anything to do at all with the JFK assassination because they did NOT. The Key to the JFK assassination was the close ties of Lyndon Johnson and his Texas oil men Clint Murchison, Sr. and H.L. Hunt with the PEAK of post WW II US intelligence and elements of US military that hated JFK. Meaning folks like Allen Dulles, Nelson Rockefeller, Gen. Edward Lansdale, George Herbert Walker Bush, McGeorge Bundy, Gen. Curtis LeMay, Major General Charles Willoughby (very close to HL Hunt).

People like James Angleton, Richard Helms, David Atlee Phillips, E. Howard Hunt would be your mid level operation guys. GHW Bush operational as well.

There is just no credible evidence that Israel was involved in the JFK assassination.

[Scott Kaiser]

I'd be interested to hear from members of the forum as to when you think the order came to assassinate President Kennedy was given. And, why at that time?

Doesn't the Adele Edisen story tell us that the plan to kill JFK was in full swing in April of '63?

Did the planning start right after the Cuban Missile Crisis?

I am most curious to hear your thoughts on this.

When was the order given? Why at that time?

Doesn't the Adele Edisen story tell us that the plan to kill JFK was in full swing in April of '63?

I wouldn't know, but the plan to assassinate JFK was birthed much earlier than that.

Did the planning start right after the Cuban Missile Crisis?

No, it was birthed shortly after the BOP's, although, Kennedy did say to his wife Jackie during the CMC, "If anyone is gonna shoot me, now's the time to do it." [Not an exact quote, paraphrasing].

Was the plan to assassinate JFK birthed in Miami? Yes.

Rolando Masferrer's niece worked as a hotel operator at the Fontainebleau Hotel, she says she's overheard several conversations.

[Albert Doyle]

Was the plan to assassinate JFK birthed in Miami? Yes.

I think when JFK made the move against the JMWAVE station and stopped the attack boats headed for Cuba he sealed his fate and got many people to go along with the assassination. This restriction against the Cubans was probably used to win-over people who would not have gone along with the treason of murdering a president. No doubt higher ups in CIA took advantage of this move to convince those who would back them that JFK was most-certainly a traitor. JFK was acting under world-peace motives shown by Douglass that those who turned against him were incapable of appreciating.

[Tracy Riddle]

No, it was birthed shortly after the BOP's, although, Kennedy did say to his wife Jackie during the CMC, "If anyone is gonna shoot me, now's the time to do it." [Not an exact quote, paraphrasing].

I think you're referring to a story about Kennedy on the morning of 11/22/1963 in Fort Worth. JFK mused about how easy it would be for someone to shoot a president. He remarked "Last night would have been a hell of a night to assassinate a president...anyone perched above the crowd with a rifle could do it." Another version of the story has him saying, "There was the rain, the dark, and we were all getting jostled. Suppose a man had a pistol in a briefcase...Then he could have dropped the gun into the case, dropped the case, and melted into the crowd." (Death of a President) Kennedy apparently told variations of these stories a few times to different people during the trip. (Lone Star p265, p271; No Final Victories p158)