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Anthony - thank you.
Provocative, intriguing, frustrating - but again thank you for posting.
My own dealings with John DeCamp left me provoked, intrigued, frustrated but breathing horror.
"It means this War was never political at all, the politics was all theatre, all just to keep the people distracted...."
"Proverbs for Paranoids 4: You hide, They seek."
"They are in Love. Fuck the War."
Gravity's Rainbow, Thomas Pynchon
"Ccollanan Pachacamac ricuy auccacunac yahuarniy hichascancuta."
The last words of the last Inka, Tupac Amaru, led to the gallows by men of god & dogs of war
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Posted for the record. Jonathan Elinoff posted a direct link to this DPF thread on his Facebook page today, with the following attached:
"Since the former Sheriff Sullivan of Arapahoe County is currently dealing with charges of probation violations for having continued hot urine tests, I am being asked to give a statement on the matter. I will say this, when a person is charged with the crimes he is charged with and has a hot UA, they go to jail immediately. A 2nd hot UA and they go to prison. He has 5 hot UAs and has seen nothing. Remember, he is a person who is also getting away with the crimes he wasn't charged with (giving HIV to people and 3 different cases of potential premeditated homicide as well as sex with minors and possibly more charges) So if you want to know what I think, I ask you this: Where are the public officials who are supposed to be doing their damn jobs here? That man is a predator and a threat to our safe streets. He shamed the badge he wore for years. We trusted him to be the person he was celebrated for, and he turned out to be a horrible human being. No one in this town has the guts or the courage to stand up to bad people anymore, and the Sheriff Sullivan story is the pinnacle of that. I was one of the few who did what I could to get something done about Sullivan, but I could only do so much. I found a thread online that very clearly explains what happened with my story and for those who don't know it, I will say this. I am a very passionate human being. I put up with a lot over the years, being told I couldn't do things or being called crazy and meanwhile I had one of the most trafficked websites on the internet in history and broke some very major stories on those sites. It was an incredible experience and I wouldn't give it up for anything. Same with all those years as an activist. But for me to just shut all my websites down and delete as much as I could with my name on it from the internet, that has to tell you something. It tells you that some really serious sh*t happened. But I moved on to new chapters in my life. And in short, you can read what happened in this thread I found someone posted online, it captures what can be said about it"
................
I had a phone conversation with Jonathan a few months ago which offered further details, some of which pulled my head further down the rabbit hole, which aren't easily summarised, and which alluded to deep goings on that still haunt me somewhat. His pertinent point above still stands though. He dug deep, stirred up some very murky waters, and the fact that he needed to beat a retreat is possibly more telling than any other info he could have divulged. He mentioned the possibility of a book coming out about some of the story (the Sullivan expose and resultant fireworks and life-lessons learned). I hope it does.
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Grim and fascinating stuff. Thanks for the update. I can only imagine what horrors Jonathan Elinoff must have encountered to have backed away from the subject to the degree that he has. The mind boggles.
“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him.â€
― Leo Tolstoy,
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Weird and not surprising it is weird. I just looked and Sullivan is to be sentenced tomorrow. There is an old expression, "tell the truth, but then run like hell!"
"Let me issue and control a nation's money and I care not who writes the laws. - Mayer Rothschild
"Civil disobedience is not our problem. Our problem is civil obedience! People are obedient in the face of poverty, starvation, stupidity, war, and cruelty. Our problem is that grand thieves are running the country. That's our problem!" - Howard Zinn
"If there is no struggle there is no progress. Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and never will" - Frederick Douglass
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Anthony, can you provide some insights about Vreeland please?
Some years ago I was in contact with him over his 911 claims and found him to be entirely untrustworthy (I think he helped to bring Mike Ruppert down btw). As an example, I particularly pressed him on his claim that he had the direct telephone line number of Alan Greenspan at the Fed. He tried parrying the question (and a number of other questions about claims he made) but eventually felt cornered enough to provide it. It turned out to be the main switchboard number of the Fed Gee, what a surprise. I marked him as a con-man because of his quickly formed but close "business" relationship with Leo Wanta - who was a paid government snitch. Maybe Vreeland was a government snitch too?
The shadow is a moral problem that challenges the whole ego-personality, for no one can become conscious of the shadow without considerable moral effort. To become conscious of it involves recognizing the dark aspects of the personality as present and real. This act is the essential condition for any kind of self-knowledge. Carl Jung - Aion (1951). CW 9, Part II: P.14
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David Guyatt Wrote:I marked him as a con-man because of his quickly formed but close "business" relationship with Leo Wanta - who was a paid government snitch.
I think Leo Wanta has made an appearance here before. Once or twice.
"The philosophers have only interpreted the world, in various ways. The point, however, is to change it." Karl Marx
"He would, wouldn't he?" Mandy Rice-Davies. When asked in court whether she knew that Lord Astor had denied having sex with her.
“I think it would be a good idea” Ghandi, when asked about Western Civilisation.
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As a member or subject?
The shadow is a moral problem that challenges the whole ego-personality, for no one can become conscious of the shadow without considerable moral effort. To become conscious of it involves recognizing the dark aspects of the personality as present and real. This act is the essential condition for any kind of self-knowledge. Carl Jung - Aion (1951). CW 9, Part II: P.14
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David Guyatt Wrote:As a member or subject?
As a subject. I shoud do a search but I'm doing some thing else on the computer.
"The philosophers have only interpreted the world, in various ways. The point, however, is to change it." Karl Marx
"He would, wouldn't he?" Mandy Rice-Davies. When asked in court whether she knew that Lord Astor had denied having sex with her.
“I think it would be a good idea” Ghandi, when asked about Western Civilisation.
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I have to be cryptic here for the moment. Jonathan Elinoff posted a short while ago on Facebook (after the above) that he was preparing to upload a video detailing Sullivan's crimes. I'm hoping that will appear sometime across the next week or so, or sooner. Equally, Jonathan mentioned to me that he had a book in preparation, and I'm curious to what extent this, and the video, will cover the various bits and pieces that he told me. Because if Jonathan takes the public conversation into certain areas in either the video, or the book, I can assume a safe light to discuss some additional info that he told me. Also, however, vice versa. His recommendations were very clear.
All that said it's very funny David has brought the conversation round to this area. In fact, when I saw the brief snippet of Dave's post, and Magda's reply, in the activity stream on the DPF main page, it brought me up short. Insofar in that I've wondered more than once if the conversation would go in this direction.
That said, this is a situation a little bit beyond the norm, and I can't be anything more than unhelpful for the time being. Elinoff is no Joe Pesci, but when I remember the phone call I had with him - long, lucid, naming names, the facts and assertions pouring out in a torrent, and long buried puzzle pieces hinting, hauntingly, at other deeper puzzles - the clip below comes to mind for a great many reasons.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ema7lfEAMk
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And in the interim - this is the 15 minute trailer for the abandoned ECHOES OF TREASON. It was marked as private two years ago, but is now back up. It highlights news footage, but not the newly shot material and interviews that Jonathan onetime posted screenshots of on his Facebook page.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GReHupXbYiY
This second glitzy trailer was done to highlight Jonathan's motion graphics stills. It has lots of music, only a little footage, but I notice there are some questions asked in the narration that I suspect hint towards the investigative work Jon did during the three years of production.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0lFzE1UvIU
He debated onetime including the Sullivan material in the film, or an additional sequel. The events outlined earlier in this thread obviously changed his mind. I'll post more info as it appears, or when it seems appropriate.
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