Poking More Holes in Judyth Baker

[David Josephs]

Scott gets it.

Albert, you were not there. Debra was.

This is a mistake you make often.

And as David says, what she is describing is Harvey--through and through.

You probably misunderstand my intent. I think JVB has exposed herself with several provably false claims. Especially the Mexico one. However if you read David's post more closely there's no doubt he's saying that Anna Lewis must have seen Lee since Harvey was in Russia at the time.

Also, Anna Lewis responds to JVB quickly at one point of the interview regarding the degree of JVB's involvement with Oswald. The body language of Anna's instant response to JVB bespeaks truthfulness and reacting to a real memory. Anna says "I could say some things but I won't" (as if she could add some details about the degree of JVB's sexual involvement with Oswald). Unless this was a really good team of liars it appears she's being truthful.

"However if you read David's post more closely there's no doubt he's saying that Anna Lewis must have seen Lee since Harvey was in Russia at the time."

I suggest Albert that IF Anna is truthful and she does see a Lee Oswald in Feb 1962, it could not be Harvey in Minsk... So who could it have been "IF" she is truthful

I suggest that the only possbility is Lee, yet the way JVB and Anna describe the situation, Marina would have to have been married to LEE... which was not the case.

The whole point though of bringing up Anna with JVB in the room and the stopping and starting of the interview is that all she needs to say is that she met Lee in May-June 1963 in New Orleans...
She NEVER says this... Jan-Apr 1962 is repeated.

IF these are just stories being told - one has to wonder what JVB was thinking by letting her friend Anna tell such a story as to negate corroboration for JVB having been with Marina's husband.

The other concern is an obvious one... Harvey was heavily into photography - just look at the collection of equipment taken from him after his arrest...
In all this time there is not a single photo of JVB, even without Harvey... yet we do have someone else's paycheck stub from 3 years earlier among a mountian of junk... ?!?!?

We have his photo of Roscoe White in Japan described by Marina as "Friends of Lee's"... yet no JVB (no granted, he also has no photos of Ferrie or Shaw or Ruby yet he was not supposedly in love with these other people)

Was Anna even in New Orleans during the summer of 63? If not, she'd be the only one as just about every one Harvey encounters or utilitizes is connected to intelligence...
But the Cancer research prodigy supported by George Smathers and hired by 2 CIA fronts and provided cover jobs during this period as well as when at college in FL, was not...

She was/is a genius. Is it really so hard to imagine her using that intellect to craft a story and supporting evidence to divide the research community?
Which makes the whole Anna Lewis interview so strange...

And we did not even mention Reason #1 - the W-2 Copy B that shouldn't be in her possession in the first place and is not a form ever used by the IRS in the second.

What is her/their answer to that?

[Albert Doyle]

Maybe Anna met Lee in Jan-Apr 1962 and then met Harvey in 1963? That way she could insist she first met Oswald in 1962. Since JVB doesn't believe in Harvey & Lee they are just muddying up the timing of the marriage to Marina. But Anna is emphatic that it was Jan-Apr 1962.

[David Josephs]

Maybe Anna met Lee in Jan-Apr 1962 and then met Harvey in 1963? That way she could insist she first met Oswald in 1962. Since JVB doesn't believe in Harvey & Lee they are just muddying up the timing of the marriage to Marina. But Anna is emphatic that it was Jan-Apr 1962.

But then why confuse the issue by even mentioning Jan-Apr 1962? H&L existing was not to be revealed, especially with JVB in the room... ???

This is eaither a monumental slip-up or the revealing of info that shouldn't have been... and was STILL not edited out when given the chance...

[Albert Doyle]

JVB and her motives are yet to be determined. JVB simply could not control Anna's real memory. If she edited it out she would have been caught.

[Jim DiEugenio]

Then why use her as a witness?

And why say repeatedly that she backs up JVB.

The Lewis angle detracts from what I see as the two strongest parts of the article: the W2 question and the mess they made of Clinton/Jackson.

And let me add, the fact they misconstrued Clinton/Jackson shows just how strong that part of the story has gotten over the years. This, in spite of efforts by the likes of Lambert, and Summers to try and negate it.

The work done there by Bill Davy, Joan Mellen and myself has really made this incident stronger than its ever been. People like Summers, and Baker and her followers simply did not do their homework. As I have said before, I have read all the declassified files of both Garrison and the HSCA on this, plus I have been there three times, and I have read what Joan Mellen wrote about it. And my ideas about just how important this thing was and how deep it went have gotten much more sophisticated as time has gone on. No one can just skim it and think they know each and every angle of it. That is what I think Platzman and Baker did.

[Albert Doyle]

This makes me realize the original FPCC provocateur expansion into Mexico could have been planned to get Lee into Mexico in order to see if he could pass himself off as Oswald. That is, to get those on this side of the plan adjusted to Lee being Oswald. Think about how convenient it would be for a Northwoods-type plan against Cuba using the assassination for a trigger if you had a free Oswald to play with on the Mexican/Cuban side. It is possible something went wrong and Lee didn't make it to the set-up part of the plan in Mexico. There could be merit to this because Lee would be less fluent in Russian like the impostor was. Maybe Lee didn't make Mexico because the plan shifted to assassination instead of the previous plan. This required the clumsy set-up in Mexico that occurred. If this is true then whatever caused Lee to no-show in Mexico probably caused Harvey to be set-up at the theater instead of smuggled out.

[Jim Hargrove]

And we did not even mention Reason #1 - the W-2 Copy B that shouldn't be in her possession in the first place and is not a form ever used by the IRS in the second.

What is her/their answer to that?

I was just going to ask about that. Have you seen any pushback at all from her camp on this?

[David Josephs]

This makes me realize the original FPCC provocateur expansion into Mexico could have been planned to get Lee into Mexico in order to see if he could pass himself off as Oswald. That is, to get those on this side of the plan adjusted to Lee being Oswald. Think about how convenient it would be for a Northwoods-type plan against Cuba using the assassination for a trigger if you had a free Oswald to play with on the Mexican/Cuban side. It is possible something went wrong and Lee didn't make it to the set-up part of the plan in Mexico. There could be merit to this because Lee would be less fluent in Russian like the impostor was. Maybe Lee didn't make Mexico because the plan shifted to assassination instead of the previous plan. This required the clumsy set-up in Mexico that occurred. If this is true then whatever caused Lee to no-show in Mexico probably caused Harvey to be set-up at the theater instead of smuggled out.

Lee was not in Mexico either Albert... I spell it out in great detail in those 6 articles... These reports never see the light of day for years to come...

The man "Oswald" is acknowledged NOT to have been seen anywhere but the Embassies and his room... Everyone tries so very hard to put our Oswald in Mexico... Reports from 1975 from the CIA still say that he entered and left by automobile - regardless of what the FBI says he did....

DJ

[Albert Doyle]

Lee was not in Mexico either Albert... I spell it out in great detail in those 6 articles... These reports never see the light of day for years to come...

The man "Oswald" is acknowledged NOT to have been seen anywhere but the Embassies and his room... Everyone tries so very hard to put our Oswald in Mexico... Reports from 1975 from the CIA still say that he entered and left by automobile - regardless of what the FBI says he did....

DJ

Agreed. However it strikes me that an uncarried-out plan possibly existed using the Harvey & Lee situation where Lee was intended to be the Mexico Oswald walking through all those set-ups in order to create a Lee Harvey Oswald who had actually pulled-off all those sheep-dipping events. This would have created a fully fleshed-out Northwoods Oswald who cooperated with Kostikov and intended flight to Cuba after JFK's assassination. The Mexico plan that actually occurred looks like a clumsy one that was done on the fly in order to replace the original one where Lee would have fit right in.

[Scott Kaiser]

This is all way to confusing for me. Albert says,

Also, Anna Lewis responds to JVB quickly at one point of the interview regarding the degree of JVB's involvement with Oswald.

would or could anyone tell me how many times the two spoke to each prior to taping the interview?

What am I trying to say?

Also, these dates of Lee and Harvey are also very confusing. I have reason to believe that Oswald, and I'm talking about the Lee Harvey Oswald no doubles, but Lee was in Miami either November 1962, December 1962 or January 1963.

I wish I could pinpoint the exact month only because it would help narrow down my mother's story of when my father took his trip down to Miami.

Would anyone know if Oswald was down in Miami on anyone of those months? Thanks.