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Judyth Vary Baker: Living in Exile
#41
Jim, the Judyth Vary story is very interesting and one which seems to fit a typical pattern in many intel victims that I am familiar with.

When Tosh Plumlee says he thinks there is something important somewhere in Judyth's history, then I would tend to believe him. Tosh is the real deal from what I know of him. I remember an article about him many years ago about his high altitude parachute jumping which I found fascinating.

Jim, for whatever reasons, I think you have tapped into something big here with your recent interest and communications with Judyth Vary. I just don't know what it is, but it does seem to have some teeth and needs to be thoroughly researched.

I do not have the factual knowledge to evaluate the issues being argued about between Judyth and her detractors and those who doubt much of her story, and therefore I cannot evaluate who is correct on what parts of her story or not. And beyond all that I believe her claim that she has been harassed and is still being harassed. I think it is likely that it is because of some fact which is a thread that when pulled could open up a very big issue that intel does not want opened up.

I stand with my initial view that when comparing the overall situation around Judyth as described, it fits well with many of the cases I am familiar with of intel harassment of folks who know too much about certain government secrets (actual operations or just sources and methods they don't want revealed), folks that somebody high up decides have to be harassed, discredited and stalked. And often there are break-ins along with the stalking, theft of personal items, interference with personal communications and mail, harassment by the IRS and taxing authorities and other government entities and interference in obtaining and holding employment. There are even cases where complex psyops are initiated to turn one's family members against the target.

And now it is known that much of this harassment work is being subcontracted out to specialized corporations that have their own intel operations due to the government's obsession with privatization. This gives even less accountability of intel, breeds lawlessness and provides even better deniability. I can say that I am amazed at just how many resources intel agencies can muster when they want someone stalked, harassed, discredited and beat down. Intel has folks embedded almost everywhere it seems, even though it has been technically illegal for the CIA and miltel to working domestically. Read former Gov. Jesse Ventura's book if you doubt this, or consider operation mockingbird.

Coordinated Psyops programs are the big thing now and like Tosh suggests, only rarely does the government resort to murder anymore unless it is a firsthand witness who directly threatens the existence of a very important deep cover black op. And a fair number of these harassments are carried out as training operations for new intel trainees, some in miltel, some in police intel, and some in various intel units of alphabet agencies. And some of these psyops are used as human subject experiments on how to develop better mind control and interception operations in the future. There appears to be no shortage of new personnel with no consciences to do this dirty work and no apparent shortage of money to finance these operations either.

The best way to stop these illegal activities is to defend them, and these intel agencies know this and that is why some of them are so committed and addicted to raising money from illegal arms sales and drug trafficking. Some of the top officials are allowed to take a cut off the top as long as they funnel a good portion of these funds into special offshore accounts.

So you have a very interesting Lady Judyth Vary who has several important established facts surrounding her story. And then we have some respected researchers disagree with her on much of the rest of her information she has presented and claimed. They imply she is confabulating and doubt her overall veracity. And others who have heard her story believe that she is truthful but perhaps misunderstood and taken out of context.

Even if any of her story is proven to have been partly or mostly incorrect this does not impact the important facts that have already been established. In a number of cases I am very familiar with it usually turns out the reason the person is being harassed by intel is not what the target understands, it turns out to be some small detail or fact that some higher up in intel has decided must remain covered up. Sometimes this is for personal reasons to protect oneself or career, or some long term set of operations, and often to protect and ongoing program that the public would not tolerate it if it became known.

And of course there is always the somewhat infrequent case where one agency pushes a cover up too hard or carelessly on purpose in order to create a leak, and then they work to manage it the way they want. Thus they may do this to expose a program which is competing for dollars, etc., in order to discredit that program or those responsible, sometimes for political reasons, too. I don't know first hand, but I was once told of a secret conflict between the air force and Nasa over funding and that the af had instituted several operations to discredit Nasa and maker their funding much more difficult. It is possible that some agency is using the Judyth matter to pull a string to expose a competitor or stop a program they don't believe in for whatever reason. Quite often a lot of these Psyops matters are very strange in their etiology and hidden agendas.

One more thing. Now is the time for a little compassion. Whatever the way Judyth's story plays out after her book is released for sale, there appears to be no reason to disbelieve that she has had great difficulties to deal with since the JFK assassination for probably a myriad of reasons. And she is a survivor. I say hat's off to her for that and I can empathize with all that she has gone through because of being harassed, because I have seen this type of occurrence a number of times close up. It does occur, it is real, and it usually occurs for unknown reasons which typically take time and a lot of research to sort out. And the most prominent feature ALWAYS is the part related to the DISCREDITING of the target, which is accomplished by top experts in many cases. This strong effort is always a part of any "interception" psyop whether or not related to embellishments or claims of ones story.

I have been told of a number of cases where a high level "asset" with a lot of first hand knowledge of criminal deep cover black ops wanted to "retire". In order to be allowed to walk away with no future ties, the op must agree to allow himself to be arrested, tried and convicted for some offense (whether he did it or not) and it might involve the use of a photo-accurate double if necessary. The more serious the operations that the op was involved in (especially seriously criminal and international deep cover black ops), the more serious the rigged offense and the longer the jail time, that is, the more total the discrediting must be.

Some ops who go off the reservation are arrested for trumped up offenses and some are real, like Edwin Wilson, who broke the law at the direction of his "country" and then was hung out to dry because he allegedly got sloppy and got caught. Or Michael Reconosuito who went off the reservation and testified in the infamous and unresolved Inslaw case and has been made a permanent intel prisoner because of it. Or take the case of Aldrich Ames who was supposedly arrested to being a double agent and taking money as a part of his regular job. This is standard operating procedure for some agents in his capacity and position. But the real reason he was arrested and put away was that he was the one the German BKA called regarding the plane headed for "Lockerbee" and said there is a bomb being loaded on the plane, what do yo want us to do? Ames allegedly said, "let it go" and this was allegedly done to get rid of Charles Tiny McKee and his crew which uncovered the opium pipeline via TWA and were coming back to report it and stop it. That is allegedly the real reason that Ames sits in prison, it was his competitors way of justice.

It is always important to understand that interception ops and psyoops are usually conducted according to formulas which have been determined in the field over many years to be effective. The local police and Sheriffs usually always "stand-down" when credentials and badges are flipped out. Employers usually want to "serve their country" especially after the 9/11 attacks with all the concern for "terrorism". Utility companies, phone and internet providers jump like a monkey on a string to requests for assistance. The major media are usually very, very compliant with requests by intel. You get the picture here. It is very hard for a victim to ever get a fair shake.
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#42
Quote:So you are telling me (by indirection) that you do not believe that Lyndon, J. Edgar, Nixon, and the others, including the Joint Chiefs, were involved?
Not at all. I’m asking how your source can be so certain when he states that “We also KNOW that the JCS ordered the termination of JFK with extreme prejudice and a "signed finding" (by the will of Hoover, LBJ, Nixon, Bush1, Dulles, etc.) and this was likely detailed to the CIA…”

I think we can very reasonably speculate that the JCS might have ordered the termination, but that’s it. And while I’m sure that Lyndon, J. Edgar, Nixon and others were delighted to see their President executed in public, and that the first two played important roles in the cover-up, your source – if I’m reading it correctly – places them in the planning committee, no? Which makes for quite a star-studded conspiracy, I guess. It seems to contradict what I understand about compartmentalization, plausible denial, and “need to know”, but I’m open to seeing more evidence.

That said, I’ll admit to being only vaguely aware of the Murchison meeting you mention. Again, sounds awfully convenient to me, a bit like Hunt’s death bed confession, which I take to be the final act of a pathological liar and lifetime Company man, and therefore basically worthless.

Since you mention the Douglass book, a quick scan brings up nothing on this meeting. Not that JFK and the Unspeakable should be the final word on anything, but I thought one of its great strengths was its discernment. You know how vulnerable the research community is. Sloppy assertions of certainty are feasted upon by your critics.

Quote:I never ceases to amaze me how many students of JFK don't have a clue about some of its most basic elements. Do you know the X-rays were altered, another brain was substituted, and the Zapruder film was recreated? Have you ever studied any of my books about his death? Have you picked up Doug Horne's five books? I'm just the least bit curious about where you are coming from.
Yes, I’m persuaded that X-rays were altered and the brain was substituted. The Z-film recreation? Not so much, but I don’t dismiss the possibility and I look forward to reading the Horne books. One day, that is. I’m barely a “student of JFK”, Dr. Fetzer – just an interested reader!

By the way, and with respect, I strongly disagree with you and your source's opinion on 'chemtrails'. I would expect an expert on psy-ops to make a better call on that one, since the whole sorry business of 'chemtrails' is either that - a psy-op - or a particularly successful internet troll-hole.
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#43
Judith sent me yesterday some recent photos of herself and friends in the country of her exile. Without her permission, I'll not post them, but they show a 'determined sadness' IMO. FWIW
"Let me issue and control a nation's money and I care not who writes the laws. - Mayer Rothschild
"Civil disobedience is not our problem. Our problem is civil obedience! People are obedient in the face of poverty, starvation, stupidity, war, and cruelty. Our problem is that grand thieves are running the country. That's our problem!" - Howard Zinn
"If there is no struggle there is no progress. Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and never will" - Frederick Douglass
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#44
Some extracts from Edward T. Haslam, Dr. Mary's Monkey: How the Unsolved Murder of a Doctor, a Secret Laboratory in New Orleans and Cancer-Causing Monkey Viruses are Linked to Lee Harvey Oswald, the JFK Assassination and Emerging Global Epidemics

Chapter 17

The Witness
......

60M ["60 Minutes"] asked Oswald’s girl friend all the logical questions: “Where are you from? Why were you in New Orleans? Where did you work? Where did you live? How did you meet Lee? What did you do together? Did you ever hear the subject of killing JFK discussed?” And Oswald’s girlfriend kept answering them. Before long 60M realized that their sizzling little romance between a beautiful young woman and a soon-to-be-accused assassin had morphed into an 800 pound gorilla with “serious politics” written all over it. The adulteress sitting in front of them stated that she and Lee Harvey Oswald stood side-by-side in an underground medical laboratory located in David Ferrie’s apartment on Louisiana Avenue Parkway in New Orleans and that she was the laboratory technician that handled the cancer-causing monkey viruses which were being used to develop a biological weapon for the purpose of killing Fidel Castro. To put the icing on the cake, the entire project was secretly directed by the famous Dr. Alton Ochsner (former President of the American Cancer Society) and supervised by a prestigious cancer researcher named Dr. Mary Sherman who worked for Dr. Ochsner at his hospital. Further, after successfully killing numerous monkeys with their new biological weapon, this group had tested it on a human subject in a mental hospital, killing the human. Lethal human experiments! Leaders of American medicine and the accused assassin of the American President involved together in developing a biological weapon! Can you hear 60M’s signature sound effect ticking in the background?

........

When it became clear that the woman brought to me by 60M was not the same person I met in 1972, I realized that I had met two separate women claiming to be “Judyth Vary Baker” who claimed to have known “Lee Oswald.” Simply said, one had to be an impostor. With the information available to me at that time, I could not tell 60M which one was the impostor. I hoped they would be able to tell me. At that point, 60M pulled the plug on the Judyth story. The rank-and-file CBS producers and investigators had worked hard on the story. They were extremely disappointed by the decision from their bosses to terminate the story. One insider forwarded me an email written by a senior 60M executive in which he stated that 60M had spend more time and money investigating Judyth’s story than they had on any story in their 20 year history. To refuse to air the story after making that kind of investment was difficult decision for them. It makes one wonder “Who really made 60M’s decision to abort?” and “Why?”

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After the 60M debacle, I contacted Judyth Vary Baker directly. I was curious about this unusual woman and wanted to learn more about her. If she could show me that she was the real Judyth Vary Baker, then it meant the other Judyth Vary Baker that I had met in 1972 was the impostor. This raised some very interesting questions: Why would someone have gone to the trouble to impersonate Baker back in 1972? How did they know who she was? How did they know about her connection to Oswald? Why was I invited to her party? Why did they tell me her name?

............

Judyth picked a restaurant where she knew the owner. When we got there, she introduced me to the owner who remembered her fondly, and we were shown a table in the back where we could talk. For the next several hours, Judyth displayed binders of documents she had collected and neatly organized over the years and told me her story, page by page. It was only then that I really began to understand the dimensions of what she was saying. Finally, I looked at her carefully, studying her pensive blue eyes and her coke-bottle thick glasses, and said “You are telling me that you personally stood in David Ferrie’s apartment with Lee Oswald at your side, day after day, and worked with cancer-causing monkey viruses so that you could develop a biological weapon to kill Fidel Castro?”

“Yes,” she said.

.............

Several years after the Warren Commission “investigation,” the investigators working for New Orleans District Attorney Jim Garrison tracked down another young woman named Anna Lewis, a waitress who worked at Thompson’s Restaurant - a favorite gathering spot for the anti-Castro crowd around Lafayette Square in downtown New Orleans. At the time, Anna was married to David Lewis, who had worked for another “ex-FBI” agent Guy Banister. Today we have video testimony from Anna Lewis recorded in 2003 and made available on the internet by Dutch JFK researcher Wim Dankbaar. In this interview, Anna clearly states that she knew Lee Oswald and that Oswald was a regular customer at Thompson’s in 1963. Further, she states that she and her husband socialized with Lee and Judyth together on a number of occasions. More importantly Anna Lewis admits that she lied to District Attorney Garrison and his investigators when they asked her about Oswald. Had Anna Lewis told Garrison the truth, Garrison could have easily tracked down Judyth. Garrison was already suspicious of Ochsner and his role in the media exposure of Oswald. If Garrison had had access to Judyth, and if Judyth told Garrison what she now tells us - that she and Lee were working on a biological weapon project under the direction of Dr. Alton Ochsner, Garrison’s investigation (and his whole life) might have turned out very differently. But she didn’t. Anna Lewis lied to Garrison because she was afraid. Meanwhile, Judyth hid silently because she was afraid. Two critical pieces of evidence were unavailable to the American people and their elected representatives (like Garrison) at the time they were pondering who killed their President. Now that we know differently, is it time to reconsider our history?

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............

This may be intoxicating news for those concerned about Judyth’s credibility and what she can tell us about Lee Oswald, but it is sobering to those of us worried about the fate of the biological weapon. This means that Judyth Vary Baker really did have the technical skills to handle the cancer-causing monkey viruses that might be used to create a biological weapon. Yes, Judyth Vary Baker had the technical qualifications to be “the technician” that did “the bench work” in the Ferrie-Sherman medical laboratory. Hearing Judyth admit that as a 19-year old she assisted Lee Harvey Oswald, David Ferrie, Dr. Mary Sherman, and Dr. Alton Ochsner in their efforts to develop a biological weapon is … a brain-buster! I guess I have my witness.

[quote name='Edward Haslam' post='185549' date='Mar 3 2010, 03:55 PM']Jack,

Thanks for your questions. I have great admiration for the work that you have done over the years. I will say that I am confident that if you read ME AND LEE with the same "close scrutiny" that you have used to study all those photos, then you will come to reasonable answers... whatever they may be. And I will be interested to hear your thought about them when you do.

From my own experience, I will say that, despite the considerable contact that I had with Judyth since Nov. 2000 and all of the other previous attempts by others to recount her tale, I did not understand "the flow" of her story. While I did think that certain "landmarks" grounded her story (such as the W2 form from Reily Coffee and her time at Roswell Park Cancer Institute), there was still a forest of unanswered questions for me. I found much of her tale "disconnected" and her retelling of it "confusing," particularly on important issues like how she became involved with people like Dr. Alton Ochsner and the erratic path of her college career. I queried Judyth relentlessly about these issues, the gaps in the story, and many other issues. There were many tense moments during this process, and she became frustrated with me at times. But I finally realized this was because there were things that she was reluctant to discuss, some for personal reasons. This process took more time than I anticipated, but eventually what I found was that the key to understanding her New Orleans activities lies in the years before she ever arrived in New Orleans and before she ever met Lee Oswald. I finally realized that understanding what made young "Judy Vary" tick was as important as anything we have heard to date about her romance with Lee Oswald. She was the resource that they needed to create the bio-weapon secretly, and there is nothing glorious or glamorous about killing baby mice, amputating their tumors and grinding them up in a blender. In fact, she became disgusted with what she was doing and realized that she had been lead down the path of evil by those she trusted. In the final analysis, I consider Judyth "a witness," not "a researcher," and I think that her story must be understood in that light. But the questions remain: What insights can we gain from the recollections of this witness? And do they help us understand what happened in Dallas?

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Overall, I will say that my view of her Judyth shifted as I read ME AND LEE. The portrait is paints of her is not particularly flattering, but it rings true. And it is a better grounded story than I expected to find. One that makes far more sense than anything I had heard from earlier versions. One whose pieces fit together better than I had expected. One that I hope that you (and the others seriously concerned about this subject) will read with an open mind.
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My Best,
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Ed Haslam
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#45
Some extracts from Edward T. Haslam, Dr. Mary's Monkey: How the Unsolved Murder of a Doctor, a Secret Laboratory in New Orleans and Cancer-Causing Monkey Viruses are Linked to Lee Harvey Oswald, the JFK Assassination and Emerging Global Epidemics

Chapter 17

The Witness (Extract 2)

Here is a brief summary of the parts of Judyth’s story that are relevant to the our inquiry. A more in depth account is the appendix entitled “Judyth’s Story.”

1. Judyth went to New Orleans in the summer of 1963 at the invitation of Dr. Alton Ochsner.

2. Ochsner had known Judyth for several years and had previously arranged for her to be trained at the famous cancer research center discussed above.

3. Ochsner promised Judyth early-admission to Tulane Medical School in return for her services in Dr. Mary Sherman’s cancer lab at Ochsner Clinic. Ochsner also provided her with cancer research papers on the state-of-the-art techniques such as cancer-causing viruses.

4. Judyth wound up working under Sherman’s direction in the underground medical laboratory in David Ferrie’s apartment instead of in her cancer lab at the Ochsner clinic.

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5. Judyth met Lee Oswald at the Post Office in what she thought was a chance encounter. In hind-sight, she realized that this had to be intentional, since Lee was already working with David Ferrie, Dr. Mary Sherman and Dr. Alton Ochsner on the bio-weapon at the time. Lee introduced her to “Dr. David Ferrie” the following day and helped Judyth find an apartment.

6. When Judyth went to meet Dr. Ochsner in a room within the bowels of Charity Hospital, Lee Oswald accompanied her to the appointment and went in first to meet with Dr. Ochsner alone.

7. Lee was working with ex-FBI agent Guy Banister as has been reported by many sources. Lee took Judyth to meet Banister in his office to satisfy her concerns that the bio-weapons project is really a secret government operation. Banister confirmed that Lee was working with them on a get-Castro project.10

8. When Judyth went to Dr. Sherman’s apartment for a private dinner with her, David Ferrie was the only other guest. Sherman and Ferrie discussed the nature of their project with Judyth. They deemed the idea of using cancer-causing viruses to kill Castro as morally ethical since is might prevent World War III. Lee phoned Judyth that same night at Sherman’s apartment. Dr. Mary Sherman was the operational director of “the project.” Ferrie and Oswald were participants.

9. Lee escorted and transported Judyth all over town, including to Dr. Sherman’s apartment where Judyth dropped off “the product” and related reports for Sherman’s review. Lee was “the runner.”

10. Judyth and Lee were provided cover-jobs at Reily Coffee Company where they were allowed to slip out several afternoons a week to work in the underground medical laboratory in David Ferrie’s apartment. 11

11. Lee Oswald’s connections to the Mafia in New Orleans are much stronger than have ever been reported publicly.

12 Judyth and Lee ate-for-free at restaurants owned by Carlos Marcello and went to his headquarters (500 Club and Town & Country Motel).

12. Lee’s role in the kill-Castro portion of the project was to transport the bio-weapon into Cuba. The radio debates and film clips of Oswald’s leafleting were arranged by Ochsner (at Oswald’s request) to make Oswald appear to be an authentic defector so he could get into Cuba more easily.

13. Judyth heard the subject of assassinating JFK was discussed at various times by various people, including Ferrie, Sherman and Oswald. Part of the logic that was explained to Judyth was that they had to hurry up and kill Castro with their bio-weapon before Ochsner’s friend ran out of patience and decided to kill Kennedy instead.

14. After testing their bio-weapon on dozens of monkeys, they arranged to test it on a human “volunteer,” a convict brought from Angola State Penitentiary to the Jackson State Mental Hospital in rural Louisiana for that purpose. The weapon was successful. The man died in 28 days as a result.

15. Judyth wrote a letter to Dr. Ochsner protesting the use of an unwitting human in their bio-weapon test and delivered it to his secretary.13 Upon seeing the letter, Ochsner exploded in anger and threatened both Judyth and Lee. Everything fell apart for Judyth as a result. Ochsner reneged on his offer to place Judyth in Tulane Medical School. Lee was ordered to Dallas. Judyth went back to Florida with her husband.

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16. For the next few months, Judyth and Lee stayed in contact by telephone, thanks to access to the Mafia’s “secret” Miami-to-Las Vegas sports betting lines courtesy of David Ferrie. While the phone company and the U.S. Government might not have been able to listen to their conversations, the Mafia would have been able to!

17. On Wednesday, November 20, 1963, Lee told Judyth that there would be a real attempt to kill President Kennedy when he visits Dallas on Friday. It is the last time they talked.

But we are not here to figure out who killed JFK. We are trying to understand who was using radiation to mutate monkey viruses and why. Judyth’s testimony is an important piece of the puzzle for us to have. Judyth’s account means that a witness who participated in “the project” (as they called it) has confessed that both she and Lee Oswald were operational members of the Ferrie-Sherman underground medical laboratory and that they knew that they were developing a biological weapon. This is a major point. Think about how difficult it would have been to investigate and prosecute Lee Oswald in a court of law for killing Kennedy without exposing that laboratory, its sponsors, the cancer-causing viruses that contaminated the polio vaccine, and all of the ethical and medical questions arising from their irradiation of a flotilla of dangerous monkey viruses. Can you imagine the publicity? The political fall-out? With one side of Lee’s life connected to anti-Communists like Ochsner, Reily, and Banister (and perhaps the FBI and the CIA) and the other side connected to Carlos Marcello and almost everyone around him, Oswald’s trial would have exposed everything. Whether Oswald had anything to do with killing Kennedy or not, the exposure of a trial would have created obvious problems for the sponsors of the lab.

Like the cover-up which dumped Mary Sherman’s burned and mangled corpse into her apartment, Lee’s murder was deemed “a necessity” to protect the underground medical laboratory and its sponsors. In doing so, they silenced the man who could have explained what really happened (or perhaps what did not happen) in Dallas on November 22, 1963. 14 Perhaps this was part of their plan all along.

Today, Judyth’s goal is to exonerate Lee Oswald. She will never stop her crusade to clear his name. I consider the bulk of what she has said to be as accurate as she can be held accountable for. She is explaining what happened in her life to the best of her ability. I have seen people that I knew were in the same room with each other at the same time disagree on what happened. Disagreement is not the acid test of truth. Events are always colored by perception. Judyth knows what she heard and knows what she believes, much of which is what she was led to believe by others. Yes, Judyth loved Lee. Judyth believed Lee. Judyth trusted Lee. She also trusted Dr. Alton Ochsner, Dr. Mary Sherman and David Ferrie. She was really there with Lee Oswald in New Orleans. She was young, impressionable, naïve and gullible. Somewhere along the line both she and Lee were betrayed. But there is a limit to what she knows. Judyth was not in Dallas on November 22, 1963.15 We all need to distinguish between what she personally saw and heard versus what she understands or believes to be the case. Both her critics and her supporters need to make these distinctions. So does she. So do I.

Next we look at what Judyth said that disagrees with things I wrote in earlier editions of this book.

First, I remind the reader that I did not feel that I had strong enough evidence in hand to endorse the claimed connection between Mary Sherman and David Ferrie without reservation and that I challenged any researcher to come foreword with real evidence or testimony that they were associated. They did.16 Judyth clearly states Mary Sherman knew David Ferrie well. In fact, Judyth had dinner with Sherman and Ferrie at Sherman’s apartment. Judyth is adamant that Mary Sherman was definitely part of the cancer-virus research project that was going on at David Ferrie’s apartment. In fact, part of Judyth’s daily operational cycle was to bring “the extracts” of her cancer-causing virus research from Ferrie’s apartment to Mary Sherman’s apartment. She also clearly states that Dr. Alton Ochsner was ultimately in charge of the Ferrie-Sherman lab. And that both she and Lee Oswald were part of the effort to use the cancer-causing monkey viruses to develop a biological weapon. No, David Ferrie had not run off with the mice after the Big Lab was shut down as I had suggested. The mice were delivered to his apartment several times per week for processing as part of the operation. To my mind, this has always been what I called “the worst case scenario” - the confirmed existence of the secret cooperation between talented scientists, dangerous radioactive equipment, monkey viruses and political extremists in an underground medical laboratory.
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#46
Some extracts from Edward T. Haslam, Dr. Mary's Monkey: How the Unsolved Murder of a Doctor, a Secret Laboratory in New Orleans and Cancer-Causing Monkey Viruses are Linked to Lee Harvey Oswald, the JFK Assassination and Emerging Global Epidemics

Chapter 17

The Witness (Extract 3)

But did they use radiation to mutate the monkey viruses?

I wrote to Judyth and said that I needed to know specifically if she had been told that the viruses she was working with at David Ferrie’s apartment had been exposed to radiation at another location to change them genetically? I told her I wanted to make sure that no one can find any ambiguity in her statement or be able to misinterpret it, so I was going to put a magnifying glass on it. I needed clarification. I needed her to confirm or deny it based on what she knew? My exact words were:

“My question is about your time in New Orleans in the summer of
1963… Do I understand that you are saying that you were told that the
extracts that you prepared at David Ferrie's apartment and delivered to
Mary Sherman's apartment were being subjected to radiation and then
recycled into more mice? Do I have this right?”

Judyth’s response:

===
EXACTLY...ALSO, INTO MONKEYS. MANY WERE KILLED, BUT THEY
ORDERED THOUSANDS OF POUNDS OF NEW MONKEYS…
===

I continued:

“By your term ‘we all knew it’ who are you referring to? Could I ask
you to answer ‘Yes’ or ‘No’ to each person on this list separately. The
question is: Did you personally discussed exposing your tumor
extracts to radiation with this person:”

Judyth’s response:

Mary Sherman-- SHE WAS THE ONE IN CHARGE OF DOING THIS

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Lee Oswald-- YES. HE ONCE TOOK ONE BATCH OVER TO CRIPPLED
CHILDREN'S HOSPITAL AND MET HER THERE BECAUSE SHE DIDN'T
HAVE TIME TO GET THEM FROM HER APARTMENT...

Alton Ochsner --- HE WAS IN CHARGE OF THE PROJECT. DR. SHERMAN
WAS AFRAID HE WAS BEING EXPLOITED AND DIDN'T REALIZE THE
FULL SIGNIFICANCE, THAT OTHERS COULD GET THEIR HANDS ON
THIS MATERIAL. BUT HE KEPT HIMSELF WHITE AS SNOW, THOUGH
HE WASN'T. DR. MARY DIDN'T TRUST HIM.

David Ferrie --YES

Bill Monahan -- THAT IS MONAGHAN.... NO, HE DIDN'T KNOW ANYTHING
EXCEPT THEY NEEDED ME FOR LAB WORK ON COMPANY TIME AND
HE HAD TO DO WORK I WAS SUPPOSED TO DO, WHICH IRRITATED
HIM.

They used radiation to mutate their monkey viruses!

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Was Judyth the technician in David Ferrie’s underground medical laboratory? She admits that she was, despite the obvious legal, ethical and security consequences of doing so. Were they irradiating cancer-causing viruses to develop a biological weapon? Judyth participated in that operation and said that their use of radiation was both deliberate and central to the design of the project. Was the operation in David Ferrie’s apartment connected to operation at the U.S. Public Health Service Hospital? Judyth says it was.

The consequences of these statements are terrifying!

Frankly, I would have preferred to have been wrong. It appears that I was not. These were very dark deeds indeed. They may have been “the dark deed” whose price the population of the planet still pays today. I doubt this connection will ever be proven to the satisfaction of the critics. But they do not control us nor the truth!

At least I understand why my father was so upset about, when he learned what was going on down at the U.S. Public Health Service Hospital.

So we are left with questions. Questions that Judyth Vary Baker cannot answer. Questions I cannot answer. Questions that deserve better answers. Questions like:

* Which monkey viruses did their radiation genetically alter? Was SIV one? 17
* What happened to their collection of mutated monkey viruses after Judyth left?
* Did any of these mutated monkey viruses “escape” into the human population?
* Will Judyth’s price for clearing Lee Oswald’s name be the sacrifice of her own?

Fortunately we can still ask questions like these. One has to wonder what will happen if we ever stop?
Reply
#47
Here is my psy op expert's response to Ed Haslam's complete Chapter 17, which includes the extracts that I have posted:

Jim, although I don't know him or anything about him, this man letter here comes off 100% credible to me and I think his analysis makes very good sense. It explains why there has been such a great effort to discredit Judyth's story, to harass her and create confusion. And this man's knowledge from his investigating supports my suggestion that even though Judyth is obsessed with informing the world for the first time of Oswald's normality (that he wasn't a lone-nut-assassin and never could have been) that is not the most important part of her story as I see it (although it is important). To me the most important part of her story which now appears to have already been corroborated is the bioweapons aspect, which by the way, directly links to current, ongoing, highly classified ops going on right now with other related ops in the planning stage for several locations, including Minnesota. The funding has already been set up and is "international" for some of this.

Ed Haslam's report of the use of a double and his confusion as to who was the real Judyth suggests very high level intel involvement and a sophisticated interception ops. This kind of stuff is serious intel "tradecraft". Years ago a retired company man told me that quite a bit of the JFK Assassination research crowd including some of the organizations set up to have meetings about it were either directly dirty or had infiltrators from the company sidetracking them. It's called controlled opposition. If there is no opposition, then it is created and controlled through well developed, sophisticated means. If there is good and valid opposition, then it is infiltrated and sidetracked. This alone is so counter-intuitive to most non-intel folks that they just can conceive it or identify it when it occurs.

Several names of so called researchers were mentioned to me as dirty and some of these folks are still around today detracting from good research, running misinformation websites, muddying up the waters, spreading confusion and disinformation and running intercept ops. Some work for intel, some are sympathetic to intel, and some are just locked into (committed to) their own ego directed and incorrect line of action with no chance for openness or change in their opinions since they have a long term vested interest in staying their course. And then you have a fair number of small timers who never accomplished anything in life who attempt to make their mark on history by opposing any good work done by honest researchers who are really seeking the truth. The internet often gives them a means to do this and some come against you periodically, Jim as you know. And then you have the researchers who basically mean well but don't understand the big picture or how intel ops are directed at the top and tend to be oppositional type persons with any new discovery. And of course some just suffer from petty jealousies of those researchers who have been astoundingly productive in their discoveries.

I don't need to mention any names, one just has to think about this a while and it is usually quite easy to figure out who these oppositional folks and infiltrators are. You can know them by their fruits (there are none, just obstructions). And Jim, I know that you already know who one is because you have butted heads with him many times and his game is so transparent to anyone that know what is going on.

It's important for folks to understand that anytime a major covert op is done like the JFK murder op, the greatest efforts always go into managing the cover-up afterward which typically includes high level based, sophisticated psyops and the associated use of harassment, community mobbing techniques, interference in employment, harassment by government agencies, police and utilities, extensive surveillance and tracking, false friends and/or new neighbors, use of the media, spreading of misinformation and major efforts to discredit any important or secondary witness and confuse and muddle up the issues, etc., etc.

[Image: 1z2mxq0.jpg]

The duration of these ops continue until the "mr. bigs" that set up the op are dead, or the line of ops they started are discontinued and "old news". The Judyth Varon case appears to me to be a perfect example of this whole process of a sophisticated "after the fact" long term intercept cover-up op with a lot of psyops used. As you know, Jim, a very fruitful technique often used is to present arguments which are 80-90% facts and then later delivering a twisted payload that misdirects or undermines an important aspect of the matter. This is done to elicit initial credibility so that a "misinformation payload" can be later delivered.

Too much attention has now been focused on this case by folks with the moxie of this researcher and yourself, Jim. The Judyth Varon matter can no longer be covered up and the truth is now coming out. Stay tuned for where it leads but I'll predict that if this string gets pulled much more it will lead to development and funding of the HIV weapon (operation naomi), swine flu, triple helix self healing super soldier, and much more.

One of the biggest concerns now in intel is the "blowback" from the internet. It was started by darpa as the world's biggest intel gathering operation and it has served that function well with the advent of sophisticated computers and the hybrid "promis" software derivatives (echelon, estein3, barracuda, etc.). But there have been some unintended consequences such as all the information being shared via the internet and its power to assist researchers. Right now there are detailed discussion going on how to deal with this. Internet censorship may be coming soon because it is now allowing too many dots to be connected. One wonders if the long haired hippy type darpa researchers that originated the internet technology set it up as a way to later destroy the military-defense-compex/shadow government controlled system they were working for. Will the Americans stand for blatant censorship of the internet? Or will the "mr. bigs" of the shadow government decide to institute another gladio style, self inflicted "inside job" terrorist attack as some experts have predicted? Are we just one more such attack away from the invoking of martial law as one top retired General suggested?
Reply
#48
Yes, the reference on page 416 of Double Cross, an account of Sam Giancana, enlisted through Roselli and Maheu by CIA to assassinate Castro--I have that, and the subsequent JFK and Sam by Antoinette Giancana et al.

Jack Ruby said they had injected him with cancer--but of course that wasn't possible--or was it.

We see here the hint that our benign government developed HIV/AIDS.

Oh, but that's crazy talk.

Or, in the manner of Jay Leno, with an elaborate shrug of one's shoulders, "I'm way out of line here, folks."

A shout-out to Judyth Vary Baker, both compassionate and tactical, the latter being, namely, taking flak = over target.
Reply
#49
Cowabunga! :marchmellow: Hmmmm.......Jim good stuff! Good food for thought! Can you say a bit more about your 'intel' expert short of identifying him or her? They had some VERY interesting things to say, that rang SO true. I took the liberty to extract those that I found most significant and wanted to echo them again, below. I think I need to research further JVB's story, something I admit I have not at length. Sadly, I see her book can not be shipped out of USA - where I am [out of USA]. I have Hasslam's first, not his second. Where else can you or someone else point me to some better sources or url's?

What I found VERY significant - and applicable to the work we do and the 'funny little obstacles' many of us find along the way doing our research were these:

Quote:Years ago a retired company man told me that quite a bit of the JFK Assassination research crowd including some of the organizations set up to have meetings about it were either directly dirty or had infiltrators from the company sidetracking them. It's called controlled opposition. If there is no opposition, then it is created and controlled through well developed, sophisticated means. If there is good and valid opposition, then it is infiltrated and sidetracked. This alone is so counter-intuitive to most non-intel folks that they just can’t conceive of it or identify it when it occurs.

Several names of so called researchers were mentioned to me as dirty and some of these folks are still around today detracting from good research, running misinformation websites, muddying up the waters, spreading confusion and disinformation and running intercept ops. Some work for intel, some are sympathetic to intel, and some are just locked into (committed to) their own ego directed and incorrect line of action with no chance for openness or change in their opinions since they have a long term vested interest in staying their course. And then you have a fair number of small timers who never accomplished anything in life who attempt to make their mark on history by opposing any good work done by honest researchers who are really seeking the truth. The internet often gives them a means to do this and some come against you periodically, Jim as you know. And then you have the researchers who basically mean well but don't understand the big picture or how intel ops are directed at the top and tend to be oppositional type persons with any new discovery. And of course some just suffer from petty jealousies of those researchers who have been astoundingly productive in their discoveries.

I don't need to mention any names, one just has to think about this a while and it is usually quite easy to figure out who these oppositional folks and infiltrators are. You can know them by their fruits (there are none, just obstructions).

It's important for folks to understand that anytime a major covert op is done like the JFK murder op, the greatest efforts always go into managing the cover-up afterward which typically includes high level based, sophisticated psyops and the associated use of harassment, community mobbing techniques, interference in employment, harassment by government agencies, police and utilities, extensive surveillance and tracking, false friends and/or new neighbors, use of the media, spreading of misinformation and major efforts to discredit any important or secondary witness and confuse and muddle up the issues, etc., etc.

One of the biggest concerns now in intel is the "blowback" from the internet. It was started by DARPA as the world's biggest intel gathering operation and it has served that function well with the advent of sophisticated computers and the hybrid "PROMIS" software derivatives (echelon, estein3, barracuda, etc.). But there have been some unintended consequences such as all the information being shared via the internet and its power to assist researchers. Right now there are detailed discussion going on how to deal with this. Internet censorship may be coming soon because it is now allowing too many dots to be connected. One wonders if the long haired hippy type DARPA researchers that originated the internet technology set it up as a way to later destroy the military-defense-compex/shadow government controlled system they were working for. Will the Americans stand for blatant censorship of the internet? Or will the "Mr. Bigs" of the shadow government decide to institute another Gladio-style, self inflicted "inside job" terrorist attack as some experts have predicted? Are we just one more such attack away from the invoking of martial law as one top retired General has suggested?
"Let me issue and control a nation's money and I care not who writes the laws. - Mayer Rothschild
"Civil disobedience is not our problem. Our problem is civil obedience! People are obedient in the face of poverty, starvation, stupidity, war, and cruelty. Our problem is that grand thieves are running the country. That's our problem!" - Howard Zinn
"If there is no struggle there is no progress. Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and never will" - Frederick Douglass
Reply
#50
Here are some recent clarifications from Judyth about some of my more recent posts:

From Judyth:

BTW, the house pictured at 1032 Marengo is AFTER a LONDON-based doctor purchased the home and completely gutted it and moved the door to the center. It then no longer resembles Lee Oswald's sketch in his adress book. I have attached a photo of the house before it was so very conveniently 'renovated'.

[Image: 2i6gx05.jpg]

1) Barb asked where were the police reports...Well, I have few such here overseas, but found one...the first one, I think, in 2000, Lafayette, LA.....attached---burglary and vandalism--the number is present here and will give her something to look up, if she likes....It will give her something to do......I have others, and photos, also...Maybe I will just hand over one at a time from various states and countries to give her something to do the next few months :-)

[Image: 2jbpl4.jpg]

2) Also attached is Lee's applicaton for a Mexican Tourist visa...We planned to elope there, you know. He originally thought he'd be able to stay, but they ended up ordering him back to Dallas after i wrote the note to Ochsner.

[Image: 2iifsbp.jpg]

What is important about this bit of evidence is the designation that Lee, born and raised as a Lutheran--at a time when Fidel Castro was expelling Catholics from his country and anti-Catholic sentiment was high--Lee placed "Catholc" on this document.

They were able to xerox the document for him and he planned to have this and other such documents in his possession to 'prove' he was Catholic so we could get married quickly by what i called a 'corrupt priest" --meaning one who would marry us without announcing Banns, that take a couple weeks...

Barb made a big deal when I said we were going to get quckie divorces and have a corrupt priest marry us by conflating that and accusing me of saying that Mexican priests could grant divorces! I meant no such thing. However, we did plan quickie divorces. Records exist that Lee Oswald was rumored to have been in border towns inquiring about quickie divorces. This was covered up, saying it was somebody else (though no real similarity of name) a couple of years earlier (!).

It's in the book.

3) Jim Garrison's ON THE TRAIL OF THE ASSASSINS, page 163...SHOWS THAT MOUSE CAGES WERE STILL INSIDE DAVE'S APARTMENT WHEN GARRISON VISITED THERE...BLACKBURST 'EXPERT' ON FERRIE AND OTHERS CLAIMED HE HADN'T HAD MICE FOR YEARS...ALSO, GARRISON MENTIONS THAT 'AN ESTABLISHED LOCAL DOCTOR" HAD WORKED WITH FERRIE. THAT WAS DOCTOR MARY SHERMAN.

[Image: cjjpg.jpg]
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