Article: How the Pentagon Broke the Deadlock over the START Treaty & Iran's Nuclear Ambitions at John Wheeler's Exp...

[David Guyatt]

That's because I don't think you're worth an ounce of effort Mr Trowbridge.

Seriously.

But you're bound to find someone else here who will fall for your inflated lines, I'm sure.

Go get em Tiger!

[Trowbridge H. Ford]

Then why have you wasted so much effort on the thread - six posts of which three are the most extensive and deliberately erroneous?

The simple answer is that you have way misjudged me, and now you know it.

It's better known as heading for the exits.

[Jeffrey Orling]

I take anything and everything that an "ex CIA" "ex FBI" and so forth says with a huge grain of salt. This, of course presents a problem for those who want to know about how these national security alphabet spook agencies work because they are not going to reveal what they do or their trade secrets.... Are they?

So they represent a bit of a black box and we mostly get to see the results of their "programs". And even then, they don't claim credit or deny it either. The recent uprisings in Tunisia and Egypt were supposed to be something that these agencies knew about and even knew what the results would be... the strength of the forces, loyalties and so forth. As usual we were told, they were caught off guard. One wonders what all those agents are actually doing about "intel gathering"?

And then you have the handful of "whistle blowers" who come out from the dark side and spill a few beans. They include, Agee, McGovern, Michon, Rowley, Edmonds, Larry Johnson, Plame and this Trowbridge fella who now surfaces with his connect the dots explanations.

You have to realize that all of the agencies are engaged in heavy disinformation and PR and have plants in all the media and so forth... and the CIA has so much as admitted it. I suppose the purpose being to suss out leads and leaks and so forth which "real journalists" might dig up, while at the same time planting lies such as Judith Miller and Michael Gordon and so forth. Look at the work of Fetzer and his colleagues... pure chaffe and distraction.

What we do know is that they are operating outside the law, have enormous budgets and black budgets and effectively drive the policy decisions with their covert programs with no oversight.

They are all rogue as far as democracy is concerned. But no one seems to want to change that.

I've always wanted to understand the mind of these ex's who entered the service presumably understanding their mission and agreeing with it. And then they decide something ain't kosher and decide to "tell all". One wonders if they were naive? Or perhaps have a guilty conscience?

Can anyone enlist in these agencies not knowing how vile and illegal their activities are?

[Trowbridge H. Ford]

Thanks for the blowback, Jeffrey, implying that I am no ex-intelligence agent at all since I enlisted in CIC, but now simply one undercover.

Actually, as my account on Wilispooks relates, I didn't enlist in it, only took the option of joining it after I took tests for it after volunteering to be drafted, and did sufficiently well to go to Fort Holabird rather than to Korea as an infantryman.

The service was an absolute joke, as I have described, and I left it on July 10, 1954 after completing two years of an required service which almost guaranteed that I would never been recalled, no matter what our dipstick political leadership engineered.

Glad I did not go further to fax you my article about 9/11 in Issue Eight of Eye Spy magazine when the only fax machine I know of wouldn't take it, but I still think that you are on the right track that the crashing of the planes, plus some monkey business in the buildings, brought the WTC down - the result of the cockup by the 15 CIA unarmed agents on three of the planes, intending to disarm the highjackers when the planes got to LA, in lieu of their being stopped ever from entering them - rather than that it was an inside job.

As for what happened to a likely suspect in the John P. Wheeler III murder - the topic of this thread - it seems that the most likely suspect, Alireza Pahlavi, was himself murdered by two blasts from a showgun to the head.

Looks most likely a NSA job by its Special Collection Agency when things went wrong.

More later, in the article I am now writing.

[Jeffrey Orling]

I am not implying anything. I am stating that I take with a grain of salt the words of people who have worked in these agencies for years and then see the "error of their ways." Sibel Edmonds was in there a short time so perhaps she WAS naive, but she is very intelligent and seemed to think that the FBI does have a legitimate spying / surveillance function. It's the attitude that there are a lot of nasties out there and we MUST fight them with anything we can muster... and I mean anything.

These agencies went from "information gathering" to covert operations... perhaps with the excuse of expediency and efficiency in obtaining results for the state. And it was the state perhaps which clearly was now function first and foremost for the elite - those whose motivation was wealth, hegemony and control. So "owning" the military and placing their stooges inside the powerful "alphabets" was a win win situation. Most stooges "got off" on being outside the law and of course made lots of money for their "service"... not to country, but to corporation really. Men like John Portman, or Wendell Potter emerged from within the corporate inner circles to reveal how the work and in the case of Portman how they are directly linked to the military and the CIA.

I'm hoping for a Tahrir Square with a success outcome spreading around the world and finally to the western "hypocracies".. I mean democracies. Let's see what happens in Wisconsin where the locals are getting restless and hopefully part of it was inspired by Tahrir.

Perhaps the idea of democracy is naive because there will always be nasties who want more power, wealth and control. They've managed to fool most of the people in the West, distract them, keep them dumbed down and for the most part acting like slaves... with hope and dreams of some sort of decent life. But as many are realizing that it is not happening the days of reckoning are drawing near. And it won't be supposed underwear bomber types from the ME to worry about in the USA, but her people when they wake up and crush the alphabets and the national security state.

Despite the fact that the internet is full of poseurs such a we've seen in other threads, there is a kind of democratic power and organizing potential which is required to create a movement of, for and by the people.