Valkyrie at Dealey Plaza

[Charles Drago]

I swore I wouldn't do this, but enough is enough.

Albert,

Based on the utter nonsense you've just posted, you've lost all credibility as a student of deep politics.

Please go back and read Scott and Evica -- for starters. Be humble, be quiet, study, think, think, think.

Then get back to us with a critique of your own product.

Because when you make comments such as, "It is possible to get hung-up in the deep politics china shop and miss the obvious," and "If hypothetically Vallee had pulled-off the hit," you brutally embarrass yourself on any number of levels.

And don't ask me to explain how you embarrass yourself; as previously noted, we don't speak a common language when it comes to the study of deep politics.

Besides, you'll never learn if I do your homework for you.

You seem to be a decent, honorable man -- one who might contribute much of value to the greater discussions here.

But garage bands don't play at Carnegie Hall.

Woodshed, my friend.

Woodshed.

[Albert Doyle]

I'd like to answer that but I feel that it will be punished by an inappropriately-invoked overbearing ethic being used to bypass what was said. I guess I'm protesting (respectfully).

[Greg Burnham]

Let's return to Vallee.
If Chicago was a ruse, i can understand framing him as a patsy, since it will deflect atttention from Oswald and will
create false sponsors, like the Anti-Castro Cubans and John Birch Society.
If it was a real attempt, why framing him, and not framing another patsy with Pro-Castro and FPCC background?
Why bother designing the Mexico incident, and how Johnson would have convinced Warren to cover up to save 40 millions Americans?
How Vallee would fit into the WWIII scenario?

No offense, but: What the hell are you talking about? A conspiracy theory?

If I read Vasilios correctly, he is arguing in support of my hypothesis that the Chicago "plot" was created as a Dallas doppelganger to account for leaks originating from the real operation and to create post-assassination confusion/cognitive dissonance.

I think that Vasilios is re-posing the question I originally posed: Knowing what we know of his background, how could Vallee, in the role of patsy in a successfully executed Chicago plot, have been utilized to support what Peter Dale Scott defined in Deep Politics and the Death of JFK as "Phase One" and "Phase Two" of the JFK conspiracy cover-up:

"Phase One put forward the phantom of an international plot, linking Oswald to the USSR, to Cuba, or to both countries together. This phantom was used to invoke the danger of a possible nuclear confrontation, which induced Chief Justice Earl Warren and other political notables to accept Phase Two, the equally false (but less dangerous) hypothesis that Oswald killed the President all by himself. …. [T]he Phase-One story… was first promoted and then defused by the CIA. Michael Beschloss has revealed that, at 9:20 AM on the morning of November 23, CIA Director John McCone briefed the new President. In Beschloss' words: 'The CIA had information on foreign connections to the alleged assassin, Lee Harvey Oswald, which suggested to LBJ that Kennedy may have been murdered by an international conspiracy'"

Thanks for the clarification, Charles.

[Charles Drago]

I'd like to answer that but I feel that it will be punished by an inappropriately-invoked overbearing ethic being used to bypass what was said. I guess I'm protesting (respectfully).

I don't disrespect you, Albert. Never have, never will.

What frustrates me is the gulf between what I perceive to be your potential as a deep political thinker and your failure to realize it.

Your post above, against which I reacted so strongly, is a painful representation of that gulf.

For whatever it's worth, Albert, I wouldn't take the time to engage in this exchange if I didn't respect you.

[Charles Drago]

Let's return to Vallee.
If Chicago was a ruse, i can understand framing him as a patsy, since it will deflect atttention from Oswald and will
create false sponsors, like the Anti-Castro Cubans and John Birch Society.
If it was a real attempt, why framing him, and not framing another patsy with Pro-Castro and FPCC background?
Why bother designing the Mexico incident, and how Johnson would have convinced Warren to cover up to save 40 millions Americans?
How Vallee would fit into the WWIII scenario?

No offense, but: What the hell are you talking about? A conspiracy theory?

If I read Vasilios correctly, he is arguing in support of my hypothesis that the Chicago "plot" was created as a Dallas doppelganger to account for leaks originating from the real operation and to create post-assassination confusion/cognitive dissonance.

I think that Vasilios is re-posing the question I originally posed: Knowing what we know of his background, how could Vallee, in the role of patsy in a successfully executed Chicago plot, have been utilized to support what Peter Dale Scott defined in Deep Politics and the Death of JFK as "Phase One" and "Phase Two" of the JFK conspiracy cover-up:

"Phase One put forward the phantom of an international plot, linking Oswald to the USSR, to Cuba, or to both countries together. This phantom was used to invoke the danger of a possible nuclear confrontation, which induced Chief Justice Earl Warren and other political notables to accept Phase Two, the equally false (but less dangerous) hypothesis that Oswald killed the President all by himself. …. [T]he Phase-One story… was first promoted and then defused by the CIA. Michael Beschloss has revealed that, at 9:20 AM on the morning of November 23, CIA Director John McCone briefed the new President. In Beschloss' words: 'The CIA had information on foreign connections to the alleged assassin, Lee Harvey Oswald, which suggested to LBJ that Kennedy may have been murdered by an international conspiracy'"

Thanks for the clarification, Charles.

If it is a clarification. We'll have to let Vasilios speak for himself.

[Greg Burnham]

No offense, but: What the hell are you talking about? A conspiracy theory?

If I read Vasilios correctly, he is arguing in support of my hypothesis that the Chicago "plot" was created as a Dallas doppelganger to account for leaks originating from the real operation and to create post-assassination confusion/cognitive dissonance.

I think that Vasilios is re-posing the question I originally posed: Knowing what we know of his background, how could Vallee, in the role of patsy in a successfully executed Chicago plot, have been utilized to support what Peter Dale Scott defined in Deep Politics and the Death of JFK as "Phase One" and "Phase Two" of the JFK conspiracy cover-up:

"Phase One put forward the phantom of an international plot, linking Oswald to the USSR, to Cuba, or to both countries together. This phantom was used to invoke the danger of a possible nuclear confrontation, which induced Chief Justice Earl Warren and other political notables to accept Phase Two, the equally false (but less dangerous) hypothesis that Oswald killed the President all by himself. …. [T]he Phase-One story… was first promoted and then defused by the CIA. Michael Beschloss has revealed that, at 9:20 AM on the morning of November 23, CIA Director John McCone briefed the new President. In Beschloss' words: 'The CIA had information on foreign connections to the alleged assassin, Lee Harvey Oswald, which suggested to LBJ that Kennedy may have been murdered by an international conspiracy'"

Thanks for the clarification, Charles.

If it is a clarification. We'll have to let Vasilios speak for himself.

I shall wait with bated...err "baited" breath indeed...

[Charles Drago]

I shall wait with bated...err "baited" breath indeed...

That's what you get for smoochin' with Ann Chove.

[Greg Burnham]

I shall wait with bated...err "baited" breath indeed...

That's what you get for smoochin' with Ann Chove.

Actually, it was Mack Erel's sister. :girlboydance:

[Phil Dragoo]

Set it. . .And forget it!

Two paragraphs from Douglass to set the table:

BEGIN DOUGLASS EXCERPT

Special Agent in Charge Martineau's startling announcement to his Chicago Secret Service agents about a plot against Kennedy came in the context of their preparations for the president's arrival at O'Hare Airport three days later on Saturday, November 2, at 1:40. On Saturday afternoon JFK was scheduled to attend the Army-Air Force football game at Soldier Field. At 9:00 Wednesday morning, Martineau told the agents the FBI had learned from an informant that four snipers planned to shoot Kennedy with high-powered rifles. Their ambush was set to happen along the route of the presidential motorcade, as it came in from O'Hare down the Northwest Expressway and into the Loop on Saturday morning. The FBI had said "the suspects were rightwing para-military fanatics.The assassination "would probably be attempted at one of the Northwest Expressway overpasses.They knew this from an informant named "Lee."Who was the informant named "Lee? Could it have been Lee Harvey Oswald? We will return to that question. The following day, the landlady at a boarding house on the North Side independently provided further information. Four men were renting rooms from her. She had seen four rifles with telescopic sights in one of the men's rooms, together with a newspaper sketch of the president's route. She phoned the FBI.



The FBI told Martineau everything was now up to the Secret Service. James Rowley, head of the Secret Service in Washington, confirmed to Martineau that J. Edgar Hoover had passed the buck. It was the Secret Service's jurisdiction. The FBI would do nothing to investigate or stop the plot against Kennedy. Martineau set up a twenty-four-hour surveillance of the men's boarding house. He passed out to his agents four photos of the men allegedly involved in the plot. The stakeout reached a quick climax on Thursday night, October 31, at the same time as halfway around the world rebel tanks and troops were preparing to move through the streets of Saigon toward the presidential palace. In Chicago, Secret Service agent J. Lloyd Stocks in his car spotted two of the suspects driving Stocks followed them. When the men drove into an alley behind their rooming house, Stocks did, too. He discovered too late that the alley was a dead end. The men had turned their car around and were on their way back out. They squeezed past Stocks's car at an unfortunate moment for the agentjust as his car radio blared out a message from Martineau. The startled men looked his way, then drove off quickly. Stocks reported back to Martineau with chagrin that he'd blown the surveillance. Martineau ordered that the two men be taken into custody immediately. They were seized and brought to the Secret Service headquarters early Friday morning. Through the early morning hours, J. Lloyd Stocks questioned one of the two men, while his fellow agent Robert Motto questioned the other. The two suspects, who have remained anonymous to this day, stonewalled the questions. In the meantime, their two reported collaborators remained at large. President Kennedy was due to arrive the next day for his motorcade through the streets of Chicago.



END DOUGLASS EXCERPT

I submit the very fact that the FBI had a four-man sniper team on its tray when it knocked at the door of the Secret Service agents in Bangkok Thailand is an odor.

That the Secret Service swung into action like Dick Tracy is too good.

That it devolved from a "Lee" is perfect.

And the CIA connections easily unassed in re the Falcon (oh, uh, Harvey Lee Tippit Collins check check check and check).

Plus the two spooky cops (see also Pena and Hernandez at the Ambassador Shooting Of Senator).

The Gilbert Chemistry Set arrives and is set up, knocked flat, that's that.

The Secret Service has taken care of everything.

Marty, you worry too much about me.

Out goes the bad air

(in comes the lead)

I ask those who will descend like so many carrion to consider:

Freaking Cubans?

CIA "lone nut"--

Who sets this up as The Plot?

Precisely NOBODY.

Who sets this up as the mosquito's procaine?

Mechanics and facilitators who change regimes like underwear.

Go back and watch the Pulp Fiction fixer in re the inconvenient head shot in the sedan cruising through the hood.

Cool pros say blip blap blip and it's time for Dos Equiis.

Stay thirsty, My Friend.

[Vasilios Vazakas]

Thanks for the clarification, Charles.[/QUOTE]

If it is a clarification. We'll have to let Vasilios speak for himself.[/QUOTE]

I don't think a clarification is necessary. My question posed above was clear and self explanatory.