CIA’s detailed study of the Hitler Plot was to be used against Castro

[Anthony Thorne]

I think Skyhorse has avoided publishing Judyth Baker's works for reasons unrelated to pressure from intel agencies. Her work is not universally loved. Not by a long shot.

And there may well be reasons they didn't want to publish Scott's work, or spend an extended amount of time nutting out details with him. If Trine Day are better, they can print Scott's latest work. If Trine Day and Scott don't currently get on, it seems a bit much to berate Skyhorse for feeling the same way.

As for Skyhorse being dedicated to the lone nut theory of history, I'd imagine at a rough guess that they've published well over 100 volumes dedicated to describing conspiracies, including JFK and others. They republished Harold Weisberg's complete works, and Mellen's book, and DiEugenio and others. In fact, next to Trine Day, they've probably published more pro-conspiracy books than any other mainstream US publisher. I wish other publishers would publish as many credible pro-conspiracy volumes as they have.

I'd hate to express judgement on Scott's commentary, but his post on this thread doesn't really constitute evidence of anything except his POV and thoughts at the time he wrote it - which is fine, but I can barely tell what Scott's involvement with Skyhorse was, let alone what the publisher did wrong.

[Mark A. O'Blazney]

I think Skyhorse has avoided publishing Judyth Baker's works for reasons unrelated to pressure from intel agencies. Her work is not universally loved. Not by a long shot.

And there may well be reasons they didn't want to publish Scott's work, or spend an extended amount of time nutting out details with him. If Trine Day are better, they can print Scott's latest work. If Trine Day and Scott don't currently get on, it seems a bit much to berate Skyhorse for feeling the same way.

As for Skyhorse being dedicated to the lone nut theory of history, I'd imagine at a rough guess that they've published well over 100 volumes dedicated to describing conspiracies, including JFK and others. They republished Harold Weisberg's complete works, and Mellen's book, and DiEugenio and others. In fact, next to Trine Day, they've probably published more pro-conspiracy books than any other mainstream US publisher. I wish other publishers would publish as many credible pro-conspiracy volumes as they have.

I'd hate to express judgement on Scott's commentary, but his post on this thread doesn't really constitute evidence of anything except his POV and thoughts at the time he wrote it - which is fine, but I can barely tell what Scott's involvement with Skyhorse was, let alone what the publisher did wrong.

Well, you can always sigh up with Jabba Jim Fetzer's moonrocks publishing empire, y'know. They all have nailed their demographic. The conference organizer for Judyth Vary Baker's OzzFests also organize UFO conventions, et. al. As Mulder said, "I Want To Believe". And they do, as their money parts from their wallets time and again.

[James Lateer]

Good news! Amazon lists two vendors that are listing used copies of The Skorzeny Papers. I have messaged them to see if they actually have copies or if they actually ever had any copies.

As for Skyhorse, like the government agencies involved in investigating the JFK assassination, Skyhorse will publish books on "the Mafia did it" or "the CIA did it", etc. etc. etc.

The problem is that all of the above theories are knowingly off the mark. They are a diversion. I don't remember any Skyhorse books that fault Military Intelligence as was suggested by Mr. Lemkin. Ditto on the Senate Internal Security Subcommittee.

Dr. Jeffrey Caufield has proven beyond any reasonable doubt that Senator James O. Eastand and his committee were involved with Oswald in New Orleans in the summer of 1963 and were in court on the evidence provided by the informer Oswald in October and November, 1963. I can't think of any other author who has picked up on this.

I have had some brief personal experience with Skyhorse from which I got much the same feeling as Scott has posted. Hopefully, with the Skorzeny Papers and with Coup in Dallas by Mr. Albarelli, they will break out of this mold and get on the stick with seeking real cutting edge JFK assassination information. If they do, it will be great news and welcomed by all.

James Lateer

[Anthony Thorne]

Hopefully, with the Skorzeny Papers and with Coup in Dallas by Mr. Albarelli, they will break out of this mold and get on the stick with seeking real cutting edge JFK assassination information. If they do, it will be great news and welcomed by all.

James Lateer

James, what on earth are you talking about?

They've printed

Sylvia Meagher's ACCESSORIES AFTER THE FACT
Fletcher Prouty's JFK: THE CIA, VIETNAM AND THE PLOT TO ASSASSINATE JOHN F. KENNEDY
James DiEugenio's updated 2018 volume on the case, THE JFK ASSASSINATION, and his earlier RECLAIMING PARKLAND
Also DiEugenio's DESTINY BETRAYED: JFK, CUBA AND THE GARRISON CASE
Dick Russell's ON THE TRAIL OF THE JFK ASSASSINS
Gayle Nix Jackson's THE MISSING JFK ASSASSINATION FILM
Ventura's THEY KILLED OUR PRESIDENT - 63 REASONS TO BELIEVE THERE WAS A CONSPIRACY TO ASSASSINATE JFK
Weisberg's WHITEWASH I, II, III and IV, NEVER AGAIN! THE GOVERNMENT CONSPIRACY IN THE JFK ASSASSINATION and POST MORTEM
Peter Dale Scott's THE WAR CONSPIRACY, a book the CIA actually suppressed in the early 70's, as well as Scott's earlier OSWALD, MEXICO, AND DEEP POLITICS
Mark Lane's PLAUSIBLE DENIAL and LAST WORD
Veciana's TRAINED TO KILL
Gaeton Fonzi's THE LAST INVESTIGATION
John Newman's OSWALD AND THE CIA

And now they've got the Ganis and Albarelli books scheduled.

Are you really suggesting all those pro-conspiracy books, down to the important volumes by Fonzi and Newman, and up to the most recent books by DiEugenio, were commissioned, accepted and printed just to misdirect the public? Come on.

Skyhorse Books are active on Twitter. I've asked them how things are looking with the Ganis book. If two re-sellers have copies available it's probably because the book is due to ship within next week or so and they've soliciting copies now at a higher price. Amazon Australia lists the Kindle edition as being available for download next week. I'd really suggest just waiting one more week and seeing if it appears through normal retail channels.

[James Lateer]

Mr. Thorne:

The Skyhorse Books You Listed:

Prouty-CIA, Mil.Ind.Complex, Military Contractors
Meagher-Warren Commission Witnesses/Suspects
DiEugenio-???? [Warren Commission Witnesses/Suspects]
Russell-Garrison Suspects
Ventura-Warmed Over Info
Weisburg-?????
Peter Dale Scott-CIA/Military Intel, ATF
Mark Lane-CIA and Warren Commission Witnesses/Suspects
Veciana-CiA
Gaeton Fonzi-Cuban Exiles and Veciana/Phillips
Newman-"Oswald and the CIA"-presumably LHO and the CIA

Books with more diverse and accurate info, not published by Skyhorse

Torbitt File-Adventures Unlimited Press-Blames Texans, Israel, UK Intell.
General Walker/Dr. Jeffry Caufield-Blames Walker, Milteer, JBS, Right-wingers Nationally,
Senate Internal Security Subcommittee, Louisiana Sovereignty Commission, etc
The Three Barons (me) Nazis, West German Government, Senate Internal Sec Subc.
Eastland, Senator Dodd, National Security Council
Me and Lee-Dr. Ochsner, Ed Butler, INCA, Operation Mongoose, Carlos Marcello
Brothers in Arms-Guy Russo-Blames Castro's Intelligence Service and others
Final Judgment-Michael Collins Piper-Israeli Mossad and UK Intelligence, Nat.Sec.Council
Farewell America-James Hepburn-blames Texas Oilmen and Military Contractors

If you analyze the different works listed above, I feel you can identify the Skyhorse pattern:
blaming the CIA has been going on for 55 years and leads nowhere, rehashing Warren Commission issues likewise is a dead-end effort, and the anti-Castro Cubans have never amounted to much of a theory.

Basically, the Skyhorse approach never escapes from rehashing Warren Commission old-hat issues which have been pre-sanitized by the Warren Commission, OR rehashing the Garrison information, which, (as explained by Dr. Caufield), deliberately excluded anything about right-wing Southerners, Military Intel or the FBI because of Garrison's personal conflicts of interest.

When you want to get out of the Warren Comm./Garrison fences, none of the Skyhorse books do that.

I hope that The Skorzeny Papers opens the door to the true main perpetrators: the WWII Nazi left-overs, both inside and outside the West German Government and their NATO, Mongoose and National Security Council/Cabinet collaborators inside the US Government.

Kudos to everybody who is putting the word out on these new books by Ganis and Albarelli. I am confident that new ground will be broken. I have read the first chapter by Albarelli and it is headed in the perfect direction.

James Lateer

[Peter Lemkin]

Hopefully, with the Skorzeny Papers and with Coup in Dallas by Mr. Albarelli, they will break out of this mold and get on the stick with seeking real cutting edge JFK assassination information. If they do, it will be great news and welcomed by all.

James Lateer

James, what on earth are you talking about?

They've printed

Sylvia Meagher's ACCESSORIES AFTER THE FACT
Fletcher Prouty's JFK: THE CIA, VIETNAM AND THE PLOT TO ASSASSINATE JOHN F. KENNEDY
James DiEugenio's updated 2018 volume on the case, THE JFK ASSASSINATION, and his earlier RECLAIMING PARKLAND
Also DiEugenio's DESTINY BETRAYED: JFK, CUBA AND THE GARRISON CASE
Dick Russell's ON THE TRAIL OF THE JFK ASSASSINS
Gayle Nix Jackson's THE MISSING JFK ASSASSINATION FILM
Ventura's THEY KILLED OUR PRESIDENT - 63 REASONS TO BELIEVE THERE WAS A CONSPIRACY TO ASSASSINATE JFK
Weisberg's WHITEWASH I, II, III and IV, NEVER AGAIN! THE GOVERNMENT CONSPIRACY IN THE JFK ASSASSINATION and POST MORTEM
Peter Dale Scott's THE WAR CONSPIRACY, a book the CIA actually suppressed in the early 70's, as well as Scott's earlier OSWALD, MEXICO, AND DEEP POLITICS
Mark Lane's PLAUSIBLE DENIAL and LAST WORD
Veciana's TRAINED TO KILL
Gaeton Fonzi's THE LAST INVESTIGATION
John Newman's OSWALD AND THE CIA

And now they've got the Ganis and Albarelli books scheduled.

Are you really suggesting all those pro-conspiracy books, down to the important volumes by Fonzi and Newman, and up to the most recent books by DiEugenio, were commissioned, accepted and printed just to misdirect the public? Come on.

Skyhorse Books are active on Twitter. I've asked them how things are looking with the Ganis book. If two re-sellers have copies available it's probably because the book is due to ship within next week or so and they've soliciting copies now at a higher price. Amazon Australia lists the Kindle edition as being available for download next week. I'd really suggest just waiting one more week and seeing if it appears through normal retail channels.

A pretty impressive list for one publisher. We all [should] know about Mockingbird, which is still ongoing under some other name. It included publishers - not just newspapers and magazines. Yes, most publishing houses are controlled at the top and don't print or even worse solicit and then destroy [Christian and Turner's book on RFK Assassination is a perfect example -I've mentioned about before. Since it has been published - but the original print run which was huge was sent to the incinerators from the stocked pallets. I was lucky enough to get 3 copies taken by one of the crew working in the warehouse who were clever enough to take about half of a pallet and stuff them into their cars on the way to burning the rest....]. My three copies which I later had my friend Bill Turner sign have an ISBN number in them NOT listed in the Library of Congress...but I digress...

I asked Dick Russell why Albarelli and Ganis parted ways. He declined to tell me. There can logically only be two reasons. Either they differed on some major point or they just couldn't work together. I do not know Ganis. I do know Hank Albarelli a little - and he, while a great researcher, is not an easy person to work with. I look forward to both books and to see what the difference, if any, is in their telling approximately the same story........ I do not think the books were suppressed [that Russell WOULD have told me, I'm sure]....there were other problems.

I don't know - maybe someone published by Skyhorse would like to pipe in - but many publishers now don't have the one main ingredient publishers since time immemorial have had - editors! They expect the author to do their own editing or hire a private one on their own dime unless they think they have a blockbuster - and NO book like those listed above will ever be a blockbuster due to the dumbing down of America and the propaganda line against 'conspiracy nuts'. Sad truth.

[James Lateer]

According to Hathitrust website, there are 150 books that mention QJ/WIN. There are also many, many books that cover the subject of Otto Skorzeny, including his memoirs, etc.

If The Skorzeny Papers either never gets published or if it is heavily "redacted", there is potential for anyone to put together a pretty good imitation of the subject matter, regardless of what specifically is revealed by the actual personal papers of Skorzeny.

By the way, it would be interesting to know more about the BOOK BURNING recounted by Mr. Lemkin related to the book on RFK by Christian and Turner. Was this an attempt to suppress or minimize the book? And if so, by whom?


Still on hold.

James Lateer

[Anthony Thorne]

James, the Turner Christian RFK book was suppressed and buried on first publication. It's since been re-released (twice) and is available on Amazon. It's a good book.

Skyhorse has several JFK conspiracy books that don't point fingers at the CIA. I've simply listed the ones that do as I find it a more compelling premise. The ones I haven't listed touch a number of the topics you included in your second list of works.

Walt Brown also mentioned that 'Richard Belzer's publisher' helped him put his numerous ebooks onto Amazon. Walt's thesis is that 'Army intelligence' played a major role in the hit - he returns to the phrase again and again in his works - and the other renowned players did their part too, including Texans, national right-wingers, Marcello, oilmen and military contractors, etc. I'm assuming that 'Army intelligence' is not too far removed from 'military intelligence', and Belzer's publisher is Skyhorse. Somehow Skyhorse didn't feel the need to ask Walt to redact those accusations from his books.

Out of the numerous volumes you mentioned you read in preparation for your own work, I'm assuming you didn't read the first volume of Walt Brown's ebook chronology - titled 'Dynasty' - as it tears apart Baker's book on a near page by page basis. It's probably the most comprehensive demolition of another volume I've encountered in the literature. To see you rank that book, and Piper's 'Mossad did it' tome, and the Torbitt file in your list of preferred assassination volumes does not fill me with confidence for some reason. Also on your list, from his decades of writing freely available on his website, it should be fairly clear which groups DiEugenio feels were involved in the assassination, and which ones weren't. Re the Caulfield volume, DiEugenio, in his long review, ranks it among the worst books on the case ever written, and his criticisms are fairly specific.

https://kennedysandking.com/john-f-kenne...nt-kennedy

rehashing Warren Commission issues likewise is a dead-end effort, and the anti-Castro Cubans have never amounted to much of a theory

We might have to agree to disagree from here on out, as I disagree with both your assertions there. You read Hinkle and Turner's DEADLY SECRETS, right? Disagreements are fine and your contributions are enjoyable but I'm not quite on board with the arguments you've put forward here.

[Peter Lemkin]

Mr. Thorne:

The Skyhorse Books You Listed:

Prouty-CIA, Mil.Ind.Complex, Military Contractors
Meagher-Warren Commission Witnesses/Suspects
DiEugenio-???? [Warren Commission Witnesses/Suspects]
Russell-Garrison Suspects
Ventura-Warmed Over Info
Weisburg-?????
Peter Dale Scott-CIA/Military Intel, ATF
Mark Lane-CIA and Warren Commission Witnesses/Suspects
Veciana-CiA
Gaeton Fonzi-Cuban Exiles and Veciana/Phillips
Newman-"Oswald and the CIA"-presumably LHO and the CIA

Books with more diverse and accurate info, not published by Skyhorse

Torbitt File-Adventures Unlimited Press-Blames Texans, Israel, UK Intell.
General Walker/Dr. Jeffry Caufield-Blames Walker, Milteer, JBS, Right-wingers Nationally,
Senate Internal Security Subcommittee, Louisiana Sovereignty Commission, etc
The Three Barons (me) Nazis, West German Government, Senate Internal Sec Subc.
Eastland, Senator Dodd, National Security Council
Me and Lee-Dr. Ochsner, Ed Butler, INCA, Operation Mongoose, Carlos Marcello
Brothers in Arms-Guy Russo-Blames Castro's Intelligence Service and others
Final Judgment-Michael Collins Piper-Israeli Mossad and UK Intelligence, Nat.Sec.Council
Farewell America-James Hepburn-blames Texas Oilmen and Military Contractors

If you analyze the different works listed above, I feel you can identify the Skyhorse pattern:
blaming the CIA has been going on for 55 years and leads nowhere, rehashing Warren Commission issues likewise is a dead-end effort, and the anti-Castro Cubans have never amounted to much of a theory.

Basically, the Skyhorse approach never escapes from rehashing Warren Commission old-hat issues which have been pre-sanitized by the Warren Commission, OR rehashing the Garrison information, which, (as explained by Dr. Caufield), deliberately excluded anything about right-wing Southerners, Military Intel or the FBI because of Garrison's personal conflicts of interest.

When you want to get out of the Warren Comm./Garrison fences, none of the Skyhorse books do that.

I hope that The Skorzeny Papers opens the door to the true main perpetrators: the WWII Nazi left-overs, both inside and outside the West German Government and their NATO, Mongoose and National Security Council/Cabinet collaborators inside the US Government.

Kudos to everybody who is putting the word out on these new books by Ganis and Albarelli. I am confident that new ground will be broken. I have read the first chapter by Albarelli and it is headed in the perfect direction.

James Lateer

Gus Russo, like a few other 'JFK authors' IS a CIA-approved author - warning toxic! Pozner is another! Some are just fools - others are knowing and paid tools! I've named two of the later.

[James Lateer]

After two tries, I still haven't heard of WHO suppressed the book by Turner and Christian?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I am the proud owner of a copy of Destiny Betrayed by Mr. DiEugenio. I have not read the entire book, but only some portions. I cite Mr. DiEugenio on page 23 of the Three Barons. In the index to Destiny Betrayed, the most often cited names are Dean Andrews, James Angleton, Guy Banister, David Ferrie, Jim Garrison, JFK, John McCloy, Gordon Novel, LHO, Jack Ruby and Clay Shaw. He has pretty much "rounded up the usual suspects."

Mostly, I don't get how people can say "that's a good book" or "that book's been debunked" etc. In my conclusions in the Three Barons, I list my 71 relevant, material and probative items of circumstantial evidence on the assassination. To glean these 71 items, I had to read 150 books. So that's one item of crucial, probative evidence in about every 1000 pages.

In my review posted on Amazon for Dr. Caufield's book, I list 25 items of evidence or information that Dr. Caufield has discovered which no one else has found (to my knowledge). Out of the 780 pages of the book by Dr. Caufield, easily 95% of the paragraphs and pages are irrelevant and immaterial. The value of his book is the NEW INFORMATION he has discovered, not the relevance of all of the entirety of his information taken as a whole. And you never know where or when you will stumble across new, sensational JFK plot information. All you can do is look in every likely place and leave no stone unturned, (not even Oliver Stone).

The only book that gets the plot basically right IMHO is Treason For My Daily Bread by Mikhail Lebedev. AND THAT BOOK IS IN THE FICTION SECTION AT THE LIBRARY (if you can find it at all).

The pointed question that could be asked possibly of Mr. DiEugenio and Mr. Thorne would be "if you were to discover what you would consider to be the definitive explanation about the entire JFK plot, how would you visualize that happening?" Would you (or someone) stumble on the secret, lost diaries of Allen Dulles at a garage sale where the whole JFK plot is detailed? Would the still-classified JFK documents in the National Archives, if released, contain the definitive explanation of the plot? Would you be waiting for something like a "death-bed confession" that would blow the plot open?

IMHO, the JFK facts just aren't remotely like that. I would explain it like this: I have been (for the past two years at least) working in the libraries of the University of Wisconsin-Madison and the library of the Wisconsin Historical Society. Each of the two contains, easily, a million books about history. This would make around one billion pages total. My premise was (and is) that THE ENTIRE TRUTH about the JFK assassination is somewhere in that billion pages. The problem is how to go about finding it and digging it out. I assembled a database of 1500 names using 30 books. Only 70 of those people (plus or minus) were legally involved in the plot, in my estimation.

You could hypothetically "completely demolish" the entire evidence about the J D Tippit murder found in the Warren Commission and other places. That would NOT mean that, if you could do so, that you yourself knew who murdered Tippit. "Demolishing" other people's books (or any book) will not serve to (in itself) to prove that your book (or any book) has the plot figured out.

Dr. Caufield's book proves that LHO was infiltrating a number of Civil Rights groups working for Senator Eastland, not just the FPCC. This (to me), explains why LHO was as the voter rally in Clinton, LA.

Judyth Vary Baker's book (to me) explains that LHO was at the Jackson Mental hospital at the same time because it was part of Dr. Ochsner's cancer project. She also implicates Rep. Edwin Edward Willis and HUAC.

Final Judgment by Michael Collins Piper reveals that Roy Frankhouser was working for the National Security Council on the JFK assassination plot.

The Torbitt File reveals the connection of General Julius Klein, Wernher von Braun and the Permindex organization to the plot.

What is said in these books, other than what I have mentioned, is (to me) pretty much immaterial. I could go through my entire bibliography of (now) 190 books and tell you exactly what new items of evidence (if any) that I discovered in that particular book. The information that was irrelevant, immaterial, etc. I quickly disregarded.

In fact, in my opinion, it is unlikely that more than, say, five people ever knew the scope of the entire plot or even all of the basic names involved. It was undoubtedly compartmentalized. The closest we have to an "insider confession" is the book by Prouty. Yet he himself openly features the fact that he was sent to Antarctica to keep him in the dark about the plot and the plotters. And as a result, he apparently remained in the dark on most of the plot information.

Regarding the JFK National Archives records, SOMEONE ALIVE TODAY has been going through those records to determine if they can be released. If the entire body of necessary information was inside one of those files, or even two or three, then that person would know who killed JFK, how and why. Don't people see that this is impossible? If there was something there that was of this magnitude, some investigator would (even accidentally) spill the beans, maybe to his wife, or somebody. There is, most likely, no "smoking gun" in the National Archives or other U.S. government files. (That's not to say there is no valuable evidence there, however).

Many people (in my opinion) don't realize that ONE MERE FACT like identifying Skorzeny as QJ/WIN could easily outweigh in importance, an entire book like Dallas 1963 by Bill Minutaglio et.al., Destiny Betrayed by Di Eugenio, or even Deep Politics and the Death of JFK by Peter Dale Scott.

My investigative technique is apparently very similar to that of Fusion GPS. Glenn Simpson (of that firm) said that the first thing they do when hired to investigate something, is to order every available book from Amazon on the subject and to read them. AFTER THAT, THEY HIT THE PAVEMENT WITH INTERVIEWS, ETC.

I would say that my work on the assassination, has about 75% of the information and the parties involved. That's why I am still looking.

Question: Did FDR know about Pearl Harbor before it happened?

Question: Was FDR poisoned?

Question: Did Hitler survive WWII and die of old age in South America?

Question: Was the Vatican involved in the Lincoln assassination?

Question: Was the US National Security State invented by Gestapo Chief Heinrich Muller?

Question: Did the airplanes made by the Wright brothers actually fly?

It's not a question of "who has the truth?' Rather, it's "which theory survives."

James Lateer