Just Was Removed By Walker On Other Forum

[Peter Lemkin]

Peter empty both your email boxes here and your regular email, they are both full...and emails are bouncing in cyber space...best b..

Was fulll to bursting due to screen captures....should be OK now, try again...sorry. Peter

well i get just junk...on it's way best b..:vroam:

The server was just at its limit. It is fixed now...even if I'm not.
I had always thought that when one fell a level in Dante's 'Hell' one fell one level at a time....over at the EF, it seems I went from the top to the seventh level down in one fell swoop...and with no cause given, no time to deal with such niceties as defense or discussion or even the accusations.....Unknown to Dante at the time of his writing, there was a wormhole in spacetime at the bottom, and maybe if I fit, I'll squirm through it and come out the other side. This has all been a rather Alice in Wonderland experience for me.....and not a happy one, indeed. If I stand in some minds as 'guilty' of only trying to defend myself against charges never rendered and not true, I plead 'guilty' - to defending my name and my honor. I did no wrong, but was wronged. That I was given no way to even defend myself on the forum on which I was secretly accused, speaks [sic] for itself. That they have now silenced even those who would speak for me or on my behalf in their OWN VOICE says even more..... All mods on that forum and at least one Admin have been given the alleged and falsely named 'offending' email - yet there is silence. What other charges were there? Name 'em [they never have been] and I'll knock 'em down one at a time...just like the one on the email. I will not be slandered nor silenced. There they still allow the free voice of those who would speak or speculate against me. How fair.

[Peter Lemkin]

Posted by: Robert Charles-Dunne Mar 11 2010, 06:55 PM [on EF - url not available as it has been removed!]

I should think that any and all potentially libelous material has been removed from public view for obvious reasons. And Peter's being denied an opportunity to resurrect them.

I don’t usually weigh in on such procedural matters, and I feared precisely this type of cockup would become inevitable with the introduction of moderators. The level of debate here was coarsened when members were no longer trusted to comport themselves as responsible adults. The resulting name-calling and appeals to the referees make soccer dives seem legitimate by comparison.

However, now that the predictable bun-fight has erupted with a vengeance, a few thoughts, if I may be so bold.

…… I don’t say that ….., only to underscore that if I now say anything in his defense, it is not because I am his friend, nor because I think that he was a splendid choice for mod. I am not and do not.

However, if the powers-that-be who run this place have sufficient confidence in a member to award him moderator status, then those same powers ought grant him an opportunity to challenge and refute whatever charges are leveled against him. In this instance, it seems that this wasn’t done, with Andy Walker unilaterally and arbitrarily taking executive action against somebody for whom his loathing was hardly a secret. Summary execution, if you will. Lethal failure number one.

[Full disclosure: Andy Walker and I have recently crossed swords in a thread here, but whatever I say herein is entirely unrelated to such issues. My impression of Andy is that he has been swift to demean those who displease him (with Jack White being a favoured whipping boy, imho), but has often been so bitingly witty in the process that I couldn’t - and can’t - hold a grudge. He thinks the lot of us are starkers, is my best guess, and seems to amuse himself by occasionally picking off those he thinks are the easiest targets for his well-honed scorn. Were he not an administrator, he’d be virtually irrelevant, based solely upon contributions hereto. He is not one of our number.]

No doubt Andy thought he was saving a damsel in distress, and mitigating his own legal liability, when he acted by shutting Peter down. However, that ill-considered gambit has resulted in an even worse situation. Peter’s reputation hangs in the balance upon unproved, un-itemized allegations of sexual predation - repeated here in the general abstract, along with glaringly stupid suggestions that Peter is mentally imbalanced - that have been denied by Peter, and now, also by his alleged accuser. Having already found Peter guilty and passed sentence summarily, this is a rather shaming development for our Mr. Walker who seems to have found himself at road’s end. Action taken for ostensibly laudible goals has been revealed to be based more on personal animus toward Peter Lemkin than upon any foul he may have committed, by Andy Walker's own admission, I would strongly argue. Lethal failure number two.

It is unlikely that Andy would acknowledge this, for he seems to think conspiracy is a rare thing, but the conventional wisdom in such matters has it that the coverup only serves to accentuate the crime. The very fact that Dean has posted this thread illustrates that it will not be forgotten simply because the evidence has been so crudely scuttled from public view, no matter how much the responsible party may wish it to be so. Elimination of the evidence doesn’t move the hands on the clock backward, nor remove from the public consciousness all awareness of its one-time existence. Lethal failure number three.

I do not know how this thing can be negotiated into a mutually agreeable resolution, but I do know that all parties had best make a good faith attempt to achieve same. The alternative is an unenviable one, in which barristers and solicitors with no personal skin in the game will be the only ones made happy, at the expense of those with the most skin in the game. Please, gentlemen, work this thing out, for your own sakes and that of the Forum that I fear will be sacrificed if you don’t. …….

[Peter Lemkin]

Posted for Peter Lemkin Mar 12 2010, 09:27 AM; url not at EF available, as has been 'disappeared'

Robert, I for one will never shoot at you. I think you are about the best, if not THE best and most articulate voice of reason, political acumen. plus wise and artistic wordweaving we have [or I had] on this Forum. I stand accused of nothing except trying to defend myself from false charges. Long before this broke out publicly I sent both Administrators privately offers to prove the allegations false in some in camera setting [not on the Forum publicly], as I had and have more than enough proof to do so. From one came silence, from the other more vitriol. Please note that the charges when revealed to most [although several members secretly had been let in on them, as well as the women in question through a whispering campaign - the source of which I'll leave to the imagination of such clever people] accused me of having done untoward things to multiple women [there was an 's' applied twice]. Now we all know there was never even the one. So, though not guilty; though not presented the evidence; though not allowed to defend myself; and though I did try briefly - that has all be expunged - along with the half-baked limited-modified-hangout demi-semi-partial retraction [also gone]. No full retraction, no apology, no re-instatement of my membership [no charges as to why it was removed]; lies that my IP was/is not blocked, when it is. I seem to remember from the Watergate era a phrase that went like this: What did they know [or invent], and when did they know it [or invent it]? Walker said he was taking some leave and has not left. He feigned resignation only to come back to vote against me. Vote on what and a vote taken just before the 'news' that the 'rumour' was false....great timing....one might even say a bit 'too good' to be true. So, the man who believes in no conspiracy since the assassination of Caesar apparently, it seems, was in some way involved in one - yet in a letter to the mods I was accused of a conspiracy to destroy the good name of Mr. Walker. Ironic, in the extreme. It started IMO as a political vendetta and grew and grew. My attempts to present evidence against vague charges or hear them or defend myself were denied, ignored or when attempted on my own removed. It never happened - or so they'd like you to believe. I'm a teacher at University, currently unemployed - imagine trying to get a job with these allegations over one's head, let alone a date. So many employers and potential dates 'google' names just to see what pops up. There were other epithets hurled at me in public and in private - thinking like a Nazi, unstable, insane [boilingly so], dangerous, and on and on and on. Found to be innocent, yet executed - without trial or due process. I believe commonly known as a lynching. It was all in the timing and the manipulation of the whispering campaign. Of what may I ask am I accused of to warrant removal from the Forum, ditto my IP blocked? I did not start any of this. I did not ever do anything wrong or break forum rules - yes I showed a private message as my only way to expose the ugly rumor and to defend myself as I saw the noose dangling on yonder tree with my neck's name on it. I thank all those who see some injustice in this. I feel personally offended and my reputation besmirched [a mild understatement]. Peter Lemkin, in banishment and my IP blocked.

[Peter Lemkin]

Posted by: Mark Knight Mar 12 2010, 07:17 AM [From EF, but cannot give a url, as it has been 'disappeared' along with all my defense threads and then those started by others coming to my defense. On last lone one remains in which no one is allowed to post anything from me nor, apparently, even in support of me]

I was going to let this one pass...and then an old poem came to mind:

"First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out...because I was not a communist.
Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out...because I was not a socialist.
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out...because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out...because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me...and there was no one left to speak out for me." -- Martin Niemoller

So effectively Peter Lemkin is gone from the forum, banned because he stood up for himself in the face of charges that were later withdrawn. If it can be done to someone as well-known within the community as Peter, how much easier would it be to do likewise with someone such as me...or you?

I understand the concept of attempting to mitigate one's liability...especially when it regards the assassination of a man's character based upon charges that were made and them withdrawn. Perhaps that's the way to silence ALL those who believe in conspiracy...make charges against their character, use those charges as justification to withdraw their priveleges here, and then withdraw the charges...but prevent the wrongly-accused party from using the forum in which they were "convicted" to defend themselves against what appear to be spurious charges. If it can happen to Peter Lemkin, who's next on the hit list in this grand non-conspiracy [since Andy Walker doesn't believe in conspiracies]? One of the lower-level contributors such as me? Someone as visible as Jim Root? Or perhaps a frequent-flier such as Bill Kelley?

It would appear that, from a legal standpoint, one of the administrative "birds" of this forum has apparently "fouled" his own nest...this from a layman's point of view, since I am not an attorney.

[Peter Lemkin]

Posted by: Don Jeffries Mar 12 2010, 06:22 AM [From EF, url not available, as thread has been 'disappeared']

All the moderators received an email from Andy yesterday, informing us that Peter was no longer a member. If it is true that his accuser has now publicly acknowledged that her accusations were the result of a misunderstanding, and has retracted them, then I think it is only fair to note that here, since the vague charges were available for all to see.

It seems that Peter is guilty of nothing more than having views which are objectionable to some here. As I noted before, any nastiness or name calling in his posts was hardly unique on this forum. Far too many posters resort to this on a regular basis, without being banned from the forum.

....Then came a royal pronouncement or Papal Bull that was read as to why I was removed. It addressed none of the things done to me: the permanent moderation for causes not given and no actions on my part; my IP blocked, my membership expunged - all without reason - and with the meek mention of the only formal charge given retracted after the punishment already given and even escalated; then after being up for only two hours, removed along with all my efforts to get heard and get answers. In this Papal Bull it was basically that I had mentioned the possibility of legal action - but they failed to mention that that was NOT until way, way, way into the process I even mentioned it....with all the intervening unexplained, illegal by their own rules, immoral and undemocratic by any account events happening to me.....On another thread when I made the mistake to soon provide a timeline proving this the thread was locked and the Forum locked-down as to anyone posting for me or in defense of me.

[Peter Lemkin]

Google has rather mysteriously removed most of the cached versions of the Lemkin's Removal As Moderator and Moderation thread. Only a very few pages remain and more are disappearing every day. The complete version is long gone. The cached version should not lead back to the original url - but in this case all disappeared ones do, so are gone as the EF made it all disappear into a black hole of culpability and embarrassment. Cui bono? Who looses - the TRUTH they say they represent and explore.

[David Guyatt]

Concerning Don Jeffries comments in post no. 175, I note again that Colby states categorically, categorically, that the dropped sex pest charges against you were not the reason for your ejection from that place.

Isn't most odd that even the moderators don't seem to know what was gong on, but Colby - a non moderator and non- admin did.

Who has been priming his pump I wonder? Unless it was his complaints that led to Peter's removal.

[Peter Lemkin]

Concerning Don Jeffries comments in post no. 175, I note again that Colby states categorically, categorically, that the dropped sex pest charges against you were not the reason for your ejection from that place.

Isn't most odd that even the moderators don't seem to know what was gong on, but Colby - a non moderator and non- admin did.

Who has been priming his pump I wonder? Unless it was his complaints that led to Peter's removal.

There is no transparency in the matter, and one can only speculate about some things - but there is some evidence; however, the greater part was always hidden - and what was public, has now been removed from view. As far as I know never were any charges formally leveled [some just hinted innuendo and 'whispered' plus some members claiming to know what they were - some even claiming to have proofs and/or having seen the evidence - I think not in any case! Walker claimed to have the evidence and Simkin recently admitted neither ever did!] at me for ANY of the actions taken. No reason ever given as to why there was to/should be a vote on my being a moderator at status quo anti was 'one more chance' [and certainly NO evidence nor explanation I know of given to the voters as to on what they were to evaluate me upon [crimes done or rules broken]; nor was I allowed to know of any and/or make any presentation as to why the [secret] allegations might be false and thus to defend myself against them. No reason ever given for why immediately after the vote for my being put on permanent moderation by Walker; we later learned he resigned after doing this; we later learn that Simkin before? going to a funeral lifted said permanent moderation, but shortly thereafter Walker was invited back to vote on me [unfair in the extreme due to his extreme bias and predjudice plus previous illegal action against me [by his own admission and actions]; no reason given why I was then not only removed as a moderator and not just again a pleb member - but within hours of that had had my IP blocked and was removed as a member; no reason as to why sometime shortly after that all my posts were removed and remain removed. I now have apparently been given a kind of blackmail option [my interpretation of message relayed] that if I will stop posting here, the posts will be forthcoming - how/when not stated. I turn that around; posts here will continue until the posts are returned to me in a DVD and/or put back up on the EF [preferred!]; as they never should have been removed and history distorted in the first place! I'm sure there is much, many more undercurrents I don't know about or know about from hearsay, but can't prove - and don't want to post now. I'm investigating. Anyone with information they care to share, send me a PM or email, please. Thank you. Further, anyone who thinks they can help me add points to a timeline and/or have important screen captures or thread downloads on all this, please also contact me by email or PM - not by posting. This has all been very distressing, stressful, and most cruel and unfair. A conspiratorial silencing and lynching along with the destruction of all my work product / sweat equity and history as i knew it destroyed and hidden from the members and the world - to protect two whom rather than needing protection, need some lessons in fairness, ethics and not distorting history or their own rules. IMO

[Peter Lemkin]

Concerning Don Jeffries comments in post no. 175, I note again that Colby states categorically, categorically, that the dropped sex pest charges against you were not the reason for your ejection from that place.

Isn't most odd that even the moderators don't seem to know what was gong on, but Colby - a non moderator and non- admin did.

Who has been priming his pump I wonder? Unless it was his complaints that led to Peter's removal.

In fact the excuses for that was done [always presented long after the fact, not before being done and NEVER with the civil and decent provision for the accused to explain or prove them false] kept changing, until JS settled on two: 1] this thread [only started after I was kicked off and silenced - this being my only real voice and 2] the mention that I was considering the possibility if they didn't unblock my IP, put back my posts and reinstate my membership[having never taken any nor yet contacted any legal
persons!]. But they fail [on purpose!] to mention that I only even entertained that, LONG, LONG after all sorts of illegal, immoral, illogical, undemocratic and against their own rules and stated ethical standards been: 'accused' without charges mentioned, put on permanent moderation without cause given ever, my IP blocked and my membership canceled AND all my posts put in the garbage - ONLY THEN did I contemplate and say I was contemplating possible legal moves.....but they make the end event the reason for their first and second and all of their moves. These are sick and desperate men - Walker most of all. I'm shocked at John Simkin who I long considered a friend and had long private email discussions with about many things, as well as congenial exchanges on the forum posts. To my understanding Colby and Dolva and one mod and a few others claimed to have had information about the alleged [and now proven wrong sexual allegations - and to have even seen them [Simkin admitted recently that no one had seen them!]. Doesn't look very good, does it. Doesn't look very fair. You blame me for being 'here' and those here long ago were dismayed I was still there....I stayed because of Simkin - Walker being an obvious troll, even if an 'administrator'. But your sold me out for the convenience of have someone who could handle the technical aspects of the forum software for a penny, John and your pride has even allowed you to now make post facto lies, to 'justify' your actions. Shame on you!

The best [although inadequate] analogy I can think of at the moment it to have been gaged, bound with ropes and chains, tied to the back of a pick-up truck driven my Walker and dragged in the muck of lies and innuendo I could not defend myself from. At the end of the ride, Walker stopped at a location where Simkin was to inspect the body they thought dead. But I mustered my last ounce of energy and struggled to my feet, bloody, bruised, cut, parts missing and nearly dead and in with my last energy of life force lunged at the two for the grievous harm and injustice done. Simkin then pronounced that the reason they had done what they had done to me was because I had in the end lunged at them and tried to assault them. Say it ain't so! It ain't! It is false and distorted history - and you know it, as do most members there know it! It was cruel and unjust and as Dunne said Walker trying to pick-off those he hated who he thought he could get away with...well I'm going to show you you can't get away with a lynching so easily!...and then cover it up with LIES!

Again, a call for all who see injustice in this to help me build a timeline of events and to send me screen captures and downloaded threads now disappeared to protect the guilty. Don't, if you are still on the EF, risk the wrath of the PTB and post it, but contact me privately. If you can't figure out how, ask a friend or post that you want me to contact you. Thanks in advance. May the truth prevail and all be EDUCATED as to what REALLY happened. !

[Peter Lemkin]

From the EF: John Simkin @ Mar 16 2010, 08:48 AM)

... Andy and myself did discuss this complaint when it was originally made. The problem was the complaint was made at a time when we were discussing whether Peter Lemkin should be made a moderator. I was concerned that Peter was a target of a smear campaign. Without being sent copies of the offensive emails it was impossible to ban him from the forum for a crime that we did not have enough evidence to convict him of.

So, now knowing it was false and I was the target of a smear campaign organized, apparently, by Walker himself, Simkin still defends this anti-matter logic. Now it becomes this thread and my mentioning the possibility [to this day there is no reality nor action toward...] of legal action to clear my name and to get justice for libelous statements and lack of ability to defend against them. John, Walker even resigned over what he did - just about an admission of wrongdoing - and you asked him back; but if he was guilty by his own admission of doing me wrong how could you let him then vote on me and block my IP and cut me off - and they approve post facto those actions. In your Gratz diversion thread you refuse to mention [on purpose, IMO] that even Gratz did not have his posts removed. What kind of endless dissembling and now gagging the members from letting me speak [after wrongly treated and wrongly removed BEFORE any mention whatsoever of the word 'legal'?!] - or of the clear threat implied they can NOT EVEN speak in their own voice in my support without chance and likelihood of permanent moderation. It has become the EF Gulag, IMO.

I had someone who seemed to me like a messenger from you, who made it sound as if it were their own idea; but I know how these things usually work - who told me to stop posting on this thread or I'll never see my posts again [in either a DVD form or on the EF again]. I'll turn that around. I will NOT STOP POSTING about what went on there and how I was wronged and how you are twisting and distorting history and hiding and protecting the guilty [Walker] UNLESS and UNTIL either the posts are put back up [much preferred], or I receive all of them via DVD. Final on that! Any attempt to silence me after the gross injustices done to me when I had committed nothing wrong - only trying to defend myself - will not stand. Your few dissembling post hoc 'rationales' for why the horrors were done to me BEFORE the actions you now use as the excuse are just that - excuses.

YOU have NOW been sent copies of the 'email in question', though you haven't admitted to that. Four others have as well, and they are free and invited to comment on them on forum. They are harmless in all manner mentioned or WHISPERED about - and in Walker's vile attack on me in his PM - which we now know was based on lies, hearsay and political vendetta - ONLY - yet you act as if it was still valid and not the trigger for much of what followed. How clever you are about others; how obtuse about your own psyche!. Since you chose to make it and all my attempts at a defense against the illegal and unethical lynching I was undergoing disappear [much in the manner of the three-letter agencies] here it is:

Personal MessageAndy Walker Sep 10 2009, 01:12 PM
Administrator
Member No.: 1
QUOTE
QUOTE
You appear to be calling me a racist elsewhere.
Perhaps you would like to substantiate this claim on the forum.

Andy, My comments were not intended to say [nor do I think that] you are a racist. You and I, obviously have rather opposite views of history, current political underpinnings, and who rules these societies and perhaps many of them into Empires, or not. There is a 'standard' history [that of the dominant powers, the mainstream media and the [in my view] hidden from public view Oligarchy] and a 'real' People's History. One is top-down; the other bottom-up. One is [IMO] mostly propaganda for control; the other the actual events uncovered. If you believe LHO killed JFK and that Princess Diana had a non-conspiratorial accident - or that 19 bad pilots and men of slight build and a guy in a cave masterminded 9-11 and outwitted the most powerful military and nation on Earth, that doesn't make you a racist...only naive, IMO. I don't engage you much on the Forum, not because you are numero uno, but because you seem so entrenched and self-blinded, I think there is little to be gained. You must think me quite insane. Fine. We'll stage the revolution without you. IMO History of the last 14,000 years or so [when the domination paradigm kicked-in] has been one of powerful small groups and individuals conspiring for power, money and control of information. You do not. So be it. I have not one doubt in my belief. What must you think of John, who shares many of my beliefs....with the possible exception of 9-11 [as he has never weighed in on that, I really don't know]? Education is both learning facts and collected knowledge, as well as the ability to think for oneself and to always question the perceived wisdom, facts and authority. That is how I teach. No offense was meant in my post. I was making statements about empire, but don't know if you back them. Only fear you don't see them [now]...not the one's of old. They are still with us....and even stronger than before, as they are more hidden now.

Best. Peter

Yes I believe you are mad - boilingly so. Every time you post this is confirmed. I also contend that you are quite a dangerous and mixed up personality. You might be aware I am sure of the complaints of harrassment I have received about you from forum members which only remain in the private realm out of my respect for the wishes of the complainees. This when coupled to the fantasy 'conspiracy' world you live in suggests to me a really quite dangerous and disjointed individual.
You are I am sure incapable of seeing the irony in your comments so I won't labour them 'entrenched and self-blinded' 'naive'!
Just like the coward Drago you place me in the 'out group' and refuse to debate with me. Yours is the logic of the Nazi.
--------------------
Andy Walker