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I am following these exchanges closely and with great interest.
James, I'm very glad that you've chosen to share your knowledge and insights with us. As I've publicly stated on another forum, I have great respect for all that you've accomplished in regard to the JFK investigation.
That being said, I must vigorously disagree with your appreciation of the larger contours of the plot.
It's my intention to address your conclusions at some length; time will permit me to do so within a few days.
Until then, I offer this much: The problem with your presentation of vengeance as a motive for the assassination (as revealed in the hit's methodology) is that, unless I read you wrong, you elevate and isolate it as the prime motivation.
Was JFK murdered by conspirators who hated him, or did he die for grander, deeper, older political and world-historic reasons?
The answer: Yes.
By all means, carry on.
Best,
CD
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For your consideration:
Was the choice of a brutal, gory public execution as the method for JFK's murder designed as an act of vengeance -- or to look like one in order to support one or more of many fallback False Sponsor provocations?
Myra Bronstein
Unregistered
James Richards Wrote:Myra,
I hope not to confuse you here. Vidal's original plan was to be for Miami in the summer of 1963. That plan was subsequently usurped and expanded.
Vidal was in the loop here as the dangle was that an invasion of Cuba would be the result. This is why he stayed with the program.
The later Chicago and Miami failures was indeed from the playbook of the same conspirators that succeeded in Dallas.
I do not have any information regarding patsies for those cities. That would depend on what kind of assassination was intended.
Dallas was one game plan but it is impossible to say what was intended for those other cities.
Having said that, Vaughn Marlowe in California may provide an insight as to where the thinking was at the time.
As for JFK pulling out of Vietnam, I'm sure that made several folk unhappy but I'm not convinced they were involved in what happened in Dallas.
After JFK's death, there was a lot of political manoeuvering and I submit that we should not confuse that with reasons why he was killed in the first place.
Remember, JFK had a serious medical condition, he was indiscriminate with his affairs and there was plenty of career ending dirt his enemies could have used to discredit him out of office.
I get back to why JFK was killed the way he was in an open car travelling through a modern American city? If we ponder that mind-set then we may get a little closer to those who planned it.
Like I said, this was personal. In my opinion of course.
James
Of course James. And I welcome your personal opinion. I guess one of the things I'm digging to find out from you is whether or not you think the Military was involved along with the individuals from the CIA and their Cuban cohorts.
For example I'm sure you're familiar with the Nov 22, 1963 episode wherein the president's cabinet was on an airplane unable to communicate with the White House because the official code book was missing from its special place aboard the plane. Doesn't that indicate that the military was involved because only they could have removed the code book?
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Myra,
As a precursor to my comments, I would like to say that I have no intention of trying to sway anyone from their thinking. I have no agenda other than hunting out the truth.
With that in mind and regarding your question about the military, nothing is cut and dry and no organization whether it be the CIA, the DIA or aspects of the military controlled the events of Dallas.
To that end, may I suggest you research Lieutenant General Joseph F. Carroll and the DIA from around the mid 1963 period.
I am not being evasive but I find it best that folk make their own discoveries.
Cheers,
James
Myra Bronstein
Unregistered
James Richards Wrote:Myra,
As a precursor to my comments, I would like to say that I have no intention of trying to sway anyone from their thinking. I have no agenda other than hunting out the truth.
With that in mind and regarding your question about the military, nothing is cut and dry and no organization whether it be the CIA, the DIA or aspects of the military controlled the events of Dallas.
To that end, may I suggest you research Lieutenant General Joseph F. Carroll and the DIA from around the mid 1963 period.
I am not being evasive but I find it best that folk make their own discoveries.
Cheers,
James
Well James, I'll read up on Lieutenant General Joseph F. Carroll if that's all you want to share. And to some extent I agree that it's good for people to make their own discoveries. However, when people ask specific questions based on prior research and discovery I see nothing wrong with giving specific answers. Furthermore, the JFK murder case has provided sufficient intrigue over so many decades that intrigue needn't be introduced in discussions on the subject.
Finally, and most important, the JFK murder case is so complex that it requires communal knowledge to even begin to understand it. So it's downright impractical, and very inefficient, for folks to make their own discoveries completely.
Forums like this exist to share information to facilitate the daunting task of answering critical questions--none more critical than "who killed President Kennedy?"
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Jack White Wrote:I seldom disagree with James, but on Vidal, I disagree 100%.
The man photographed is clearly a Negro.
Jack
I personally believe that the man photographed was Manuel Rodriguez Orcarberro of the 3126 Harlendale fame.
See physical description of Manuel Rodriguez Orcarberro on page 5 of April 26, 1964 Report of Wallace Heitman.
5’11”, 158 lbs, has brown hair, dark glasses, and has a dark complexion.
http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archiv...PageId=223
Steve Thomas
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James Richards Wrote:Myra,
As a precursor to my comments, I would like to say that I have no intention of trying to sway anyone from their thinking. I have no agenda other than hunting out the truth.
With that in mind and regarding your question about the military, nothing is cut and dry and no organization whether it be the CIA, the DIA or aspects of the military controlled the events of Dallas.
To that end, may I suggest you research Lieutenant General Joseph F. Carroll and the DIA from around the mid 1963 period.
I am not being evasive but I find it best that folk make their own discoveries.
Cheers,
James
CARROLL JOSEPH FRANCIS
Bamford,J. The Puzzle Palace. 1982 (190)
Burrows,W. Deep Black. 1988 (110)
Corson,W. Trento,S.& J. Widows. 1989 (203)
Hepburn,J. Farewell America. 1968 (321)
Langguth,A. Hidden Terrors. 1978 (107)
Mader,J. Who's Who in CIA. 1968
Mangold,T. Cold Warrior. 1991 (391)
Mollenhoff,C. The Pentagon. 1967 (116)
NameBase NewsLine 1994-04 (13)
Newman,J. JFK and Vietnam. 1992 (280-1, 466)
Prados,J. Keepers of the Keys. 1991 (204)
Prouty,L.F. JFK. 1992 (228)
Richelson,J. The Wizards of Langley. 2001 (82)
Russell,D. The Man Who Knew Too Much. 1992 (235)
Turner,W. Hoover's FBI. 1993 (303)
Wise,D. Ross,T. The Invisible Government. 1974 (215)
"Let me issue and control a nation's money and I care not who writes the laws. - Mayer Rothschild
"Civil disobedience is not our problem. Our problem is civil obedience! People are obedient in the face of poverty, starvation, stupidity, war, and cruelty. Our problem is that grand thieves are running the country. That's our problem!" - Howard Zinn
"If there is no struggle there is no progress. Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and never will" - Frederick Douglass
Myra Bronstein
Unregistered
Peter Lemkin Wrote:CARROLL JOSEPH FRANCIS
Bamford,J. The Puzzle Palace. 1982 (190)
Burrows,W. Deep Black. 1988 (110)
Corson,W. Trento,S.& J. Widows. 1989 (203)
Hepburn,J. Farewell America. 1968 (321)
Langguth,A. Hidden Terrors. 1978 (107)
Mader,J. Who's Who in CIA. 1968
Mangold,T. Cold Warrior. 1991 (391)
Mollenhoff,C. The Pentagon. 1967 (116)
NameBase NewsLine 1994-04 (13)
Newman,J. JFK and Vietnam. 1992 (280-1, 466)
Prados,J. Keepers of the Keys. 1991 (204)
Prouty,L.F. JFK. 1992 (228)
Richelson,J. The Wizards of Langley. 2001 (82)
Russell,D. The Man Who Knew Too Much. 1992 (235)
Turner,W. Hoover's FBI. 1993 (303)
Wise,D. Ross,T. The Invisible Government. 1974 (215)
Thanks Peter. I need to get in the habit of using Namebase.
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