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Police find body in bag at MI6 man's London flat
#11
Fwiw - there are some formatting glitches in post #9 and much of what is attributed to me represents text from the Daily Mail or comments by Peter.
"It means this War was never political at all, the politics was all theatre, all just to keep the people distracted...."
"Proverbs for Paranoids 4: You hide, They seek."
"They are in Love. Fuck the War."

Gravity's Rainbow, Thomas Pynchon

"Ccollanan Pachacamac ricuy auccacunac yahuarniy hichascancuta."
The last words of the last Inka, Tupac Amaru, led to the gallows by men of god & dogs of war
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#12
The telegraph begins the public softening up process for the inevitable cover-up. Grave issues of National Security are involved doncha know?

The thing is MI6 appear to have been slow off the mark on this one, not to mentioned a tad flustered with their well-worn tactics alleging rituals, kinky/homo/auto-erotic sex (haven't had pedophillia yet but it's early days) etc etc. Plod does seem to have been somewhat miffed by them though - and I sense a degree of fluttering in the Dovecote's of State. It will be fascinating to watch developments.
Quote:The true explanation for the murder of Gareth Williams, the MI6 codebreaker found dead in a bath, may have to be kept secret even if his killer is found and put on trial, lawyers have warned.

The intense secrecy surrounding the investigation has prompted speculation that any future court case could be the first murder trial in British legal history to be held entirely behind closed doors.

Mr Williams, 31, an employee of GCHQ, the government’s “listening post” in Cheltenham, Glos, who was working on secondment to MI6 in London, was found dead at a flat in London last week.

No one has been arrested and police have been investigating Mr Williams’s background as well as his movements in the days before his death.
But it is thought that the unique level of sensitivity around the case – with the dead man, his workmates, his movements and even the flat where he was found all linked to the security services – could make any future court case virtually impossible to try in public.
Lawyers said that powers already available under the criminal procedure rules 2005 could be used by a judge to hold all or part of any future trial in secret for reasons of national security.
Under a separate procedure the prosecution could even apply for a “Public Interest Immunity certificate” banning sensitive evidence being disclosed even to the defence.
Similar powers were recently used by David Miliband, the former Foreign Secretary, in an attempt to prevent three senior judges disclosing details about the treatment of Binyam Mohamed, the former Guantánamo Bay detainee.
In 2008 the case of Wang Yam, a financial adviser accused of murdering Allan Chappelow, an 86-year-old writer, made legal history when it was heard partly in secret. .....

etc etc
Peter Presland

".....there is something far worse than Nazism, and that is the hubris of the Anglo-American fraternities, whose routine is to incite indigenous monsters to war, and steer the pandemonium to further their imperial aims"
Guido Preparata. Preface to 'Conjuring Hitler'[size=12][size=12]
"Never believe anything until it has been officially denied"
Claud Cockburn

[/SIZE][/SIZE]
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#13
Peter Presland Wrote:The telegraph begins the public softening up process for the inevitable cover-up. Grave issues of National Security are involved doncha know?

The thing is MI6 appear to have been slow off the mark on this one, not to mentioned a tad flustered with their well-worn tactics alleging rituals, kinky/homo/auto-erotic sex (haven't had pedophillia yet but it's early days) etc etc. Plod does seem to have been somewhat miffed by them though - and I sense a degree of fluttering in the Dovecote's of State. It will be fascinating to watch developments.
Quote:The true explanation for the murder of Gareth Williams, the MI6 codebreaker found dead in a bath, may have to be kept secret even if his killer is found and put on trial, lawyers have warned.

The intense secrecy surrounding the investigation has prompted speculation that any future court case could be the first murder trial in British legal history to be held entirely behind closed doors.

Mr Williams, 31, an employee of GCHQ, the government’s “listening post” in Cheltenham, Glos, who was working on secondment to MI6 in London, was found dead at a flat in London last week.

No one has been arrested and police have been investigating Mr Williams’s background as well as his movements in the days before his death.
But it is thought that the unique level of sensitivity around the case – with the dead man, his workmates, his movements and even the flat where he was found all linked to the security services – could make any future court case virtually impossible to try in public.
Lawyers said that powers already available under the criminal procedure rules 2005 could be used by a judge to hold all or part of any future trial in secret for reasons of national security.
Under a separate procedure the prosecution could even apply for a “Public Interest Immunity certificate” banning sensitive evidence being disclosed even to the defence.
Similar powers were recently used by David Miliband, the former Foreign Secretary, in an attempt to prevent three senior judges disclosing details about the treatment of Binyam Mohamed, the former Guantánamo Bay detainee.
In 2008 the case of Wang Yam, a financial adviser accused of murdering Allan Chappelow, an 86-year-old writer, made legal history when it was heard partly in secret. .....

etc etc

Ah, yes....the brave new world post 9-11 and 7-7, where anything can be and almost everything will be secret....and democracy, open legal process, sunshine in governmental actions, all that intelligence agencies do are buried. It is not a war on terrorists, but of terror and upon US - all of us not behind the 'curtain'.
"Let me issue and control a nation's money and I care not who writes the laws. - Mayer Rothschild
"Civil disobedience is not our problem. Our problem is civil obedience! People are obedient in the face of poverty, starvation, stupidity, war, and cruelty. Our problem is that grand thieves are running the country. That's our problem!" - Howard Zinn
"If there is no struggle there is no progress. Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and never will" - Frederick Douglass
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#14
Given that every second person now seems to work for the UKUSA Stasi state apparatus open trials may become a thing of the past. It would be fitting.
"The philosophers have only interpreted the world, in various ways. The point, however, is to change it." Karl Marx

"He would, wouldn't he?" Mandy Rice-Davies. When asked in court whether she knew that Lord Astor had denied having sex with her.

“I think it would be a good idea” Ghandi, when asked about Western Civilisation.
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#15
They are saying he was found in the bath in that article. I thought he was found in a bag?
"The philosophers have only interpreted the world, in various ways. The point, however, is to change it." Karl Marx

"He would, wouldn't he?" Mandy Rice-Davies. When asked in court whether she knew that Lord Astor had denied having sex with her.

“I think it would be a good idea” Ghandi, when asked about Western Civilisation.
Reply
#16
Magda Hassan Wrote:They are saying he was found in the bath in that article. I thought he was found in a bag?
I think you'll find the consensus claim combines the two - ie in a bag in the bath. Confused:
Peter Presland

".....there is something far worse than Nazism, and that is the hubris of the Anglo-American fraternities, whose routine is to incite indigenous monsters to war, and steer the pandemonium to further their imperial aims"
Guido Preparata. Preface to 'Conjuring Hitler'[size=12][size=12]
"Never believe anything until it has been officially denied"
Claud Cockburn

[/SIZE][/SIZE]
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#17
Peter Presland Wrote:
Magda Hassan Wrote:They are saying he was found in the bath in that article. I thought he was found in a bag?
I think you'll find the consensus claim combines the two - ie in a bag in the bath. Confused:

...with the doors locked and mobile phoneS and sim cardS arranged in some pattern....

...I think trying to get the truth on this now will be like trying to nail down a blob of mercury. Obviously, this man was involved in something so sensitive [read: dirty] that the truth will not out. Likely related to drugs, war, nukes, dirty politics, dirty banking, dirty tricks, provocations, resource grabs, weapons of mass destruction, oil, empire building - or all of those...that, after all, is what the 'intelligence' agencies do most of their time....:bebored:

I just LOVE the initial 'coronor's report' of 'inconclusive'......was he dead or not? hacked up or not? in a bag or not? etc......again, whoever is in charge of this would have not been out of place in Dallas nor Bethesda; 9-11 govt. reportage, etc...and so many in between....:girl:
"Let me issue and control a nation's money and I care not who writes the laws. - Mayer Rothschild
"Civil disobedience is not our problem. Our problem is civil obedience! People are obedient in the face of poverty, starvation, stupidity, war, and cruelty. Our problem is that grand thieves are running the country. That's our problem!" - Howard Zinn
"If there is no struggle there is no progress. Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and never will" - Frederick Douglass
Reply
#18
Quote:The body of Gareth Williams was found stuffed in a bag in the bath of an MI6 safehouse in Pimlico, south London,

Ssssshhhhhh :listen:

That's all classified information.

The chopped up body.

The name of the British agent.

The stuffing.

The size and nature of the bag.

The porcelain of the bath.

"MI6 safehouse" - nonono, a flat in a quiet residential street of London.

Pimlico? Uh yes - full of sloane rangers and inbred airheads, OK yar?

Nothing to see here whatsoever.... :ciao:
"It means this War was never political at all, the politics was all theatre, all just to keep the people distracted...."
"Proverbs for Paranoids 4: You hide, They seek."
"They are in Love. Fuck the War."

Gravity's Rainbow, Thomas Pynchon

"Ccollanan Pachacamac ricuy auccacunac yahuarniy hichascancuta."
The last words of the last Inka, Tupac Amaru, led to the gallows by men of god & dogs of war
Reply
#19
Spy Gareth Williams 'in good spirits' before death, family say
The family of a British spy found dead in a bag in his bath insisted last night he was “happy and in good spirits”, casting doubt on claims his personal or financial problems played a role in his death.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/c...y-say.html
By John Bingham [Telegraph]
Published: 7:30AM BST 31 Aug 2010
Gareth Williams, who was found dead in a flat in Pimlico Photo: SWNS

Relatives of Gareth Williams described him as “steady, quiet and well balanced” and said he had shown no sign of any change in recent months.

It came as one former friend of the MI6 codebreaker claimed that he had been plagued by his own “demons”.

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Pathologists have been unable to explain how the 31-year-old, whose body was found in a sports bag in the bath of a flat in Pimlico, central London, last week, died.

Remembered by school mates as a “maths genius”, Mr Williams was on a one-year secondment to MI6 from GCHQ, the government’s “listening post” in Cheltenham, Glos, where he worked for almost a decade.

His position regularly took him to the US where he liaised with the National Security Agency and the CIA and he is also reported to have made a number of visits to Afghanistan.

There were no obvious injuries on his body, which is thought to have lain undiscovered for more than a week and further tests are being carried out after a post mortem examination proved inconclusive.

Although detectives are working on the assumption that he was murdered they have not ruled out the possibility that Mr Williams died in a bizarre accident, from an overdose or even suicide. :dontknow: :dontknow: :dontknow: :dontknow:

One theory is that someone who was present at the time panicked and put his body in the bag but failed to remove it.

William Hughes, 61, Mr Williams’s uncle, insisted there was “no way” he could have taken his own life.

“He just wasn't that kind of person,” said Mr Hughes, who lives near the home of Mr Williams's parents, Ian and Ellen, in Anglesey, north Wales.

“He was always very steady. He was a quiet person, but he was a happy one, there'd been no shift in his personality.”

He added: “I saw Gareth a couple of months ago when he came home for a cycling event and he was in good spirits.

“He was just the same as he always was – friendly, happy and well balanced.”

Police have been interviewing friends and family in an attempt to find possible clues in his background.

But detectives have played down lurid claims that Mr Williams, remembered as a solitary figure despite his heavy involvement in competitive cycling, could have died in some form of sexual game.

Reports that a series of payments into and out of his bank account remain unaccounted for have also been dismissed as “speculation”.
-------------------------------------------
The Government Communications Headquarters in Cheltenham is Britain’s last great secret. Now it is in the focus of intense speculation among its stunned staff. Never before has one of their own been murdered. In GCHQ’s cafés, the seating area around the lawn at the core of the doughnut-shaped building and behind anonymous doors simply marked “No admission”, the same question continues to be asked: who murdered Gareth Williams – and why?

Despite his widow’s-peak haircut and geeky smile, he worked at the cutting edge of computer technology. His mathematical brain made him a vital tool in the fight against terrorism and cyber warfare. Yet the security services are anxious to play down his role, so as not to alarm the world over his importance to anyone involved in his murder.

In 2000, Williams left his Cambridge University course in advanced mathematics because he had already learned all he could. By then, he had also been “tapped” – recruited by GCHQ scouts, who tour universities looking for talent.

No one can be certain why he signed up. It wasn’t the salary. His £40,000 a year was far less than he could have earned in industry. But it is very likely that, like so many of his young colleagues at GCHQ, he was attracted by the challenges, the excitement of working at the centre of events that he would often know about before even the Prime Minister.

Being on the inside track would also have fitted his personality. Williams was the quintessential loner. His former landlady, Jenny Elliot, 71, said last week that “his life was his work”. He was exactly what GCHQ would have wanted.

The 30-year-old bachelor loved to go cycling and keep his muscular frame in trim in the GCHQ gym – pursuits of a single man. If he ever visited Cheltenham’s bars or went on dates, he kept such socialising to himself. Within the tight-lipped GCHQ community, he obeyed the law laid down by its director, Iain Lobban, who told his staff when he took over in 2008: “Say nothing to anybody.”

When Williams joined in 2001, he found himself among the largest group of mathematicians gathered within one UK organisation, along with hundreds of cryptologists and analysts. It’s a big operation: the electricity required to run GCHQ’s supercomputers would light a small town. He became part of a world where computers were linked to storage systems, each holding a petabyte of data – eight times more than the entire word count of the British Library. Soon, he found himself working in the Super Computer Centre, developing techniques to speed up data encryption.

A former GCHQ employee recalled last week that staff would boast that when one of its female employees became pregnant, “our computers could capture the first birth cry of her baby and follow the infant through life to its death, no matter where on earth it happened”.

Gareth Williams died without leaving such a trace. Last year, his section leader had told him he was being seconded to the London headquarters of MI6. It was a further sign of his steady progress up the hierarchy at GCHQ.

In 2003, he spent six months at Menwith Hill, the ultra-secret RAF station in Yorkshire. In reality, it is a transplant of the United States; the only connection with Britain is the detachment of Ministry of Defence police that patrols the perimeter.

It was here that Williams learned how to analyse the findings from Menwith Hill’s radomes – the imposing white structures resembling gigantic golf balls that intercept coded messages from satellite communication systems, which are then broken before being sent to GCHQ for further analysis.

In 2006, Williams also spent time at Fort Meade in Maryland, home of the United States’ National Security Agency, GCHQ’s partner in global surveillance. As GCHQ gathers secret intelligence from Europe, Africa and Russia west of the Ural Mountains, NSA covers east of the mountains, including Japan and China, the Pacific and South America. As a new arrival, Williams was invited to listen to recordings of Osama bin Laden talking to his mother on his satellite phone in the aftermath of 9/11.

With his tenure at MI6 coming to an end, Williams was told that he would rejoin GCHQ in a new department, the Cyber Security Operations Centre, a team of traffic analysts tracking the threat posed by would-be cyber terrorists to Britain’s banks and infrastructure. He died before he could take up this promotion.

A further sign of Williams’s importance was that he had been assigned to live at 36 Alderney Street – a high-security apartment in Pimlico that MI6 would have previously used to debrief one of its agents or a defector. Like all safe houses, it was functionally furnished – but with a direct phone line to MI6 headquarters less than a mile away. Williams would have been cautioned about who he was allowed to entertain at home.

In the days since his body was discovered last Monday, conspiracy theorists have filled the internet with claims that Williams had been stabbed and poisoned; that he was the victim of a sex attack; that he was either homosexual or transvestite; that sado-masochistic bondage gear had been found in the flat; that he was murdered because he had threatened to expose a cabal of gays in the intelligence world. All such possibilities are being examined this weekend by MI6 and MI5 working with Scotland Yard detectives.

Investigators have already discounted a theory that Williams was killed elsewhere and brought back to the apartment in the sports bag. But they are investigating whether a second key was cut for the apartment; locksmiths across London are being checked. CCTV footage at nearby Victoria station, as well as other London railway terminals, is under review for images of Williams returning from a recent holiday. He is known to have been back in London since August 11, and that a sighting was made on August 15 – one of the few details police have released.

As well as having trouble gathering evidence, police are finding it difficult to discover the exact nature of Williams’s work. They have been briefed that, despite earlier denials, it “impinged on national security”.

An intelligence officer close to the investigation confirmed: “He was not just a cog in the wheel. He had an important part in making the wheel go round.”

On Tuesday, a second post-mortem will be held: an initial post-mortem proved inconclusive, ruling out stabbing or shooting, with toxicology results still pending. I have been told that the Home Office forensic pathologist will be looking for evidence that Williams was neither stabbed nor poisoned, but smothered to death.

Dr Fawzi Renomran, the London-trained pathologist who conducted the autopsy on the body of Mahmoud al-Mabhouh, the Hamas terrorist who was killed in Dubai earlier this year, concluded that he had been smothered by a Mossad hit team. “It was a difficult form of murder to prove,” he said.

But, apart from Mossad, there are other intelligence services with experts in murder by smothering. They include the Russian SVR and the Chinese Secret Intelligence Service. Terrorist groups are also known to have used the method.

Until the next autopsy report becomes public, those two key questions – who murdered Gareth Williams, and why? – will continue to echo around GCHQ.
-------------------------------------------
Detectives say they are still looking at whether Gareth Williams may have been killed by a foreign intelligence agency seeking to stop his work on intercepting messages and code-breaking.

Interviews with friends and family of Mr Williams, 30, have offered no clear leads as to how or why he died. Checks on his phone records and bank accounts have also yet to provide anything conclusive.

As to Mr Williams’s social life, reports that he may have died in a sex game gone wrong have been played down by police, who say that although he may have visited a gay bar, they have found nothing to suggest that sex played a role in his death.

As a result, sources say they are continuing to co-operate closely with MI6, where Mr Williams was finishing a year-long secondment from GCHQ, and interviewing colleagues.

They are also investigating links with the US where he made a number of trips to liaise with the National Security Agency and the CIA.

He is thought to have returned to Britain from a foreign trip on Aug 11 and was last seen alive on Aug 15, eight days before his body was found in a holdall and left in his bath at the MI6 flat where he lived in Pimlico, London.

Investigators are keeping details of his exact movements secret to avoid encouraging spurious sightings. One source said: “Those people who know him will come forward and those who do not and have something to hide, we will track down.”

Sources close to the inquiry said they are looking at the possibility that his body was manhandled into the bag in order to remove it from the premises. They are searching the flat for fingerprints and DNA to determine if anyone was present when he died.

A pathologist has been unable to identify why Mr Williams died but toxicology test results are expected in the next few days that should identify whether he was smothered, poisoned or had taken drugs.

The keen cyclist seems to have had few close friends and been willing to confide little about his work or private life. Officers are eager not to jump to any conclusions about why Mr Williams was killed, or even whether he could have died in a bizarre accident and his body then moved.

One senior detective said: “It is possible he was the victim of a political assassination but the reality may be more mundane.”

Mr Williams’s family in Wales have said the continued speculation about his private life is “very distressing”.
"Let me issue and control a nation's money and I care not who writes the laws. - Mayer Rothschild
"Civil disobedience is not our problem. Our problem is civil obedience! People are obedient in the face of poverty, starvation, stupidity, war, and cruelty. Our problem is that grand thieves are running the country. That's our problem!" - Howard Zinn
"If there is no struggle there is no progress. Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and never will" - Frederick Douglass
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#20
Quote:There were no obvious injuries on his body, which is thought to have lain undiscovered for more than a week and further tests are being carried out after a post mortem examination proved inconclusive.
(snip)

One theory is that someone who was present at the time panicked and put his body in the bag but failed to remove it.

Um.

Rigor mortis = (loosely) death stiffness

So, this mate folded the stiff corpse of Gareth Williams into a bag and left it in the bath.

But then forgot all about it.

Easily done I suppose...

:goodnight:

Oh, silly me - I get it.

Quote:It came as one former friend of the MI6 codebreaker claimed that he had been plagued by his own “demons”.

Williams committed suicide and then folded his own stiff dead corpse up and put it in a bag in his bath.

Clever chaps, these code-breaking MI6 types... :y:
"It means this War was never political at all, the politics was all theatre, all just to keep the people distracted...."
"Proverbs for Paranoids 4: You hide, They seek."
"They are in Love. Fuck the War."

Gravity's Rainbow, Thomas Pynchon

"Ccollanan Pachacamac ricuy auccacunac yahuarniy hichascancuta."
The last words of the last Inka, Tupac Amaru, led to the gallows by men of god & dogs of war
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