Nelson's LBJ Mastermind book

[Dawn Meredith]

Well, I have addressed Bobby's death in "RFK: Outing the CIA at the Ambassador",
http://onlinejournal.com/artman/publish/...6464.shtml This appears to have been
a case of "tying up loose ends", where the agency wanted to make sure that he
would not be in the position to reopen the investigation into his brother's death.

As for Martin, that seems to me to have been a more localized matter, where his
location at the Lorraine Motel and even his room number, 306, was broadcast over
local radio and television. His death, I suspect, was largely a result of racism,
though I would not be surprised if J. Edgar, among others, had had a hand in it.

I am not an expert on MLK, but my point is rather simple. When you claim that
"The same powers that killed JFK killed MLK and RFK and are still in power as we
speak", what you are saying cannot be literally true. Most of those who were in
on JFK and RFK, for example, are among the dear departed. They are dead.

If they are dead, then they are not "still in power". My point was not to deny the
continuity of institutional interests, but rather to observe that abstractions do not
have the kind of explanatory power that you, among others, tend to ascribe to
them. It is specific individuals who make specific decisions and take specific actions.

There is no need to feel offended. My concern is that there is a tendency on the
"Deep Politics Forum" to treat entities like "the national security state" as though
appealing to it could explain specific events on specific occasions. It has a place
in inviting our attention to enduring interests but cannot explain specific events.

Well, DiEugenio dropped his little "bomb shell", in case you hadn't noticed. It is
tempting to infer than, if most people think something is false, then it must be
false. This especially affects those who have not studied the evidence. Since
you say that "the same powers" are still in power as we speak, are you talking
about Allen Dulles, J. Edgar, Clint Murchison, and LBJ? Do you think that "the
national security state" or some other abstraction exists apart from real people
who make real decisions and whose identities change across time? I think we
have a problem in sorting things out, where I have argued that the CIA played a
key role in the deaths of JFK and of RFK, but I would not suggest that the same
players, such as David Sanchez Morales, George Joannides, or Gordon Campbell
are "still in power". I think there is some degree of confusion here, where "the
national security state" sounds appealing as an explanation but cannot explain
any specific actions taken by any specific players on any specific occasion. So I
think your objection, which also appears to inspire Charles, is simply misguided.

I am not even touching the no planes or different planes theory, as this is a JFK assassination section of the forumn. For those who insist that LBJ was the "mastermind" I have yet to see one of them address the question of then who killed MLK and RFK.

There is no doubt that LBJ was in the 63 coup up to his eyeballs. But mastermind or at the top, not a chance. The same powers that killed JFK killed MLK and RFK and are still in power as we speak.

Dawn

This post is almost too absurd to even respond to. JIm I did not say PEOPLE I said powers. Power passes from one group of people to a different, but connected group after the former passes on. For example here in Austin the law firm of Ed Clark once held enourmous power. That power still exists. It WAS passed on. But I will not name the people it passed to.
Of course I mean "real people". I cannot believe I am even having to say this. And once again you ignored my question: who killed MLK and RFK?

Dawn

Jim: I am not going to discuss this further as I simply do not have the time to argue with someone who is not geting my point either on purpose or....???

I am not offended. If you do not understand that power passes from one group of people to the next then I cannot make it more plain. It was people who assassinated all three- the most powerful people in the world. That is why they got away with it. They are those who want more war, so anyone who threatens this is elimated. Be it John Kennedy or John Lennon. That is just one example of what the power brokers want. Drug dealing is another. The puppets in office, including LBJ go along or are killed. This is what JFK learned. And gave his life for. I realize your area of expertize is the Z film, which I consider a side issue, but you have read books like JFK and The Unspeakable, or ealier books like The Last Investigation right? Nothing in either of those books suggests LBJ is behind the killing of JKF. And those are just the first two books that came to mind.

All the principlas who assisted in Barr McCLellan's book are/ were good friends of mine, including Barr. However that does not make LBJ THE prime mover. It makes him involved.

MLK's killing is hardly "local". My God. Just read ony book on the subject.

RFK was going to delve into the murder of his bother as well as end the war in Viet Nam- a war JFK had already ended- and was killed by the same forces that killed his brother. I don't know if the same triggermeen were used. Or if the exact same people who masterminded JFK, but if not, the people to whom the power passed. Not necessarily relatives, but politically connected.
Dawn