Dawn, As we both know, Tosh can be very friendly and helpful....at times; at others refuse to answer direct questions about Dallas or that in any way challenge his version of events [such as with the contradictions in his and January's version]. We both met that same 'stone wall' on Red Bird on that..... I've put it too him a few times and even sent the January portion of Smith's book to him....all were met with silence - eerie silence. I also sent him the version of an exfiltration by plane as per the Douglass book - that too was met without a response. On other issues he answers questions and even provides new information and proofs. I'm not going to post here why or what I think is going on in this. Suffice it to say, there are many possible reasons - more than most would assume. I have my own firm opinions on it, but I've not even told them to Tosh, so don't want to put them here either. He is actively finishing up a book on his life, but according to him will contain on a very limited part dealing with Dallas - and I expect nothing new from what I heard long ago; Vernon heard after; then Dankbaar; and most know - or can search on internet for it all [although several of the best things Tosh took down....[but I have them all saved on computer or my notes and interviews]. Many discount Tosh completely and I think that is a big mistake! Most of his life and adventures 'check out', even if doubts and things unproven [or unprovable] remain about Dallas. Would be very interesting to know what he told Kerry under oath about Dallas - but is is classified in a form I've never known to be usually ever declassified. I had long hoped that Jay Harrison's material would shed some answers on Tosh's story, but alas for reason unknown to me Brown took a dislike to me or had someone whisper lies about me - and I have thus far been denied access to that material, which is logically there, as they were long time friends dating from BEFORE 11.22.63! The entire body of stories re: Dallas are much stranger than anyone could imagine or imagine being imagined...and many parts of those are the truth - some others are not, of course. We are making progress, IMHO and only details remain unknown. Some of these details, while interesting to those of us addicted to all this, are lost to the general public and don't change the general nature of the events, its initiators and its results and coverup [both of which are felt every day - and will be until this matter is exposed fully to the satisfaction of the Public].
"Let me issue and control a nation's money and I care not who writes the laws. - Mayer Rothschild
"Civil disobedience is not our problem. Our problem is civil obedience! People are obedient in the face of poverty, starvation, stupidity, war, and cruelty. Our problem is that grand thieves are running the country. That's our problem!" - Howard Zinn
"If there is no struggle there is no progress. Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and never will" - Frederick Douglass
Phil Dragoo Wrote:In Douglass, the Wayne January story appears on pages 371-3, and in note 874 on page 483.
The Robert G. Vinson story appears on pages 298-304, and in notes 490-500 on pages 462-3.
January deals with a C-47, a twin-engine plane; Vinson, a C-54, a four-engine plane. January at Redbird Airport; Vinson, Andrews to Trinity River to Roswell.
Two separate men, planes, incidents.
Here is a 6/4/92 interview Tosh Plumlee gave in Dallas:
Another story with legs, or wings, is that of David Ferrie. Immediately after searching for information about his library card and finding none, Ferrie made a phone call to Houston to reserve a room at the Alamotel, a Carlos Marcello owned motel.
When asked why he took the trip to Houston, Ferrie told federal authorities that he and two male companions drove all night on November 22, 1963, 350 miles, through a fierce thunderstorm to Houston to go goose hunting in Texas. He also claimed the trip was designed to gather information on how to run an ice skating rink, a business he wished to open in New Orleans. On the 23rd of November Ferrie visited the Winterland Skating Rink, managed by Chuck Rolland. Rolland told authorities he never spoke to Ferrie about the skating rink business. All Ferrie did, said Rolland, was make and receive phone calls for hours at a pay phone.
Phil: You post the most amazing things. Just say the word or name and you are on it. It is always such a joy to read you.:dancingman:
Peter Lemkin Wrote:Dawn, As we both know, Tosh can be very friendly and helpful....at times; at others refuse to answer direct questions about Dallas or that in any way challenge his version of events [such as with the contradictions in his and January's version]. We both met that same 'stone wall' on Red Bird on that..... I've put it too him a few times and even sent the January portion of Smith's book to him....all were met with silence - eerie silence. I also sent him the version of an exfiltration by plane as per the Douglass book - that too was met without a response. On other issues he answers questions and even provides new information and proofs. I'm not going to post here why or what I think is going on in this. Suffice it to say, there are many possible reasons - more than most would assume. I have my own firm opinions on it, but I've not even told them to Tosh, so don't want to put them here either. He is actively finishing up a book on his life, but according to him will contain on a very limited part dealing with Dallas - and I expect nothing new from what I heard long ago; Vernon heard after; then Dankbaar; and most know - or can search on internet for it all [although several of the best things Tosh took down....[but I have them all saved on computer or my notes and interviews]. Many discount Tosh completely and I think that is a big mistake! Most of his life and adventures 'check out', even if doubts and things unproven [or unprovable] remain about Dallas. Would be very interesting to know what he told Kerry under oath about Dallas - but is is classified in a form I've never known to be usually ever declassified. I had long hoped that Jay Harrison's material would shed some answers on Tosh's story, but alas for reason unknown to me Brown took a dislike to me or had someone whisper lies about me - and I have thus far been denied access to that material, which is logically there, as they were long time friends dating from BEFORE 11.22.63! The entire body of stories re: Dallas are much stranger than anyone could imagine or imagine being imagined...and many parts of those are the truth - some others are not, of course. We are making progress, IMHO and only details remain unknown. Some of these details, while interesting to those of us addicted to all this, are lost to the general public and don't change the general nature of the events, its initiators and its results and coverup [both of which are felt every day - and will be until this matter is exposed fully to the satisfaction of the Public].
Peter: I agree with what you have written here except the Walt Brown part. Having been very close to Jay the last seven years of his life we had tons of contact but I never looked into his files. Only on his deathbed did he give me one thing, and it is all dates, names, a chronology that would not mean anything to anyone but Jay and myself (and two other people I won't name here). A researcher looking into Mac Wallace who died under the usual circumstances, his manuscript gone, he and J were to meet that very day in Dallas. It was Jay's dying wish that this work be continued. So when Joan Mellen told me how crazy J's files were I totally understood. Too cryptic to be of use. It literally drove JOan nuts. (But that is another story that I don't want to put into writing.)
Let's just say for the record she is going down the wrong path and her work on J will not reflect HIM. (I will email you privately). To see any of Jay's stuff you would need to do what Joan did: arrive in a big auto and load up...I know you cannot do that and if you were to come to the US and mend fences with Walt I think he would share, as he did with Joan. I thought for years he was deep sixing them. Sure seemed that way, but now after countless hours on the phone with Joan I get it. I was wrong about him and I was too in the middle to be objective during the dust up with J and Richard Bartholomew. So Walt seemed like the person who caused it all. But it was very complex and Jay demanded TOTAL secrecy while alive. Then demanded it for Nathan Darby at the press conf. in Dallas 1998. So it was not Walt but J calling those shots. (I am sure John Kelin remembers the rest).
Ok back to work but I felt I needed to say this AGAIN. I hope you will accept it this time. I also recall that Tosh publicly, on these pages, demanded that you leave Walt alone and that Tosh instructed Walt not to pass on any files on him to you. I was astounded when I read that.
End of story...For now...
Dawn
by SA ERNEST WALL and SA L. M. SHEARER at New Orleans
FERRIE claimed they arrived in Houston between 4:30 amd 5:30 AM and went directly to the Alamotel located on South Main Steet, six to ten blocks south of the Shamrock Hilton Hotel, where they checked into Room 19. He stated that the three of them registered on the same card at the motel. After registering they retired for the night.
Note: The Shamrock Hotel was built at the intersection of South Main and then-Bellaire Boulevard (after 1963, Holcombe Boulevard).
Reference is made to an Alamotel Courts 8700 South Main with this history:
8700 S. Main St. Houston TX (original built pre-1942, demolished/rebuilt between 1966-1973 and demolished 2005/2006; also known as Ramada Inn Domed Stadium, Domed Stadium Inn, Hospitality Inn)
Thanks Mr Dragoo, as usual great information. There must have been something similar on OST, besides the Alamo Plaza. But, the distance reference from the Shamrock Hotel is close, and it was near the 7000 block of Main @ Holcombe, SW corner. Looking at the picture, I now wonder if the Alamotel was ever AKA the White House Motel. During the 70s, there were rumors about the White House Motel owners being from "out of town". And, as Old Spanish Trail (US Hwy 90A) intersects and ends at the 8200 block of S Main, US Hwy 90A then overlaps S Main going west/southwest. And, 8700 S Main is @ McNee, with the amusement park/AKA Playland Park in those days being located at 9201 S Main @ Murworth, southeast corner. All different now, in the early morning shadows of Reliant Stadium and near practice fields and parking lots.
Note: the Executive Airport near the Country Club safehouse was named Red Bird and on Red Bird Dr. in 1963.
"Let me issue and control a nation's money and I care not who writes the laws. - Mayer Rothschild
"Civil disobedience is not our problem. Our problem is civil obedience! People are obedient in the face of poverty, starvation, stupidity, war, and cruelty. Our problem is that grand thieves are running the country. That's our problem!" - Howard Zinn
"If there is no struggle there is no progress. Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and never will" - Frederick Douglass
