Can't find diagram of shots to jfk from conspiracy point of view?

[Drew Phipps]

Funny!

[Drew Phipps]

density of "sandstone" (similar to sand?) is 2200- 2800 kg/m3. So I guess sandstone might be 15%-40% more dense than bone. The sedimentary part of sandstone (the sand) is at the lower end of that spectrum, the igneous (lava) part of sandstone the upper end.

I still think that the bright dots are far more likely to be metallic bits than sand.

[Drew Phipps]

Found a study of frog bones that suggest frog bones are significantly less dense than human bones, (on the order of 623 kg/m3, as opposed to human 1090 kg/m3). abstract here: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/art...3810004354

Frogs must be pretty fragile.

But I liked the picture anyhow.

[Bob Prudhomme]

I thought it was cute. The story that went with it was funny, too.

http://www.frogforum.net/budgetts-frogs/...ravel.html

[William Charleston]

Seems very unlikely to me that a separate bullet that transited merely the wrist would impart more of a momentum change in Conally's torso than even a whole bullet thru the chest could have possibly imparted. What you are trying to suggest sounds like handball players who are knocked backwards while playing because of the contact between the hand and the ball.

How does one explain Connolly's reaction Z 230 -240. He as turned from looking right, to facing forward as he himself has said, and then his shoulder is driven down, he lurches back to his right again, and begins to double up. His mouth opens, his cheeks puff, and his hair flies up. Looks a lot like someone being shot in the back to me.

Explaining John Connally's reaction after Z224:

John Connally makes two very significant movements EXACTLY WHEN other credible evidence shows both movements were reactions to a gunshot:

4.8 seconds BEFORE JFK is shot in the head: John Connally's lapel on his jacket jumps out and he begins to throw up his arms, he then snaps his head to the left. After his head snap to the left, he then begins to turn to look over his right shoulder (Connally himself only describes the turn to look to his right as his first reaction).

Why did Connally first snap his head to the left when he thought the sound he heard (a shot) came from behind toward his right? And how could he move SO QUICKLY if he had an serious exit wound in his chest the size of a baseball?

ANSWER: John Connally received a minor wound in his left thigh EXACTLY when other credible evidence shows a shot was fired. The wound to his left thigh according to the description by Dr. Shaw was a trivial wound caused by a bullet fragment (NOT A BULLET). You have been told by the US gov't and others that the bullet (CE399) lodged in the left thigh and then was found on a stretcher at Parkland. But the orderly who found CE399 at Parkland who took Connally's stretcher off the elevator says the stretcher where he found the bullet was NOT Connally's stretcher. The Warren Commission decided that the orderly was mistaken and they did NOT believe him.

To tie the bullet to the rifle in the TSBD, the conspirators were smart enough to not leave more metal jacket bullets in the limo than were fired. CE399 was definitely fired from the rifle that was in the TSBD (ballistics matched by experts to the rifle) but few think it could have caused all the wounds it caused with it being so close to pristine. In other words, the bullet fired at Z224 was not a metal jacket military round and CE 399 was planted at Parkland to give definitive evidence that they had the right rifle. But many things went wrong which is why five decades later you want to know what really happened.

You can argue CE399 had some damage, it was not pristine.

You can argue that CE399 did not transfer any momentum to Connally's body even though John Connally in every interview he ever gave (that I have seen) said the force of the bullet to his back bent him over. And then he goes on to say that he could see he was IMMEDIATELY COVERED IN BLOOD.

You can argue that millions listened to the Warren Commission's explanations and they didn't think that John Connally was wounded twice, once 4.8 seconds BEFORE and 0.7 seconds AFTER JFK was shot in the head. But the millions who believed the government's explanations for what happened never knew that a recording captured the sounds of shots that two teams of experts said were caused by gunfire.

You probably know that a team of "scientists" from the National Academy of Scientists said that they proved the acoustical evidence is invalid because cross talk proved the shot like echo patterns. BUT it depends on which instance of cross talk you pick. A cross talk different than the National Academy of Scientists picked showed the shot like sounds on the recording were fired at the right time for the shots to be valid. And here is the point of much of my babbling: The National Academy of Scientists wanted to find a reason to say the recording did not record the sounds of the shots. The higher the education level, the more likely you are to believe the US government's explanation.

But here is a series of problems:

If CE399 lodged in Connally's left thigh, it would have lost ALL of it's kinetic energy and therefore all of it's momentum would have been transferred to Connally's body. That would have bent him over. We don't see him bent over until Z325, 0.7 seconds AFTER JFK's head shot.

You probably don't understand echo correlation analysis but basically the acoustics experts had a series of microphone going down the parade path. For the acoustical echo pattern to match the actual recording of the sounds of shots, they had to fire a shot from the place the actual shot was fired from (close to) and they had to have a microphone close to where the motorcycle was located.

1. When they did that, they found the most probable microphones indicated the motorcycle traveled at about 10 mph (approx. same as limo).

2. The most probable microphone (best match) went around the corner just like the limo and motorcycle did

3. The acoustical pattern for each shot recorded for the test shots matched the actual shot echo pattern on the Dallas police radio recording.

ETC

In other words, if the Dallas police recording did record the sounds of the shots, then these three things would be true and they are. But also, I have shown in another place that to explain all of the wounds received by the three men that were wounded, there had to have been more than three shots AND the shots would have to reasonably match the Zapruder film sequence. What we see in the Z film has been changed to hide the massive wound in the back of JFK's head but the forgers did not significantly change the timing of the movements. THEY COULDN'T, it was 1960's film technology and they could only change some things they could not make massive changes to hide everything like the BACK AND TO THE LEFT OF JFK.

There are many things more you need to know before you can do a statistical calculation that proves the US government lied but it should start to line up so that you can begin to join me in laughing at the conspirator's positions. If you want to start to refute this, show me any frame with blood on the front of Connally's shirt before Z325. You cannot find blood on Connally's shirt because Connally was not shot in the back until 0.7 seconds AFTER JFK was shot in the head. It should make more sense now WHY the Z film was locked up until it was shown on TV in 1975 for the first time.




The NON-History Channel in November had a show which showed a poll that 89% of Americans are convinced we will never know the full truth. One of the commenters said, AND WORSE THAN THAT, IF WE EVER SEE THE TRUTH, WE WON'T BELIEVE IT."

I am no longer surprised that people actually believe that a bullet hitting a person does not transfer momentum to the target. I am no longer surprised that people cling to and defend a lie that is so obviously transparent that it is laughable. If it wasn't so serious, I would be laughing. The importance of YOU knowing the truth is simple: A free society cannot survive if a government has the ability to tell any lie to the public it wants because the presstitutes think it is their job to explain the US government's positions. The presstitutes REPEAT, they do not investigate.

[Bob Prudhomme]

William

If it was a fragment lodging itself in Connally's left thigh at z224, where did this fragment originate?

[Gordon Gray]

Any reasonably objective person viewing the Z film would describe Connolly as angled slightly to his right looking toward his right front in the direction of the UM at Z 224. Between 224 and 230 he turns to face forward his hat in his right hand at the level of his shoulder. He continues facing in this direction until about frames 234-235 when he appears to start reacting to being hit in the back. He then turns back toward his right again, his right shoulder dropping sharply, his torso leaning forward and his face showing the reaction to being hit, between frames 235 and 240. At no time would one describe his head as jerking sharply to his left or his arms flying up. Nor could the movement of his lapel have anything to do with a bullet passing through him at that moment, IMO. His actions appear to be exactly as he has described them. JFK is clearly hit prior to frame 224 and Connolly sometime between frame 230-235 at a time when his wrist was not in a position to be hit from a bullet passing out from under his right nipple.

[Bob Prudhomme]

Any reasonably objective person viewing the Z film would describe Connolly as angled slightly to his right looking toward his right front in the direction of the UM at Z 224. Between 224 and 230 he turns to face forward his hat in his right hand at the level of his shoulder. He continues facing in this direction until about frames 234-235 when he appears to start reacting to being hit in the back. He then turns back toward his right again, his right shoulder dropping sharply, his torso leaning forward and his face showing the reaction to being hit, between frames 235 and 240. At no time would one describe his head as jerking sharply to his left or his arms flying up. Nor could the movement of his lapel have anything to do with a bullet passing through him at that moment, IMO. His actions appear to be exactly as he has described them. JFK is clearly hit prior to frame 224 and Connolly sometime between frame 230-235 at a time when his wrist was not in a position to be hit from a bullet passing out from under his right nipple.

Gordon

Good observations. William does make a good point, though, about there being a lack of blood on JBC's white shirt post-z230 in the Zapruder film. JBC observed that he was covered in blood almost immediately following the back shot. To me, this begs the question, was JBC shot in the back at z230 or in the wrist?

[Drew Phipps]

William: You probably shouldn't base a significant leg of a conspiracy theory on the premise that "CE 399 was planted at Parkland." There are serious questions about the stretcher bullet's origin, chain of custody, and even its' shape. The single most important fact to remember about CE 399 is that the first four people to allegedly handle it could not or would not subsequently agree that CE 399 was the stretcher bullet.

It is far more likely that CE 399 was never in Dallas at all, but originated at the FBI shooting range.

It is unlikely that any whole bullet went into Connally's thigh. The wound is described by treating doctors as being caused by a bullet fragment.

The position of the microphone in 1978 doesn't answer my question. The problem with the acoustic evidence, beyond the other Trade Mart noises, Sheriff Decker's voice, and sirens on the tape, is that no police officer (especially H.B. McClain, the officer with the "stuck mike") in 1963 was at the proper position to record it at that time. The Dorman, Couch and Wegner films are pictures of his position, far to the rear of where the sounds could have been recorded. If you have done a serious study of this aspect of the case, you also know that H.B. McClain (AFTER listening to the recording) denied that that recording originated from his motorcycle.

[Drew Phipps]

Bob: There is considerable blood on Connally's shirt in the front (now at least). Despite what Connally says about "immediately", it will take some amount of time for blood to soak through a shirt or then to spread laterally along a shirt, especially if the direction is some direction other than down. (I am supposing that a man's coat (tailored?) would normally cover the nipple area, and the blood would have to move laterally to be seen from underneath the coat.)

You can observe this phenomenon at home, or in paper towel commercials, but please, don't shed any blood for this experiment.